Elle Florence #5 Granny Aesthetics, balancing unemployment and the art of scamming

[Katrina_AK_0099]

Discussing Elle's career prospects is meaningless at this point. She's a total joke. There's no justification for being unemployed for 18 months when you are a highly-educated, healthy young person with no responsibilities. Pure laziness and an enabling mother.

I really figured that by this point she'd be moving forward with a job. Doesn't she get bored? She's living such a sad little existence.

Even the Karens are losing interest in Eleanore Lecocq. Only 8,000 views on the latest luxury handbag unboxing, when back in the day a video like that would easily be at 20,000.

 

[202leda]

Curious what the issue with immigrating to Scandinavia is. Not that I am thinking of doing it (have also never been), but am jealous of people from those countries just because on paper they look so good!

So, I am just relaying what my friend (who’s gorgeous, I might add, sandy brown hair and green eyes) has told me as she lived in Denmark for a few years with her then-boyfriend (Dane). She said for all the years she’s lived there she found the people to be very cold and xenophobic, even her own neighbors. She also thought they were “weird” (her words, not mine).

Anyway after she broke up with him, she couldn’t wait to go back to the UK which is where she lived prior to moving with him.

 

[Julianotreally]

I just want to point out that Elle’s entire undergraduate law degree plus her university of Toronto masters was the length of a normal undergraduate degree here in Canada/US (four years). All the lawyers I know did four years of undergrad plus three years of law school before being called to the bar. She also does not have a JD, by far the preferred and usual degree for lawyers here in North America.

She took a super easy way out to become a lawyer by Canadian/American standards. If she was planning to practice in Canada, there is no good reason for her to get a foreign law degree when most employers here prefer undergrad degree + JD but Elle probably went to Durham for cheap because she has EU citizenship through Ginette and four years of schooling in total is of course much easier than 7. For the masters program she went to, she didn’t even have to do the LSAT! She might be a lawyer on technicality but I doubt many actually lawyers here respect the path she took. She is not comparable to those who grew up abroad, did their degree there, came to North America and choose to legitimize their degree here to continue their practice. Those people usually come here with years of relevant experience and it makes sense for them to do whatever kind of law degree was offered in their home country. Elle took a easy way into law school because many people don’t even get in to law school here in Canada/US if they don’t have a good undergraduate GPA plus LSAT score but Elle doesn’t seem to have even done the LSAT. I suspect that Elle wasn’t confident she could get into law school here (if you don’t, then you pretty much did four years of undergrad in whatever subject you studied but you can’t become a lawyer at all) and found a loophole in the European system (straight into law school after high school). Fake and lazy at best. Eleanor Florence is a lazy fraud.

Long time lurker here, on both GG and this forum. The discussion on JD vs. LL.B. is pointless. They are the same. The recent migration in the name of the degree is entirely driven by a desire to appear more "americanized" (please see articles in McLeans and the CBA journal). Back in my days, Queens, McGill and U of T issued LL.B. Now, they issue JD. The fact is, in Commonwealth countries, that is how a law school degree was called. You earn an LL.B., you can take the bar exam. I earned a LL.B. in Canada. I passed the bar in my province. I articled ( at McT, same as Elle but not in Vancouver - more to come on this later) and was received to practice. While I was working as in house-counsel and doing lots of business in the PNW (after having done 3 years at McT), I was offered a job as an associate in Seattle, in a regional law firm. I considered it seriously - I loved the city. When I asked about taking the bar, they laughed at me. It was nor required to work at the firm until, if and when I wanted to make partner. If if came to that, Washington has a program for you to learn with a seasoned lawyer. They wanted me to do all the immigration work by myself and offered no support. My point with all this is that Elle doesn't need to take the bar. The fact is, she doesn't have any valuable experience. She never practiced.

 

[svdwoodsen]

So, I am just relaying what my friend (who’s gorgeous, I might add, sandy brown hair and green eyes) has told me as she lived in Denmark for a few years with her then-boyfriend (Dane). She said for all the years she’s lived there she found the people to be very cold and xenophobic, even her own neighbors. She also thought they were “weird” (her words, not mine).

Anyway after she broke up with him, she couldn’t wait to go back to the UK which is where she lived prior to moving with him.

