To COVID vaccine, or not to vaccine?

[EmilyChambers]

Exemptions will be available if it is contra indicated I am sure. This will probably be done via a dr or consultant, not a self exemption like masks. This happens with all vaccines. A small minority cannot have the vaccine but they are protected by the "herd". With the amount saying they do not want the vaccine it will be a struggle to get herd immunity through the vaccine I think. And this then cascades down to the most vulnerable still not able to go out and have freedom as we do not have the required numbers vaccinated.

My argument is, if you are able to have the vaccine have it for yourself and tour community. If you want things to get back to normal quickly then we all need to play our part and get the vaccine. This is why I volunteered for the trial. I want out of this shitshow ASAP.

So long term effects don't worry you?

Or have they 100% said during the trial that there won't be any?

Of course nothing is risk free, but I won't be rushing to get it, I want to see research and info about any long term effects first so I can make an informed decision.

At the moment I'm either being told its going to point blank be disastrous for my future health or I'm utterly selfish if I don't get it immediately.

Covid has definitely split people into one of two camps, deniers or militant Covid police and if you are neither, you are too scared to speak up!!

Undecided about this vaccination and you are labelled a selfish anti vaxer, having this vaccination and you are a sheep.

*wanders off to watch the lights on the Christmas tree

 

[embee1106]

Very useful stories from this morning that answer the question a lot of people ask:

 

[Saddlesoap]

Question to those of you questioning the long term effects of the vaccine.

We also don't know that much about the long term effects of COVID, in +years. We do already know it can have some significant health effects months afterwards.

Is the worry with the vaccine because you are choosing to get it?

 

[Trafalgar]

So long term effects don't worry you?

Or have they 100% said during the trial that there won't be any?

Of course nothing is risk free, but I won't be rushing to get it, I want to see research and info about any long term effects first so I can make an informed decision.

At the moment I'm either being told its going to point blank be disastrous for my future health or I'm utterly selfish if I don't get it immediately.

Covid has definitely split people into one of two camps, deniers or militant Covid police and if you are neither, you are too scared to speak up!!

Undecided about this vaccination and you are labelled a selfish anti vaxer, having this vaccination and you are a sheep.

*wanders off to watch the lights on the Christmas tree

Long term side effects from covid19 worry me more. 3 people I know have died (2 directly from covid19 and 1 with as they did have cancer). 4 people I know now have long covid which is very debilitating. 1 has had to give up their job due to the constant breathing problems and exhaustion. They are late twenties and didn't even have covid19 that badly, they just can't shift all the symptoms and its been 7 months. They had no underlying health conditions at all. Slim, fit and a great job. No struggles to get out of bed to go to the toilet. That really worries me way more than a side effect from the vaccine.

The vaccine has not been rushed. Side effects from vaccines are normally known pretty quickly, they don't suddenly happen years down the line. It has gone through all the normal process of all vaccines. Every vaccine was new once!

 

[Carmen 6]

Long term side effects from covid19 worry me more. 3 people I know have died (2 directly from covid19 and 1 with as they did have cancer). 4 people I know now have long covid which is very debilitating. 1 has had to give up their job due to the constant breathing problems and exhaustion. They are late twenties and didn't even have covid19 that badly, they just can't shift all the symptoms and its been 7 months. They had no underlying health conditions at all. Slim, fit and a great job. No struggles to get out of bed to go to the toilet. That really worries me way more than a side effect from the vaccine.

The vaccine has not been rushed. Side effects from vaccines are normally known pretty quickly, they don't suddenly happen years down the line. It has gone through all the normal process of all vaccines. Every vaccine was new once!

Sorry, but long term effects from vaccines can, and do, manifest many years later.
This vaccine at first application may well be safe, but the reason that a vaccine can take up to ten years to full development, is that as many possibilities for contra reactions are investigated, and, as far as possible, ruled out.
This cannot be the case with a vaccine produced in a few months, regardless of the expertise and money thrown at it.
Long term individual, and future generation reactions cannot catagorically be predicted.

 

[openbook1]

Not everybody who is refusing the vaccine is a conspiracy theorist. That’s a cheap shot to be honest.
The reason this country has gone to tit is down to the governments handling of the outbreak.
They were late off the mark, they didn’t enforce any kind of lockdown rules, they haven’t utilised the nightingales and let’s not even divulge in the lies, U-turns and hypocrisy...
Who has said that taking the vaccine will make you 100% immune...? I’ve not not read or heard that at any stage.
And if that is the case then surely it makes perfect sense for high risk people to have the vaccine and be protected and low risk people don’t?
The flu vaccine is only offered to the elderly and vulnerable so makes sense why covid would be the same.
Why would you take a vaccine for a mild to moderate flu that’s less than 90% effective if you’re body is more than capable of fighting it?
Im actually all for people willing to take it ti go ahead...I’ll decide on my own time and not be terrified and scare mongered into having it.
Scientists have always said that a vaccine isn’t the be all end all. I think it’s naive to think you have a vaccine and it’s the equivalent of a golden ticket to normal life.

