The Royal Family #41

[elliebee27]

Harry probably exaggerated it or made it up entirely, but I could see William - who I don't feel wanted to marry but felt pressured into it after all those years and wasting Kate's twenties waiting for him to make up his mind - getting a bit tipsy the night before.

I assume everything in Spare is made up, exaggerated, or what is true really just shows what a vile, horrendous person he is (like fantasizing about murdering his father via Typhoon).

 

[jkroche95]

Harry probably exaggerated it or made it up entirely, but I could see William - who I don't feel wanted to marry but felt pressured into it after all those years and wasting Kate's twenties waiting for him to make up his mind - getting a bit tipsy the night before.

I assume everything in Spare is made up, exaggerated, or what is true really just shows what a vile, horrendous person he is (like fantasizing about murdering his father via Typhoon).

growing up (im in my 20s) I always thought harry was the 'cool' brother, naked billiards and everything..! Now i'm wondering if he was actually the nice guy we are lead to believe or was it the palace covering up stories about him/ spinning things to be in his favour.

 

[elliebee27]

I think it was all palace PR, considering all of the stories and stuff that has since come out about what a horrible person he always has been. They really reined him in and created an image to sell, and tried to keep him on the straight and narrow, so he wouldn’t get into trouble.

 

[stardust21]

I can easily imagine William not wanting to marry anyone. Anything we know about him wanting to marry anyone else is pure speculation from the press. But really…

This was (at the time) a young man who had, had his very battered mother put her world pressures on him from a very young age. He had watched and witnessed his parents very public divorce. He had watched his mother die due to the press**. Prior to her death he had watched how invasive they were to his mother’s world. That’s not forgetting that Charles also really hates the press and would have put this view onto William too.

It’s easy to forget that it isn’t just Harry that passionately hates the British press. I can 100% see someone in Williams position pushing away someone who they really loved because they didn’t want to bring them into that world. I can easily see a world where they give that person a load of crappy tests “to make sure”. I can see a world where Kate has to persuade William that she can handle it. I can also see a world where in that situation they don’t tell their brother they plan on asking Kate to marry them, so they can back out of it. And I don’t think that necessarily has anything to do with not loving Kate enough.

The grief from the loss of a parent is absolutely profound and I feel like people forget that William went through it too. Harry almost capitalises on it, and it makes it feel like it didn’t also happen to William.

I personally think Harry is a very unwell individual who is understandably deeply affected by what happened to his mother. But I also think that William is deeply affected by it and shows this in a totally different way - a real want and desire to protect those he loves and sometimes when people do that it can show in weird and wonderful ways.

I do not believe William would have married Kate if he didn’t love her. If he wanted a married woman of convenience he could have married another EU royal or someone else famous. He could have married some random aristocrat. He essentially picked a commoner from Berkshire.

Just as an aside, I think that anything Harry said about his brothers marriage in his book should be disregarded. Harry by his own admissions sees everything with William as a competition. Harry wants to be the one with the perfect marriage and perfect family so a very easy way to do that is to say “look at my perfect love story, oh and BTW here are some hints that actually Wills doesn’t love his wife who he’s been together with for almost 20 years LOL. My love is deeper and better and more real”.

—-

** Diana actually died due to not wearing a seatbelt. I feel like this is something that is always overlooked now. However the press was very clearly a key component in her death and the fact they took photos is enough to make any 15 year old incredibly angry. An anger it would be very hard to drop as an adult.

 

[Milliemoo99]

I can easily imagine William not wanting to marry anyone. Anything we know about him wanting to marry anyone else is pure speculation from the press. But really…

This was (at the time) a young man who had, had his very battered mother put her world pressures on him from a very young age. He had watched and witnessed his parents very public divorce. He had watched his mother die due to the press**. Prior to her death he had watched how invasive they were to his mother’s world. That’s not forgetting that Charles also really hates the press and would have put this view onto William too.

It’s easy to forget that it isn’t just Harry that passionately hates the British press. I can 100% see someone in Williams position pushing away someone who they really loved because they didn’t want to bring them into that world. I can easily see a world where they give that person a load of crappy tests “to make sure”. I can see a world where Kate has to persuade William that she can handle it. I can also see a world where in that situation they don’t tell their brother they plan on asking Kate to marry them, so they can back out of it. And I don’t think that necessarily has anything to do with not loving Kate enough.

The grief from the loss of a parent is absolutely profound and I feel like people forget that William went through it too. Harry almost capitalises on it, and it makes it feel like it didn’t also happen to William.

I personally think Harry is a very unwell individual who is understandably deeply affected by what happened to his mother. But I also think that William is deeply affected by it and shows this in a totally different way - a real want and desire to protect those he loves and sometimes when people do that it can show in weird and wonderful ways.

I do not believe William would have married Kate if he didn’t love her. If he wanted a married woman of convenience he could have married another EU royal or someone else famous. He could have married some random aristocrat. He essentially picked a commoner from Berkshire.

Just as an aside, I think that anything Harry said about his brothers marriage in his book should be disregarded. Harry by his own admissions sees everything with William as a competition. Harry wants to be the one with the perfect marriage and perfect family so a very easy way to do that is to say “look at my perfect love story, oh and BTW here are some hints that actually Wills doesn’t love his wife who he’s been together with for almost 20 years LOL. My love is deeper and better and more real”.

—-

** Diana actually died due to not wearing a seatbelt. I feel like this is something that is always overlooked now. However the press was very clearly a key component in her death and the fact they took photos is enough to make any 15 year old incredibly angry. An anger it would be very hard to drop as an adult.

