Narcissistic and Toxic parents.

[Fourcats]

Not sure really how to begin with this, but I feel really confused about my dad. He ticks all the boxes for being a narcissist, but he has never been OBVIOUSLY abusive (physical/calling nasty names) which makes me doubt everything.

My mum and dad are now divorced, but when they were together he constantly belittled her and wore her down to have no confidence. Her self esteem was so low and she wasn't able to be assertive in situations. She suffered from social anxiety and depression, and still does today, even though she eventually got out. I unfortunately suffer all of the above and I can only see my dad as the common denominator.

It started when I was about 10. I'd come home from school with a shining report apart from PE. He would never congratulate me, but instead make me spend my weekend throwing a ball in the garden over and over to become "perfect".

It got much worse as a teen. He would constantly belittle me for my choice in college course, telling me what I should do instead. I was studying special effects makeup but he wanted me to be a paramedic (huge respect to them, but it's no interest to me). I would get upset and feel like a failure, and he'd tell me I was being over sensitive and to grow up. He'd also tell me that the reason a couple of boyfriend's I'd had in school would dump me was because I was too emotional and "nobody likes that".
I was never allowed to express my opinion or explain myself in any way. He would always shout over me and not let me speak, resulting in me crying and him telling me to stop being so sensitive.
He could never be wrong. My grandma even told me she has only ever once managed to get him to admit he was wrong, and this was as a 10 year old.
I had my first daughter a few years ago, and in the later weeks of pregnancy I was becoming anxious at how I would get to the hospital once labour began as we do not drive. I asked him that IF he was available, could he please take me there (note, it was a big IF, I wasn't asking him to book time off work). He simply replied "book a taxi".
Once my daughter was born he made minimal attempts to see her. He would smugly as how I was because he said he KNOWS all about PND. He "knows" because his second wife had it severely and he still uses it against her and to make her appear incapable to this day - 16 years on.
He lives 2 miles from me and has only see my daughter about 5 times in the two years she has been alive. I know there has been a pandemic, but my in-laws have seen her double that and they live a 3 hour drive away. They just jumped at the opportunity when we had brief periods of lockdown easing.

The icing on the cake which has pushed me to actually connect the dots with all of this and realise what is happening to me is father's Day. I already hadn't seen him since a brief 2 minute doorstep chat in December. Two weeks before father's Day I put the feelers out and said if he'd like to meet up we can, but not until later afternoon as we would be busy in the day. He said he wanted to see me but refused to commit to a time.
Fathers day comes and at 11am I text to ask when he would be coming to our town. 5 hours later he gives me 1 hours notice to meet him at a local pub. I was currently bathing my daughter and needed to sort her tea out too, so asked if we could delay an hour. That's when he told me I was being difficult, didn't want to see him and was creating obstacles. I told him he's more than welcome to come to my house for a bit until my daughter is sorted then we can head out. He continued to tell me I was being difficult, all because I wouldn't do exactly as he wanted.
I was getting annoyed and upset at him refering to my daughter as an "obstacle", so I called him instead to talk. Well that did a lot of good because he said I'd also caused an obstacle by not.just being free for him all day long, and that taking my husband out for a meal was me causing yet again another obstacle.
I'm not proud but I had an emotional meltdown and shouted at him down the phone. I told him he's a tit dad and to duck off. Then the rest of the night I got abusive messages telling me that I am immature, I only contact him when I want something (not true), I am inconsiderate and basically everything is my fault. He also said "well.im.sorry your highness I was sorting the boys [my brother's] out" in response to not letting me know when he wanted to meet up until an hour before. Also said that my stepmum is in hospital which has ruined his day and now I had totally ruined his chances of salvaging a good father's day. I tried to get out of him why my stepmum is in hospital and hoped she was ok, but that was ignored

Later on in the evening because I'm a bleeping mug I messaged him to say sorry for shouting and swearing but I wish he'd make more of an effort with my daughter and I.

Did he respond? Did he duck. Because my empathy got the better of me and I fell into his trap of being the one to say sorry.

Anyway this is the longest post I've ever made, so nobody has to read it. It was very therapeutic getting it all out and written down at least.

Deffo sounds like one to me.
The guilt, no admittance of fault, belittling and subtle mental abuse. Parents shouldn't treat their kids (or anyone) like this.
You don't deserve it X

 

[Blonde123]

Not sure really how to begin with this, but I feel really confused about my dad. He ticks all the boxes for being a narcissist, but he has never been OBVIOUSLY abusive (physical/calling nasty names) which makes me doubt everything.