My brief experiences there have been different (I've never lived there for the long term though, and I do have family there and was mostly in Copenhagen so it might be a big city vs everywhere else thing) but I sort of get where your friend is coming from. I'm not sure I'd use the word xenophobic but it is harder to get to know people and make friends than it is in North America. People have their childhood friends and it's very hard to break in as an outsider, particularly if you're not Danish. I've also heard that Eastern Europeans are not liked or treated well (you mentioned your friend is Polish) across Scandinavia.

All that being said, a guy friend of mine who is African American lived in Copenhagen for a few years and absolutely LOVED it. Granted, he is tall, handsome, smart, and a gentleman so that's probably a big part of it but girls loved him and everyone was super interested in his life back in the States and thought he was really cool. Americans in my experience are usually well liked.

 

[202leda]

My brief experiences there have been different (I've never lived there for the long term though, and I do have family there and was mostly in Copenhagen so it might be a big city vs everywhere else thing) but I sort of get where your friend is coming from. I'm not sure I'd use the word xenophobic but it is harder to get to know people and make friends than it is in North America. People have their childhood friends and it's very hard to break in as an outsider, particularly if you're not Danish. I've also heard that Eastern Europeans are not liked or treated well (you mentioned your friend is Polish) across Scandinavia.

All that being said, a guy friend of mine who is African American lived in Copenhagen for a few years and absolutely LOVED it. Granted, he is tall, handsome, smart, and a gentleman so that's probably a big part of it but girls loved him and everyone was super interested in his life back in the States and thought he was really cool. Americans in my experience are usually well liked.

That’s good to know and thanks for sharing those experiences. Personally I am wary about moving anywhere abroad being both American and brown and regardless of what people say about other countries being more progressive than the US, I still like to err on the side of caution (esp as I’ve been asked where I’m really from from “well meaning” Europeans). I think in general Europeans tend to be very close with their childhood friends (which is extremely rare here), so I suppose that added to the “coldness” my friend experienced.

 

[svdwoodsen]

That’s good to know and thanks for sharing those experiences. Personally I am wary about moving anywhere abroad being both American and brown and regardless of what people say about other countries being more progressive than the US, I still like to err on the side of caution (esp as I’ve been asked where I’m really from from “well meaning” Europeans). I think in general Europeans tend to be very close with their childhood friends (which is extremely rare here), so I suppose that added to the “coldness” my friend experienced.

This is just my experience so take it with a grain of salt, but I do find that racism in America is often more based on perceived race/skin color while discrimination in Europe is more based on country of origin and shared culture. Not saying people aren't racist there if you look different, but I find that usually if you speak the language well, have a good understanding of the local customs, or it's somehow clear to them that you were raised there and embrace the culture, there is a lot more acceptance even if you look different. If you were brown but Danish, they wouldn't have an issue with you or like you less than a white American/Dane.

In America, I think some people feel like perpetual outsiders due to the color of their skin or the way they look, even if their families have been in the U.S. for generations. But I do think North Americans are generally much easier to become friends with. Danes in my experience are tougher to crack but once they are your friend, it tends to be a lifelong friendship.

I don't think you'd have any issues in Canada! We might crack some U.S./Trump jokes at you in a good natured way but that's as far as it'll go. I don't know any Canadians who actually dislike Americans - it's mainly the current administration that people are not fond of.

 

[MUALover]

I think Dickles was a trauma-induced choice after Joe dumped her so suddenly (supposedly out of the blue though it was obvious to us all he had been uncomfortable/unhappy for a while). After everything that messy, short-lived engagement has led to, I doubt Eleanor Florence would settle for a "normal" guy again. She will 100% go back to trying to snag a Chris/Joe or older gentleman who can pay up. That face and lifestyle needs a lot of Benjamins to maintain.

But women get dumped all the time. We have all been there (or most of us have). I mean relationships can only end 3 ways: you dump him, he dumps you or you guys get married. Most of us take time off to grieve and then picks ourselves up and move on. We're not making crazy life decisions - Elle also had Ginette for support. She moved back in with Ginette and they traveled together. Surely that should be enough.

I've known widows whose husbands have died and they only took 2 weeks off work and came right back. Same with people who lost parents. They didn't throw judgement out of the window and make crazy decisions.