If you watch the latest episodes of The Crown!, It suggests part of the issues around Diana's death in Paris, was the lack of any kind of planning or preparation for her visit! It was an impromptu stop over, suggested by Dodi and Al Fayad.
If you think of her 'normal' routines, they would be planned in advance, and the places she stayed in like Kensington Palace would be properly secure and pap free.
Dodi was used to being able to travel at will, using private jets, but he hadn't taken into account how much hassle and interest Diana would get from the press and the general public.

Of course its The Crown, and elements are total fantasy, but it does explain how exposed Diana was, and how badly planned the visit was. If she hadnt been trying to avoid the paps chasing her, maybe she wouldnt have got in a car with a driver who was drunk, and who was driving too fast. And of course if she had been wearing a seatbelt, maybe history would have been different!

 

[elliebee27]

If you watch the latest episodes of The Crown!, It suggests part of the issues around Diana's death in Paris, was the lack of any kind of planning or preparation for her visit! It was an impromptu stop over, suggested by Dodi and Al Fayad.
If you think of her 'normal' routines, they would be planned in advance, and the places she stayed in like Kensington Palace would be properly secure and pap free.
Dodi was used to being able to travel at will, using private jets, but he hadn't taken into account how much hassle and interest Diana would get from the press and the general public.

Of course its The Crown, and elements are total fantasy, but it does explain how exposed Diana was, and how badly planned the visit was. If she hadnt been trying to avoid the paps chasing her, maybe she wouldnt have got in a car with a driver who was drunk, and who was driving too fast. And of course if she had been wearing a seatbelt, maybe history would have been different!

She refused security which Charles said he would have paid for, thanks to her paranoia.

 

[cee-bee]

If you watch the latest episodes of The Crown!, It suggests part of the issues around Diana's death in Paris, was the lack of any kind of planning or preparation for her visit! It was an impromptu stop over, suggested by Dodi and Al Fayad.
If you think of her 'normal' routines, they would be planned in advance, and the places she stayed in like Kensington Palace would be properly secure and pap free.
Dodi was used to being able to travel at will, using private jets, but he hadn't taken into account how much hassle and interest Diana would get from the press and the general public.

Of course its The Crown, and elements are total fantasy, but it does explain how exposed Diana was, and how badly planned the visit was. If she hadnt been trying to avoid the paps chasing her, maybe she wouldnt have got in a car with a driver who was drunk, and who was driving too fast. And of course if she had been wearing a seatbelt, maybe history would have been different!

yeh this exactly.

in any tragedy, there’s rarely just one thing that went wrong. It’s usually several.

lack of planning, lack of proper security, lack of seatbelt and overzealous and disrespectful paparazzi, obsessive media - were all contributing factors. There’s no one single reason why Diana died.

 

[Flowergirl14]

Diana died because she did not wear a seat belt.
I will never understand that, it is instinctive to me to put a seat belt on.
The only survivor in the car was wearing one.

 

[Boring Monday]

Diana died because she did not wear a seat belt.
I will never understand that, it is instinctive to me to put a seat belt on.
The only survivor in the car was wearing one.

The insinuation in The Crown … so own risk … was because the paps were up close and photographing through the car windows, she was crouched over sideways and almost in the footwell to hide her face.

 

[Blurp]

She refused security which Charles said he would have paid for, thanks to her paranoia.

Wasn't at least some of her paranoia due to the lies told to persuade her to do the 'three in a crowded marriage' TV interview?

 

[Spid]

Diana died because she did not wear a seat belt.
I will never understand that, it is instinctive to me to put a seat belt on.
The only survivor in the car was wearing one.

in 1997 were adults really wearing seatbelts in the back?

 

[Boring Monday]

in 1997 were adults really wearing seatbelts in the back?

Yes … I think France brought it in before the UK as well.

 

[stardust21]

in 1997 were adults really wearing seatbelts in the back?

This comment made me feel so old because that seems so unfathomable, yet I was alive in 1997

Seat belts have been compulsory since the 1980’s and in the back of the car since 1991. Granted though, people were insanely resistant to seat belts for some reason.

In France the seatbelt rules came in earlier than in the UK.

Diana’s death and the following conversations around wearing a seat belt has probably saved countless lives.

 

[Honeystar]

My understanding was always that she declined the security in large because yes, she didn’t trust that they weren’t spying on her and reporting back to whoever, a seed definitely planted if not explicitly stated by Bashir and the BBC.

I can see why William never wants the interview aired again, it’s such a manipulation of her, she wasn’t perfect and yes, no one made her do it, but the things they told her to get her to do it would have had a serious impact on her mental state at the time.

It must be a hard pill to swallow that one of the lies they told her was that Williams Watch had been bugged to spy on her and she never (I believe) found out that wasn’t true, he must have wondered at times if she died thinking he was in on it

 

[poppyseed1]

Just catching up on the Crown , did William really go missing ? Seems like an odd story to put in or maybe they were just short on something to write so made this up ?

 

[TennisTina]

Diana died because she did not wear a seat belt.
I will never understand that, it is instinctive to me to put a seat belt on.
The only survivor in the car was wearing one.

Was it instinctive in the back seat in 1997? It wasn't for me until a few yesrs later. The front seat, yes of course.

 

[Mrs Fluff]

Was it instinctive in the back seat in 1997? It wasn't for me until a few yesrs later. The front seat, yes of course.

I'm ashamed to say it's still not 100% instinctive for me

 

[stardust21]

I'm ashamed to say it's still not 100% instinctive for me

This isn’t meant in a judgemental way at all but I’m genuinely interested, how come it isn’t instinctive? Is it uncomfortable etc?

 

[cee-bee]

Can we have mentions of the crown storylines behind a spoiler please? Some of us haven’t watched it yet!

 

[Flowergirl14]

Yes. I was in my 20's when Diana died.

And always wore a seat belt in the back of the car...

Sorry but maybe that's why I'm still alive.