Here in Canada, the flu shot is offered to everyone for free at pharmacies. Not just the vulnerable. It makes sure there is less spread. Every year people end up in hospital with complications from the flu.

 

[emm]

Here in Canada, the flu shot is offered to everyone for free at pharmacies. Not just the vulnerable. It makes sure there is less spread. Every year people end up in hospital with complications from the flu.

I am in the UK and early 30s (so not high risk) but am offered it every year from my current job, had never had it before but finally this year I wanted it and I was unable to get it as they were prioritising people at more risk, I think whatever happens next year I will be getting it if i can

 

[EmilyChambers]

Long term side effects from covid19 worry me more. 3 people I know have died (2 directly from covid19 and 1 with as they did have cancer). 4 people I know now have long covid which is very debilitating. 1 has had to give up their job due to the constant breathing problems and exhaustion. They are late twenties and didn't even have covid19 that badly, they just can't shift all the symptoms and its been 7 months. They had no underlying health conditions at all. Slim, fit and a great job. No struggles to get out of bed to go to the toilet. That really worries me way more than a side effect from the vaccine.

The vaccine has not been rushed. Side effects from vaccines are normally known pretty quickly, they don't suddenly happen years down the line. It has gone through all the normal process of all vaccines. Every vaccine was new once!

I don't disagree with anything you've said but that doesn't mean I'd go blindly into the vaccination without knowing potential side effects.

The standard childhood vaccinations come with long term potential side effects and these are available to read and people can make their own informed decision with the benefit of evidence.

You can't be critical because people are hesitant to, in effect, take a vaccination where the effects are unknown.

 

[JLXRD]

I don't disagree with anything you've said but that doesn't mean I'd go blindly into the vaccination without knowing potential side effects.

The standard childhood vaccinations come with long term potential side effects and these are available to read and people can make their own informed decision with the benefit of evidence.

You can't be critical because people are hesitant to, in effect, take a vaccination where the effects are unknown.

I totally understand the hesitance around long term side effects.

I spose I just think if no one will take the vaccine until it’s been tested for 10+ years I’m not sure what the alternative is in the meantime.

We can’t carry on like this forever with the lockdowns etc, and there are people who if the catch covid it will likely kill them so herd immunity is just not an option. Who knows how long it would take for the virus to run its course?

It’s hard either way to know what to do.

Kate Bingham (Oxford vaccine lead) has said multiple times that non vulnerable under 50s will not even be eligible to have the vaccine but then the government seem to have a different idea so I’m really not sure what the plan actually is there.

 

[Jackfruit]

I don’t know if hospitals are coping though are they? My understanding is that they are currently filling up and other non covid cases are being postponed as a result. I don’t think the NHS is currently able to run as it would have without covid therefor it is still important to keep cases as low as possible

From what I’ve read only 4 hospitals in the country are busier than this time last year. People fail to recall that every single year on record it’s been front page news that the NHS is at breaking point and never has enough beds.
The NHS was buggered long before covid hit yet the government continues to make cuts and reduce budgets. Just to give you some clarity...
NHS England figures clearly show that thousands more hospital bedsspare this year than last winter.
On average, 77,942 out of 88,903 (87.7 per cent) available beds were occupied across the country in the week ending November 22, which is the most recent snapshot. This figure does not take into account make-shift capacity at mothballed Nightingales, or the thousands of beds commandeered from the private sector.

For comparison, occupancy stood at 94.9 per cent, on average, during the seven-day spell that ended December 8 in 2019 — which is the most comparable data available for last winter — when around 91,733 out of all 96,675 available beds were full.

 

[Platypusfattypus]

From what I’ve read only 4 hospitals in the country are busier than this time last year. People fail to recall that every single year on record it’s been front page news that the NHS is at breaking point and never has enough beds.
The NHS was buggered long before covid hit yet the government continues to make cuts and reduce budgets. Just to give you some clarity...
NHS England figures clearly show that thousands more hospital bedsspare this year than last winter.
On average, 77,942 out of 88,903 (87.7 per cent) available beds were occupied across the country in the week ending November 22, which is the most recent snapshot. This figure does not take into account make-shift capacity at mothballed Nightingales, or the thousands of beds commandeered from the private sector.

