Lucy Letby Case #67

[stardust21]

This case has genuinely solidified my belief that there shouldn’t be a death penalty.
Imagine knowing that at 33, with probably 50 more years of life left, you’re never ever going to be able to make a life decision…

Never going to be able to pop to the shops, or bake some biscuits. Never going to be able to go on holiday. Never going to see your friends weddings or go to your parents funerals. The list goes on.

That’s on top of the terror she will constantly feel with people wanting to get at her because of her crimes.

To me that’s a far better punishment then just killing someone. Why should they get an easy out? I think the mental anguish that you’re going to have to live that life for the majority of your life would be far worse then knowing you’re going to get a lethal injection. And good.

 

[jackolantern]

This case has genuinely solidified my belief that there shouldn’t be a death penalty.
Imagine knowing that at 33, with probably 50 more years of life left, you’re never ever going to be able to make a life decision…

Never going to be able to pop to the shops, or bake some biscuits. Never going to be able to go on holiday. Never going to see your friends weddings or go to your parents funerals. The list goes on.

That’s on top of the terror she will constantly feel with people wanting to get at her because of her crimes.

To me that’s a far better punishment then just killing someone. Why should they get an easy out? I think the mental anguish that you’re going to have to live that life for the majority of your life would be far worse then knowing you’re going to get a lethal injection. And good.

She’ll never hear the birds sing without a chorus of background noise
She’ll never feel her feet in the sand or the sea
She’ll never see a rainbow or walk through a forest
She’ll never have a holiday or look forward to an event with friends and family
She’ll never choose and cook a delicious meal to relax with a spouse while cuddling watching a movie
She’ll never have her own family
She’ll never have a bubble bath with candles
She’ll never choose her own music and sing to her hearts content
She’ll never bake a cake and sit and decorate it just because
She’ll never have a picnic in the sun with her friends and a good book

I could go on forever. But the most important thing is -

She’ll not live a day of her life without serious mental anguish and suffering knowing all this. That’s a far better punishment than death ever could be.

 

[Tofino]

What can be normal behavior for most of us can be sinister behavior to a serial killer even if it’s exactly the same behaviour.

Many of us facebook stalk people we know or have met. Facebook stalking the parents of the babies you’ve murdered or attempted to murder is sinister and sick as fuck. Struggle to understand why some people can’t see the difference in other situations too.

 

[KatieMorag]

I had a reasonable amount of empathy for LL's parents at first because I know someone whose child ended up in jail. It broke her into a million pieces. So I understand that families are victims in a sense too, who get dragged into the horrendous fallout of their loved one's crimes and their lives blown up just for loving someone. BUT... the more I hear about how LL's parents in this case have conducted themselves, the more disgusted I am, and the more it sounds likes LL's personality is a lot like them. The arrogance, sense of superiority, lack of empathy for the victims, self-centred behaviour etc.

Re the posts about jail life being cushy... there's no life that could make the loss of freedom ok for me. Imagine knowing you'll never see the sea again? Feel sand between your toes (or maybe even grass)? Paddle in fresh water? Climb to the top of a hill and see the landscape stretched out in front of you. Never, ever be completely alone again. Never wander down a high street and go into any shop that takes your fancy. Never leave the country, nor go on an airplane, boat, train or probably even car again. Never cuddle up with your own pet in your lap and watch whatever you want on tv, alone. Never go to a market, a swimming pool, a cafe, a restaurant, a concert. Never see a snowy landscape.... oh just so, so many things. Even the best version of prison life is just an existence. A very, very, small and insignificant existence.

 

[Tofino]

We trusted Lucy Letby so much we wanted her to be our baby's godmother

EXCLUSIVE: The couple now suspect that their boy was attacked by Letby, who picked him out as one of her favourites, even getting angry with other nurses when she wasn't allocated him to care for.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Another one

what the actual fuck…

Letby also sent the tot's mother a handmade Mother's Day card with a polaroid photograph she had taken of their baby inside the incubator. Even though he was still requiring 24-hour oxygen, the image showed their son with no mask or oxygen tubes over his face. When the concerned parents queried this Letby dismissed their fears saying: 'I just thought you would like a picture of him with no tubes.