Discussing Elle's career prospects is meaningless at this point. She's a total joke. There's no justification for being unemployed for 18 months when you are a highly-educated, healthy young person with no responsibilities. Pure laziness and an enabling mother.

I really figured that by this point she'd be moving forward with a job. Doesn't she get bored? She's living such a sad little existence.

Even the Karens are losing interest in Eleanore Lecocq. Only 8,000 views on the latest luxury handbag unboxing, when back in the day a video like that would easily be at 20,000.

Yes I totally agree. If she were studying for the bar somewheres or doing some courses for GIA or something I would at least understand. But she's just being like Ginette - living the life of leisure off her inherited money. Like mother, like daughter.

 

[svdwoodsen]

But women get dumped all the time. We have all been there (or most of us have). I mean relationships can only end 3 ways: you dump him, he dumps you or you guys get married. Most of us take time off to grieve and then picks ourselves up and move on. We're not making crazy life decisions - Elle also had Ginette for support. She moved back in with Ginette and they traveled together. Surely that should be enough.

I've known widows whose husbands have died and they only took 2 weeks off work and came right back. Same with people who lost parents. They didn't throw judgement out of the window and make crazy decisions.

Of course everyone gets dumped or rejected at some point in their life and I agree that Elle's decision wasn't smart, but I don't think it was all that crazy given Elle's circumstances and priorities.

As you said, she had momma G to fall back on if things didn't work out. She was in an entry level job at the mutual fund for years and didn't seem to mind, so I don't think career development was something she gave a lot of thought to. It was pretty clear that she wanted to get married as she reached 30 and Rick proposed so quickly, so why not? What tied her to Vancouver seem mostly to be her men (now exes) and Ginette and none of those were in Vancouver anymore. I'm not saying her decision was smart (it clearly wasn't) but it made sense for Eleanor Florence. If she didn't get engaged to Dicky, she would've just continued her manhunt in Vancouver or maybe even elsewhere. Relocation for a partner isn't that uncommon and in Elle's case, she didn't have much of a career here to begin with and was clearly living off either men or mommy. That can be done anywhere.

 

[VeraF]

Actually law jobs in government in Canada pay a lot - between the base pay, benefits plan and the pension plan, it's a very comfortable lifestyle in the 9 to 5 culture. Any work past 5 pm is frowned upon heavily. Career progression is slower, but each year, there is a nice pay increase that just helps all the plans I mentioned. In the corporate space in Canada, it is also fairly lucrative for Counsel and lawyers are "treated as special".

Elle make a big mistake not chasing one of those types of jobs. Even with her career experience she would at least have a nice pension egg put aside from a government group. dum dum girl

Government jobs pay okay (in comparison to private firms) depending on the Ministry you're in. Also, working past 5 as needed is a given if you are a lawyer with even a hint of ambition. I would imagine it is the same in any field...

Elle completely lacks ambition or passion for anything. She's not even passionate about being a Stepford wife. I see so many amazing YT content creators flourishing these days with videos on cooking, sewing, organizing, decorating, gardening, self-improvement... The pandemic has brought so much traffic to YT that any content creator with even an ounce of intelligence would jump at this opportunity to increase engagement, but Elle's channel is stale as ever. She is such a disappointment...

I know a bunch of attorneys both in the private and public sector. The only ones who, like Elle, constantly have to point out that they're a *~lAwYEr~* are the people who are insecure and often times viewed as incompetent by those in the profession. They're pretty easy to spot and love to flaunt their titles to whoever will listen including to their barista, random people on the internet, etc.

I have HUGE issues with misrepresentation in law. I was putting in hours for practicum for my degree back when I was a student and interned at a law office. The attorney I worked under always flaunted to others in conversation that they were a lawyer. This "lawyer" required me to bill clients for my work and misrepresented my credentials so that the billables could be at a higher rate. I explained why I was uncomfortable with this because it was not legal to refer to myself with that title without licensure. The entire ordeal was a mess and my practicum grade suffered because I tried to call out what was clearly illegal practice. The firm tried to fail me for my practicum classes but thankfully the grades for my other assignments helped me balance out to a barely passable grade. I lost out on scholarships due to my lowered GPA and almost failed the course which would require to pay and stay in school longer. Despite reporting the issue to my school and the head of the national association for the profession in my jurisdiction, nothing happened. One board member of that law office, a former judge, actually printed out the Merriam Webster dictionary definition of "common sense," told me to read it aloud, and said that I don't have it. Both the board member and attorney said that "this is YOUR issue" in regards to misrepresentation, said that it wasn't illegal, and were pushing me to drop out of school because I needed "real world experience" and said that the profession wasn't cut out for me.

