Refusing the Covid 19 Vaccine #2 & general vaccine conversation.

[1twbnc]

Genuine question e.g. Does the vaccine prevent transmission…. Surely the answer to this is ultimately yes, because you are less likely to catch COVID in the first place, so transmission is reduced as a result of that?

It's honestly just an insult to act like this is a super deadly disease for young people. Yes, some young people have died, but the numbers are minute and doesn't justify forcing millions of people to have a vaccine. Give them the option sure, but I think 99% of young/healthy people wouldn't have it if you didn't dangle their freedom over their head.

I think maybe 99% is an exaggeration. Most people I know are aware that we are very very unlikely to have any bad results because of COVID, but still wanted the vaccine so we could more comfortably socialise with people who are older and therefore more vulnerable.

 

[monga]

I haven't said once that i trust the government not to do it or that they wouldn't try or want it that way. I just know it would be incredibly difficult for them to do so

I don't think it would be difficult at all, they'd just bend the rules to suit themselves just like everything else they do .There's not many courts would disagree with public health over individual choice .

 

[Notgonnalie]

Really! That makes sense. Surely 90% plus is enough for herd immunity to hopefully not be far off? I mean I know nothing really about any of the science and I try not to read too much as it gets me very stressed out but as you said those figures seem very promising!

Definitely really interesting here’s a link if you want to read more about it https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/309762

 

[Tublet83]

I've been moving towards this way of thinking over the past few days. It's too early to call of course, but I'm starting to wonder if the vaccine may be making things worse. We seemed to have less cases/deaths last summer when we didn't even have a vaccine. Something doesn't seem right to me.

We didn’t have society as “open” most kids were off school was a huge factor, no large events (hello Wembley), much stricter rules in care homes and hospitals and we didn’t have lateral flow tests last summer hence the huge increase in testing

 

[Unspiralled]

If DNA is the queen inside each cell, the many different types of RNA are like genetic worker bees, performing a variety of critical tasks responsible for the function of the body’s tissues and organs. RNA carries portions of DNA sequencing out of the cell nucleus and into the protoplasm, the liquidy contents inside the cell in which much of its living matter resides, where it connects with other RNA and amino acids to produce a variety of proteins. Researchers surmise that even in cells with correct DNA sequencing, the RNA may be making changes that alter which proteins are produced. In cancer patients, these changes may lower levels of proteins that kill cancer cells or increase proteins that prompt a cancer cell to keep dividing.

Thank you, this sounds pretty interesting. Do you have a paper you could share so that I can read more about this? It would be interesting to learn why this seems to be a particular problem with solid tumours, and which proteins in cancer cells are affected.

 

[monga]

Yes, that's exactly what I mean monga. Who is playing God to decide other operations and appointments should halt in order to deal with C19. Cancer patients, those with heart problems, pain, etc being cancelled again. As another poster mentioned, this is also brought about due to NHS staff having to self isolate.

With infections at such high levels it’s only natural healthcare workers will be as much (if not more )impacted than the general public would you be happy for a doctor / nurse with covid to keep on working even if they have no symptoms, that’s a real possibility now as infections are ( supposedly) set to reach extreme levels over the coming weeks .

 

[monga]

They are working well and doing what they are supposed to be doing.

The look at higher numbers they're comparing to 15,000 v 115,000 still a lot of fully vaccinated people being admitted.

 

[ChineseAlan]

Yes all my friends are vaccinated . My husband is is vaccinated and my father. As you know i am not. So same as you. Everybody i know has been fine so far. I understand why you are anxious again. Thats why i turned the telly off, its always doom and gloom. I went outside and had a game of tennis instead. Sometimes you have to force yourself to take a break from it. They will be going on about it for years yet ! sorry meant to say i hope he enjoys his badminton, it will do him the world of good xx

Thank you,

Ah right, so the people you know who have covid are vaccinated, that’s good they’re symptom free and the vaccine works.

My daughter has a case in her year so they’ve all been sent home now and not returning until after summer. She has to isolate. It’s a very worrying time when not vaccinated lol.

Thank you, I’m sure he will love being back doing the sport he loves. I know I should relax as he’s fully vaccinated. It’s just so hard when you hear those vaccinated can still catch it and pass it on and my other child is in education, unvaccinated. xxx

 

[HaggisInMyBin]

The courts ,at least that's where I'd be ending up if they tried to give my child it against my wishes .