 

[MmmB777]

@slingo16 no I don’t. And if I did it wouldn’t be putrid with cartoon dogs on it.
Just use my phone, Alexa reminders and this

 

[daisynoon]

The impact statements are here in full for anyone who wants to read them:

Read devastating accounts of Letby victims’ families after she refused to hear them

Warning; distressing content: Parents of babies whom Lucy Letby murdered or attempted to kill spoke of their grief in emotional victim impact statements at her sentencing hearing

www.independent.co.uk

These are so hard to read, but thinking about Letby reading them (and I bet she will after the report about her pouring over the medical evidence in her cell), and I appreciate this from the mother of E&F. I know this is one of the parts we already had, but I think it'll get to Letby.

 

[Deeznutslol]

Just dropping in to reveal the identity of the reddit “scientist” who, along with Gill, tried to influence the jury during the case has now been reported by the media:

Lucy Letby trial was ‘greatest miscarriage of justice UK has ever wit…

archived 23 Aug 2023 18:32:18 UTC

archive.ph

And also to show you how she was found to have battered her husband by a Californian court and judged legally incompetent.

https://www.courts.ca.gov/opinions/nonpub/A162112.PDF

I’ve been sat on this for so long, but here it is.

 

[F1Grid]

The whole thing smacks of NHS HR.

1. Grievance procedure being run by a director of nursing who is out for coffee and socialising with the person who's raised the grievance.
2. CEO of the trust delivers the grievance outcome, meaning there's nobody that the consultants are actually able to appeal it to.
3. Medical director brings in external organisations who tell him repeatedly to order a specific investigation. And he doesn't.

Imagine this shit in a private company with a competent HR department And when it's concerning fucking babies dying in someone's care no less.

 

[Tofino]

Lisa if you are reading here, I love you!!!

 

[MmmB777]

The podcast mentions Letby didn’t want the female officer (Danielle Stonier) that did her police interview to be the one that read out her answers from the interviews to the court. She has some nerve - again that’s not someone that’s shy and meek, it’s a control freak that still thinks they’re superior despite being on trial for multiple baby murders.
Glad she didn’t get her own way. Hope it was torture for her

 

[Tofino]

Last thread here - https://tattle.life/threads/lucy-letby-case-66-guilty.41209/

There is an extensive wiki (top right pink button also link here https://tattle.life/wiki/lucy-letby-case/ ) collating 10 months worth of trial reports organised into sections. Often the answers to your questions can be found here, so please use as much as you can otherwise the threads fill up very quickly with the same questions being asked. Thank you!

 

[buttheyneverblindme8]

12 more cases being investigated by police apparently

Lucy Letby detectives find evidence of 'malevolence' in 12 more cases

Letby, 33 (pictured), was jailed for life on Monday after being found guilty of murdering seven babies and attempting to murder six others - but police are examining the records of 4,000 other babies.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I figured this would be the case.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: to kill or injure 13 babies in the space of a year (some within days of one another) is proof, to me at least, that Letby was doing this her entire career. This is not the work of a first-time or accidental killer who got more and more brazen the longer they went unpunished - but the work of an experienced killer/harmer of babies, who knew exactly what they were doing.

I'm genuinely serious when I say that every baby - alive or dead - on every shift Letby ever worked at any hospital she ever worked at should be looked at. Go right back to her training days, to the very first baby she ever laid eyes on.

There'll be more in there somewhere.