In the ACTUAL real world, the board member was not renewed for a second term as a judge in their district. The attorney has been at the same job for a number of years with zero opportunity to advance higher at the firm at their current position. The salary for the attorney is still at what is considered to be a starting salary for attorneys in the public sector fresh out of law school. Attorneys who are civil servants are known to be paid the least in my area, but are still more respected than some in the private sector as they have experience in trials. For the amount of years that the attorney has worked in the profession, their peers with the same number of years are making much more. I didn't find out any of this information until after I left that practicum while questioning my career choice. I ended up doing my next practicum term in another law office thereafter. This office saw my potential and actually created a new job position while I was still in school so that they could offer it to me before I graduated. Now I'm in a great position with opportunity for growth. I just got a very generous raise less than 1 year in!

Never let appearances and titles fool you. People use them to pretend to be important. One doesn't have to be an lawyer to understand the law, but ALL people should be ethical.

WOW! So sorry to hear about your terrible experience, but not surprised. There are a lot of unscrupulous lawyers who take advantage of students and new lawyers. A couple of years into my career, I had a senior lawyer threaten to complain about me to the law society for not doing something illegal that my client (and the lawyer's friend) wanted. My supervisor found out and had it out with the lawyer, who backed down in a hurry. I think law societies really need to put effort into providing a forum for students and new lawyers to complain about the abuses they experience...

 

[MUALover]

If I were Ginette I’d hightail the US. I’d give anything not to live here right now. Granted I’m sure I’ll deal with racism abroad but whatever, I’ll tolerate it over living in the US with poor health insurance and lack of social nets.

Ginette is white so I don't think she had to deal with racism. As for social nets, I'm sure Ginette has her own money and doesn't work. As for health insurance, Ginette just turned 60 so she's still relatively young and probably purchases traveler's insurance. Granted if she were 80 (or even 70) and had a major health issue, she'd probably just head back to Canada. I know Canadian students who interned in the USA who traveled back to Canada to get their wisdom teeth removed.

I can understand why Ginette lives in Hawaii. Sure it's expensive but the weather is so gorgeous and there are a lot of really good restaurants in Hawaii (even compared to Vancouver, maybe not for Chinese food though). I speak this from personal experience having traveled to both places. I can see myself living there. Now I have family members who hate it because they have island fever and get antsy staying on a small island for a long time, but I have no issues with it.

 

[LegalEagle5]

You could look into immigrating to Canada. They have a merit/points based system for immigration, so unlike the US, you wouldn't need employer sponsorship to immigrate there. Basically there are a bunch of factors (like education, work experience, age, etc) and you accrue points for each factor, then they look at your total points. I actually wondered about this myself at one point, but never looked into it further, so not sure how that lengthy/complex that process is.

I don't believe it's that easy. There is an English language requirement and we had an employee who kept flunking it, but from what the immigration attorney said it is extremely hard even for native speakers to pass.

 

[lurkingin94123]

Curious what the issue with immigrating to Scandinavia is. Not that I am thinking of doing it (have also never been), but am jealous of people from those countries just because on paper they look so good!

Same! I’d love some insight. I really enjoyed my stays in Denmark and Norway and put both countries on my list of places I’d like to move to for work. I’m BIPOC and people were super kind and friendly to me, even more so than most Americans (outside of the city I live in).

 

[Dmiccy]

Hi all!
Long time lurker here.
Quick question whenever I try to access the links for deleted vlogs on wetransfer it says the transfer is not available. How are others managing to watch??

 

[bethannebodyworks]

I think they expire after some time.

 

[boredstrom]

She gave up free Medicare (I know she was taxed for it but still!) and a decently paying job for what?! That says a lot of her than anything else.

The biggest problem that made (and keeps) Elle the way she is, is the fact that she didn't give up anything. If she needed any sort of care, her Mom would foot the bill. Shes still eating rich expensive foods, living in expensive urban apartments and even getting new luxury handbags. As long as her mother keeps footing those bills, Elle won't feel much impact from her life choices.