The 2 parents I spoke to tonight are of the same view - via the police station - they went as far as to say they would remove then from school if it came to in school vaccinations. But it struck me as odd that the parent who chose to be vaccinated was adamant they wouldn’t allow it for their child. It’s not my place to question them - each to their own and all that. But I was curious as to how it would work if they weren’t in agreement.

And probably actually why would you be so against something for your child but not for you if anyone here can answer that.

 

[monga]

I’m nothing sure what thread we were discussing the doctors on a couple of days ago but like I said in NI the use of locums is a big thing

 

[ChineseAlan]

Ok. I promise I’m not panicking but I’m after some perspective and advice from others. You all know I’m not vaccinated, my eldest son is as is my husband. Both double jabbed with Pfizer. My daughter is 16 and obviously not vaccinated. I have ME and I’m 42. I can’t get to be vaccinated, have reasons why I don’t want to be and I also have medical trauma from 5 years ago.

Anyway, obviously during lockdowns we stuck to the rules. Last summer once out of lockdown our children met their friends, went on day trips etc but all mainly outdoors with it being summer. In the early autumn they chose a friends house each and started going round some evenings for a few hours. Then came the winter lockdown and we went back to following the rules. It’s been hard of course on our children being teenagers and the eldest did give us hell on Earth at times despite us not being in control of lockdowns. Then when we came out of lockdown we followed the restrictions of meeting groups of no more than 6 outdoors, son and husband still working from home etc.

Now restrictions have gone and cases are rising I’m feeling confused. My son is vaccinated and I promised him full freedom once he was so I’ve stuck to that but after hearing on the news it doesn’t stop you catching covid at all, only lessens the severity I have been concerned this week I won’t lie. My son goes out maybe 4x a week now he’s double jabbed. To a friends house, eating out, the pub, friends cars… and I won’t stop him because I can’t go back to his anger and outbursts towards us because he’s struggled with lockdowns in the past, as we all have. I fully understand as someone who’s been in lockdown for a few years now due to my health, it messes with your mental health and it’s hard I know.

My daughter is 16, last summer she did something’s indoors but mainly was outdoors and was ok about things but I promised her a normal summer this year. I thought once vaccinations came life would be so much safer and cases would lower. Well quite the contrary. Now I feel terrible if I go back on my word. She’s happy right now to meet her friends outside as it’s summer but she wanted a summer of freedom as I promised her early this year. She wanted trains to the city centre, shopping days, cinema, holiday with her friend, sleepovers at friends houses etc and now with cases about to peak at 100k a day I’m feeling too concerned to let her have all that freedom. I’ve not discussed this with her as yet and that’s why I’m posting here first. I would love some perspective on this please.

My extended family think covids a hoax including my mother, they’ve broken every rule and none have had covid and refuse the vaccine. So I can’t speak to my Mum about this.

Anyone with children who hasn’t had the vaccine are you giving them full freedom despite a peak coming next month? If you have a health condition would it concern you to give full freedom? I trust my son, he wears his mask everywhere he goes, handgel and stays outside where possible. Like last weekend he had a BBQ at his friends and said they all stayed outside all night and He will always do that where possible. My daughter though she wants all indoor freedom. I fully understand why, they’ve had enough. My daughter wanted to get the vaccine and she’s quite angry she won’t be able to. Not that I’d want her to now at all. My husband even regrets it.

So if you were in my shoes or if you are in my shoes, what do you feel about it as a parent who may be more vulnerable? My condtions aren’t on the high risk catergory for covid but I struggle daily and have been housebound for a few years due to the ME and I have another health condition which again isn’t high risk but I don’t want to mention it here incase it outs me but it also causes a lot of fatigue issues

I’m not panicking, I’m honestly just after some motherly/sisterly advice I apologise this got long

 

[Oohthedrama]

What normally happens is when you have a reaction or are diagnosed with an illness is, you join groups, do research etc and will normally come into contact with others who had the same thing happen. Someone has told her or her family about the Dr and they have contacted them and he or his secretary has said OK I will see you, these are my costs etc. In America, you can pretty much see any Dr you just research your own problem and find the best Dr for that problem.

There have been many people with this same problem, could they be lying to get some dosh, of course they could, but many who have tried and have their go fund me closed and money returned to the donators. they will want proof they really will be going to LA and to the Dr's clinic before releasing it.

I've not read the Reddit thread
but this Dr himself was injured by antibiotics and he now works to help others injured by drugs and vaccines.

this makes me so uncomfortable, lying in a hospital ward joining Facebook groups and googling quack doctors.

you're fine

Posted this in reply to a post to me but the post was removed.

you’re saying something was removed by staff? When was this?