 

[gimmethattea]

New article from Dan

Lucy Letby: Parents accuse ex-hospital boss of 'total fob off'

Former medical director Ian Harvey has been accused of a "shameful" failure to address their concerns.

www.bbc.co.uk

In a statement issued to the BBC, Mr Harvey said:

"Having read the heart-rending victim impact statements, I know how desperate the parents are for answers and I will help them as best I can at the public inquiry.

"I'm sorry they felt fobbed off. I wanted to give detailed and accurate answers, but this was difficult while the reviews and investigations were taking place.

"Once the police were involved, we were advised by them not to say or do anything that might jeopardise their investigation.

"I was told all communication had to go through the police and not come from the hospital. I apologise for not communicating that clearly enough at the time."

According to reports, Mr Harvey was referred to the General Medical Council (GMC) in 2018 following allegations he "misled the public in media statements", encouraged "an atmosphere of secrecy and fear" and failed to act "appropriately or in a timely manner" when consultants raised concerns.

Anthony Omo, director of fitness to practise and general counsel at the GMC, said: "In 2018 we received a complaint about Ian Harvey which we promoted for a full investigation.

"During our investigation, we liaised with the police, obtained an independent expert report and a witness statement, and thoroughly examined all relevant information.

"At the conclusion of our investigation, our senior decision makers considered all of the evidence and decided that the case did not reach the threshold for referral to the Medical Practitioners Tribunal Service for a hearing."

Ian Harvey is one piece of scum.

Saw this article on Reddit

Revealed: NHS bosses of the Countess of Chester Hospital

The bosses at a hospital where killer nurse Lucy Letby was free to murder and attack newborn babies can today be revealed.

www.dailymail.co.uk

A source told the Mail: 'Harvey retired very quickly in 2018. After Letby's arrest he cancelled his General Medical Council subscription and went to the South of France.'

Another former employee added: 'Around the time he retired, I asked Harvey whether he thought there could be a public inquiry into what had happened and his words were, "They would have to find me first", which bothered me.

This alone should prove that the inquiry should be statutory. He should be dragged back from France to answer these questions.

 

[Eirawen]

I jump every time Dan tweets now!
Does anyone else think there are more Letbys out there, not particularly targeting babies but some other vulnerable people.
Apart from managers listening to consultant, what other changes can be made to make sure this never happens again.
The way she was able to kill them without too much effort to be honest scares the shit out of me.
Only thing I can think of is deaths in hospital should be more closely monitored but that would take resources which the NHS doesn’t have. for example if one of that babies had collapsed and died at home there would be a lot more effort put in to find out what happened, but in hospital a lot of the babies didn’t even get a post Morton.

I work for the NHS and although the majority of nurses are great there are a few that I honestly wonder why they went into the nursing profession they seem to hate people and before I am slaughtered they are in a minority, one was sacked as she posted pictures of herself doing stuff with a dildo in a cupboard, so its good riddance to her.

 

[MmmB777]

I see a lot of discussion around the diaries and handover notes and I just wanted to put a bit of information out there. Nurses have to revalidate every 3 years, which means they have to prove worked hours and further study. Another element of revalidation is that we have to write a minimum of 5 reflections. These reflections are about incidents in the ward environment that could have been handled better, learning opportunities that arose from those incidents, and how we could have improved our own performance in those moments. So a lot of nurses do keep diaries at home without identifying factors for the purpose of writing those required reflections when the time comes for revalidation. Secondly, the term handover notes; in some hospital wards, there are pre-printed blank handover sheets that you take and fill out during handover with relevant information. Most nurses fold these up and put them in their pockets for quick reference during a shift, or add to them in order to remember information to hand over to the next team. I bet if I went into my car now, there's one or two from months/years past under the seats. I know for a fact as I sit here typing this, yesterdays is currently sitting on my bed, where I emptied the pockets this morning to wash my uniforms for my next set of shifts. Again, it's not that unusual to find nurses (especially un-tidy ones) hoarding handover notes, especially if they want to transfer information into their reflective diary for revalidation. Now sheets of written notes taken directly from patient notes are an *entirely* different ballgame.