For comparison, occupancy stood at 94.9 per cent, on average, during the seven-day spell that ended December 8 in 2019 — which is the most comparable data available for last winter — when around 91,733 out of all 96,675 available beds were full.

This is a very simplistic interpretation of the data and gives a very in accurate picture. This guy explains it much better. Noone I know who works in the NHS especially in acute services is saying that there are more beds spare.

 

[Likkleone]

I won’t be having it even though I’m fearful of contracting it. I am happy to have holidays in the U.K. and happy to continue being mindful of others and social distance (this isn’t hard for me given my work etc).

I am not anti-vax but I truly have lost trust in the world and know, from experience and history, they WILL produce drugs and chemicals that are unsafe either now or in the long term. It’s ridiculous to think they won’t considering what we’ve seen in the past?

(not saying it’s ridiculous to agree to have one, absolutely your choice but we can hardly say they’ve never approved things that are harmful but very beneficial for themselves)

 

[Wishwash]

In terms of testing it's not been rushed. The only thing has been all the paperwork and red tape has been removed.

Also in terms of data the figures are pretty impressive. I am a science geek but I am amazed by what can be achieved when there's unlimited funding etc.

Completely agree. This vaccine isn't "new, rushed science" it's what happens when labatories are given appropriate funding and contractual red tape is removed. Sequencing of vaccines for related viruses like SARS and MERS had already been years in the making this existing knowledge has simply been built on for this vaccine.

 

[Clickbait]

Data is often chosen to be interpreted to suit a certain argument or sell newspapers. Hospitals have fewer patients because their capacity is still limited - there needs to be a separation between people with Covid and people without Covid. There are fewer elective surgeries than this time last year. Many hospitals have improved their discharge policies or are trying to stop cases from coming to hospital in the first place.

 

[Heyguysswipeup]

Anyone had it yet? I’m getting vaxxed next week. I’m happy to get it but my big boss apparently told my colleagues if anyone refuses it and then gets covid, he’s not paying them any sick pay (we are nhs front line) surely that’s illegal?! Not to mention morally wrong...

 

[Tommyb]

Anyone had it yet? I’m getting vaxxed next week. I’m happy to get it but my big boss apparently told my colleagues if anyone refuses it and then gets covid, he’s not paying them any sick pay (we are nhs front line) surely that’s illegal?! Not to mention morally wrong...

83 year old granddad had it today. Said he didn't feel a thing and feels fine. This was in Oxfordshire.

 

[Isa Drennan]

Anyone had it yet? I’m getting vaxxed next week. I’m happy to get it but my big boss apparently told my colleagues if anyone refuses it and then gets covid, he’s not paying them any sick pay (we are nhs front line) surely that’s illegal?! Not to mention morally wrong...

Had mine today. That definitely sounds illegal from your employer.

I would definitely contact your union within the NHS if they’re saying they won’t pay sick pay. The vaccine doesn’t mean you won’t still contract COVID-19, it just means the symptoms won’t be as severe if you do, as it’s meant to increase your antibodies and immune response

I got the Pfizer one today, no side effects except from a bruised arm! Second dose depends on when the government decides apparently

 

[Pawpaw365]

Anyone had it yet? I’m getting vaxxed next week. I’m happy to get it but my big boss apparently told my colleagues if anyone refuses it and then gets covid, he’s not paying them any sick pay (we are nhs front line) surely that’s illegal?! Not to mention morally wrong...

I’m not sure about whether it’s illegal but if you’re front line nhs staff it’s completely irresponsible not to get the vaccine so I can see where he’s coming from.

 

[Isa Drennan]

I’m not sure about whether it’s illegal but if you’re front line nhs staff it’s completely irresponsible not to get the vaccine so I can see where he’s coming from.

Everyone should still have a choice, it's not mandatory to get the vaccine, even if you're in the NHS or frontline staff.

On a case by case basis, it's not always irresponsible, even when you work in higher-risk environments. I feel very strongly, about the benefits of getting vaccinated but would never say any colleague is irresponsible for not getting it. I don't fully know their circumstances and respect their personal beliefs

 

[Unagi]

I’m not sure about whether it’s illegal but if you’re front line nhs staff it’s completely irresponsible not to get the vaccine so I can see where he’s coming from.

Of course it is illegal
NHS staff are not irresponsible if they choose not to get the vaccine. People can make their own decisions on vaccine choice and should not be pressured either to get the vaccine or not get the vaccine. A pressurised workforce is not a happy workforce and what will that do for work ethic and morale.