 

[random.handle]

As someone who's lived in multiple countries I have noticed many expats do a lot of comparing ("at home we..."), and it's natural, but honestly, often it just makes things more difficult. Expecting things to be done the same way as in a different country may even be offensive to locals, especially if one moved there voluntarily. (Doesn't Elle do a version of this with "I'm [insert nationality]"?)

As for racism, sadly I've yet to find a place free of it. In Scandinavia it may be at least partly due to inexperience, since the populations are relatively homogenous (I think I read somewhere that the population of Denmark is approx. 90% of Danish origin, and I suspect the statistics are similar in other parts of Scandinavia).

The "coldness" is a cultural thing. The example I've heard is how Americans use 'love you' very easily, even with casual acquaintances, and Scandinavians reserve it for specific circumstances/people. It's not that people feel any more/less, they just express themselves a bit differently. I'm on the spectrum, so I actually find the (often surface level) friendliness in the US more confusing. I don't think people are different, but culturally acceptable/expected ways of expressing things vary from place to place.

I don't fault Elle's mum for choosing Hawaii. People are drawn to different places, and the reasons don't always make sense to other people. If it was just about the warm weather, don't they have family in Italy? So it's probably something else too.

 

[svdwoodsen]

I get why Ginette lives in Hawaii. It’s absolutely beautiful there and it’s probably one of the cleanest places you can live in North America. It’s also remarkably safe for an American state and the food is good. Lots of people also prefer warmer climates as they get older (Vancouver isn’t cold by any means but it rains constantly and it’s more of a Pacific Northwest kind of weather than sunny Hawaii/Southern California sort of deal).

A lot of people mention free healthcare but unless you have actual serious health issues that constantly require attention, buyIng insurance in the states Is probably enough and I’m sure it’s something Ginette and Eleanor Florence can afford. Also dental is out of pocket here so you can’t just fly home and have a wisdom tooth removed for free lol as someone mentioned. After you’ve been out of Canada for a while, your access to free healthcare also expires even if you are a citizen so you can’t return home for all procedures and not to mention, so called “free” healthcare means that unless it’s an actual emergency (bloody car accident, actually dying that moment), you have to wait a long time for things (X-ray, MRI, see a specialist, etc.) and some Canadians will even fly to the states and pay themselves to get this done more quickly. If G and Elle are both fairly healthy (which it looks like they are), it might be fine to just buy insurance in the states. Socialized healthcare is great in many respects but the long wait times can also be extremely irritating, particularly if you’re actually sick since a few weeks there can make a huge difference. If you can afford it and it’s quicker elsewhere, it is a viable option.

 

[MUALover]

I honestly believe that Ginette set a bad example for Elle. She never had father figure so doesn't know how marriages work first hand. Ginette never worked (or that we know of) and probably lives of inherited money herself. Ginette also does luxury shopping and loves to shop (though not on Elle's level). I feel Elle never had proper guidance growing up.

 

[202leda]

Eh, I don’t know, I don’t think it’s Ginette’s responsibility to provide a father figure for Elle. That’s a bit of a slap in the face for some people who grew up in single parent homes and are in better romantic relationships than Elle. I’d like to believe a father/mother figure should be a bonus, not a requirement. But I do agree that Ginette should’ve set proper boundaries and not spoil her daughter so much.

I grew up in a two parent household and I can assure you my parents (as well as my grandparents’ relationships because they didn’t believe in divorce) were not good role models on how relationships should be like.

 

[svdwoodsen]

Eh, I don’t know, I don’t think it’s Ginette’s responsibility to provide a father figure for Elle. That’s a bit of a slap in the face for some people who grew up in single parent homes and are in better romantic relationships than Elle. I’d like to believe a father/mother figure should be a bonus, not a requirement. But I do agree that Ginette should’ve set proper boundaries and not spoil her daughter so much.

I grew up in a two parent household and I can assure you my parents (as well as my grandparents’ relationships because they didn’t believe in divorce) were not good role models on how relationships should be like.

THIS.

There is an expiry date on blaming your parent(s) for your personal shortcomings, and that date was long before Elle's almost 32 years of age. Not to mention, Ginette has provided above and beyond for Eleanor Florence, more than most happily married parents. Elle's issues her own.