Perhaps you should nip out now and have a clear out then? Hope there aren’t 257 that you’ve moved to three different properties with you!

 

[starshine89]

Hang on a minute, we have previously been missing some detail and now that article says Letby was suspended for two years, and it was after that Karen met her for coffee . So when did they suspend her, when they went to the police (May 2017) or after her first arrest (July 2018)?

This makes me think she’s saying she kept meeting her for coffee after her first arrest, whilst she was on bail until her third arrest when she was charged, as that was a two year period! I think that’s worse than the leaving party prior to arrest.

how does a junior band 5 nurse get so pally with those so high up top it’s mad.

I’m a band 7 nurse and the top managers like Karen Rees etc equivalents wouldn’t even know my name let alone go out for coffee or attend leaving drinks I can’t get my head around it

 

[SkiesOfBlue]

Nursed for 30 years from 1988
Even as a student nurse there were some very strange characters attracted to Nursing.

My Mum is a nurse and trained in London during the 1970s. As did all of my aunts and grand-aunts. They're training was like something akin to the army and at that time there were no nursing assistants per se, these hardworking nurses did everything, they're medical training was second to none and they worked hard.

What struck me about LL (besides from being a thunderous, cruel murderous bitch) was the amount of time she spent on her phone while supposed to be looking after HIGHLY DEPENDENT babies. It was brought up time and again at trial and gave examples of she was claiming to feed babies (a two-handed job) while sending incessant Whatsapp messages throughout her shift. I'm genuinely curious as to whether this is a thing? I'm not being anti-nurse here, for the most part they are kind and their decision to pursue a nursing career is vocational, but is this what nursing care is like these days? I'm curious because for my Mum's generation you'd have been kicked out for not being fully engaged throughout your shift.

 

[Futtrit]

FFS searching ‘Mason’ didn’t bring up anyone who wrote ‘masons’

I do believe you were first to suggest!

Lucyxxxx not that psychic after all

Lucy currently

 

[stardust21]

This is spot on. And denial is one of the most common defense mechanisms there is and is a normal psychological process. So colleagues who may not have been as close to her (although in all honesty, I doubt anyone was really truly close to her and the lack of any real intimacy in her life suggest she may not have been capable) may find it easier to comprehend and accept what she has done, for others, it may take substantially longer. So I agree with you in having some sympathy for them as it's genuinely something that can't be helped in some instances, irrespective of 14 WLOs.

I think I maybe approach this from a different position to most. I knew someone who was the victim of a horrific crime. I don’t want to dox myself by giving away too much, but I knew the victim in a close work capacity, she was lovely, vibrant and funny. She didn’t deserve what happened to her and I think about her a lot.

Seeing her face on the news left me shaken, despite having not worked with her in some years. You just do not expect people you know to be involved in these horrific crimes. We all know these things happen, but usually it’s far enough detached from your reality that you can compute it. When it involves someone you actually know that changes.

For me it’s totally changed how I view the news and I get pretty angry when I see invasive reporting into victims now. I turned off BBC news alerts because of how many they send about things that are really none of our business… It also lead me to be a lot more vigilant, because I know these horrific crimes happen to people just like me… and I say all this as someone who worked with someone who became a victim some years after I worked with them.

Obviously they are not victims in the same way as the actual victims, and please don’t think I say any of this to minimise them because I really really don’t mean this like that.

But LL has left other victims behind too. There will be nurses who were meant to be looking after the babies she attacked questions their skills and abilities because they left them vulnerable to the attacks. People who knew her who will question their perception of reality and their faith and trust in people because they will struggle to understand how they didn’t spot it. There will be people who trained with her who will second guess their perception, people who assessed her on empathy who will definitely question themselves… She will have changed the lives of so so many people around her in both small and large ways. Crimes like this have waves and ripple effects. I do not blame any of these people for struggling to come to terms with it at the moment.