 

[ChineseAlan]

No for the same reason as my last answer. If it's really causing you this much distress worrying about getting it, maybe it's worth thinking about getting the vax? I'm not at all trying to influence you because clearly I have made my feelings on the vax known, but it is quite obviously causing you a lot of worry and upset so I do wonder if it would be worth it for your mental health. Worrying about potential vax side effects might actually end up less for you than feeling you can't even be around your family and restricting your life/freedom.

Personally I think cases are going up *because* of the vax pushing the virus to mutate and also because we are constantly testing now whereas we weren't before. Also, cases are always going to go up when we ease restrictions, that's just an unfortunate fact. A zero covid society isn't going to happen.

Sadly I can’t get the vaccine, but there are also reasons I also don’t want to. But yes of course it is also hard constantly being worried hearing people are still catching it despite double vaccines,

We weren’t mass testing last year and we didn’t have the Delta variant which is fuelling the surge in cases. We did have masks last summer in the majority of settings.

Oh I don’t recall masks in shops etc last July, i forget what has and hasn’t happened in this pandemic it’s all a blur.

 

[ChineseAlan]

Dont let anybody pressurise you , you know whats right for yourself x


No you are not putting them at risk. You would know if you were unwell and you would stay away from people. No matter what the media says. They are vaccinated arent they? or whats the point ? x Actual illness yes thats a worry. cases not so much. Probably everybody have a go at me now but thats ok i dont care and i wont be changing my mind. Take care you two you know whats right your soul will tell you x

Thank you.
Any advice on coping with the anxiety seeing over 30,000 cases a day, and having a child in education who could catch it and infect you? This is where my friends say its my own risk to not vaccinate myself so I can’t worry.

 

[Prefrontalmedialcortex]

They didn’t work for these people - more deaths in vaccinated people than unvaccinated View attachment 676236

That is not representative though of the bigger picture. Thousands of lives have been saved because of the vaccines and thousands of admissions into hospital have been avoided too.

 

[Prefrontalmedialcortex]

I agree and I do think I’ve probably fallen victim to it because I did read that they appeal to your emotions rather than your mind and for me I am in a place where I feel very very scared about getting the vaccine at the moment. Even little things I’ve read that I absolutely don’t believe still niggle at my brain I guess because it makes the whole thing feel sinister. That being said though I do believe that just like with any medicine there has been some very bad side effects and deaths and what I need to figure out is if the risk I feel from those is actually as great as I sense it to be. If that makes sense. I’m just in the place of trying to work out what’s real and what isn’t but I am still scared.

I really understand where you are coming from as I have been there so many times with anxiety and panic attacks. Every little thing can be a trigger. I think it is best to steer clear from things such as social media and the news as it is hard to know what is what. Do what is right for YOU and look after number 1.

Lol ok , you did quote me and posted a fact check article so it was a fair assumption. Thanks for clarifying though I appreciate it

I quoted you, yes but my comment was not directed at you per se.

 

[MARGARETANDJENNY]

There you go chinsesalan 75 and 90 percent are good. x

 

[Prefrontalmedialcortex]

This

Nice little reference to yesterday.

 

[Doctor_Wibble]

Schools are already quoting the Gillick test in consent letters for normal vaccines.
I've never had a letter from school before with this written on.
My child is in Yr 9 and age 14. He doesn't watch the news, and whilst bright, he's not well informed about vaccines and the pros and cons.
Vaccines are given at school, so if they bought this in for the covid vaccine we might not even know our child had agreed and been given it

On the other hand the letter does say 'in the absence of a form' (to state objection) so this would be at some point after said form had been sent to the parents and subsequently not returned - so surely the option is still there, as long as the form is returned without too much delay.

 

[ChineseAlan]

You will hear of an odd person here and there who is unwell. But they most likely wont be hospitalised or die. You could have a mild illness even without being vaccinated. Remember not all these cases are illness. With the government and media they are pushing for people to take third booster jabs you see. The modelling that they use had not always been correct either. I dont know what illness you have, you dont need to say but if you answer yes to a pain condition i will know what it is, because i have it too. You will end up having an attack ( thats what i call it ) do you read the online newspapers? have a look at the comments. Not everybody is scared to death , honest xx i cant get my msging to work on here, i dont know why ? just had a look there doesnt seem to be a msging service anymore.

Thank you. I wish I could drop you a message too so I could be a bit more open.

It’s not a pain condition but a similar sort of chronic health condition. I don’t have fibro.

No, I just check Sky news a couple of times a week and scare the living daylights out of myself x