My mum and dad are now divorced, but when they were together he constantly belittled her and wore her down to have no confidence. Her self esteem was so low and she wasn't able to be assertive in situations. She suffered from social anxiety and depression, and still does today, even though she eventually got out. I unfortunately suffer all of the above and I can only see my dad as the common denominator.

It started when I was about 10. I'd come home from school with a shining report apart from PE. He would never congratulate me, but instead make me spend my weekend throwing a ball in the garden over and over to become "perfect".

It got much worse as a teen. He would constantly belittle me for my choice in college course, telling me what I should do instead. I was studying special effects makeup but he wanted me to be a paramedic (huge respect to them, but it's no interest to me). I would get upset and feel like a failure, and he'd tell me I was being over sensitive and to grow up. He'd also tell me that the reason a couple of boyfriend's I'd had in school would dump me was because I was too emotional and "nobody likes that".
I was never allowed to express my opinion or explain myself in any way. He would always shout over me and not let me speak, resulting in me crying and him telling me to stop being so sensitive.
He could never be wrong. My grandma even told me she has only ever once managed to get him to admit he was wrong, and this was as a 10 year old.
I had my first daughter a few years ago, and in the later weeks of pregnancy I was becoming anxious at how I would get to the hospital once labour began as we do not drive. I asked him that IF he was available, could he please take me there (note, it was a big IF, I wasn't asking him to book time off work). He simply replied "book a taxi".
Once my daughter was born he made minimal attempts to see her. He would smugly as how I was because he said he KNOWS all about PND. He "knows" because his second wife had it severely and he still uses it against her and to make her appear incapable to this day - 16 years on.
He lives 2 miles from me and has only see my daughter about 5 times in the two years she has been alive. I know there has been a pandemic, but my in-laws have seen her double that and they live a 3 hour drive away. They just jumped at the opportunity when we had brief periods of lockdown easing.

The icing on the cake which has pushed me to actually connect the dots with all of this and realise what is happening to me is father's Day. I already hadn't seen him since a brief 2 minute doorstep chat in December. Two weeks before father's Day I put the feelers out and said if he'd like to meet up we can, but not until later afternoon as we would be busy in the day. He said he wanted to see me but refused to commit to a time.
Fathers day comes and at 11am I text to ask when he would be coming to our town. 5 hours later he gives me 1 hours notice to meet him at a local pub. I was currently bathing my daughter and needed to sort her tea out too, so asked if we could delay an hour. That's when he told me I was being difficult, didn't want to see him and was creating obstacles. I told him he's more than welcome to come to my house for a bit until my daughter is sorted then we can head out. He continued to tell me I was being difficult, all because I wouldn't do exactly as he wanted.
I was getting annoyed and upset at him refering to my daughter as an "obstacle", so I called him instead to talk. Well that did a lot of good because he said I'd also caused an obstacle by not.just being free for him all day long, and that taking my husband out for a meal was me causing yet again another obstacle.
I'm not proud but I had an emotional meltdown and shouted at him down the phone. I told him he's a tit dad and to duck off. Then the rest of the night I got abusive messages telling me that I am immature, I only contact him when I want something (not true), I am inconsiderate and basically everything is my fault. He also said "well.im.sorry your highness I was sorting the boys [my brother's] out" in response to not letting me know when he wanted to meet up until an hour before. Also said that my stepmum is in hospital which has ruined his day and now I had totally ruined his chances of salvaging a good father's day. I tried to get out of him why my stepmum is in hospital and hoped she was ok, but that was ignored

Later on in the evening because I'm a bleeping mug I messaged him to say sorry for shouting and swearing but I wish he'd make more of an effort with my daughter and I.

Did he respond? Did he duck. Because my empathy got the better of me and I fell into his trap of being the one to say sorry.

Anyway this is the longest post I've ever made, so nobody has to read it. It was very therapeutic getting it all out and written down at least.

He sounds like a child. “Me me me me”, selfish attitude not appreciating that you have your child to look after. You’ve extended an olive branch, which you didn’t need to. It’s up to him as to whether he wants to get in contact with you and repair things now (Sadly I doubt he will though, as he sounds like he cant see beyond his own ego). Reach out to his wife separately to see if she’s ok. Try not to dwell on him, he doesn’t sound good for you xxx

 

[Urbanbunny]

Really helpful to read these posts thank you. Narc Mum and alcoholic Dad. Cut my Dad off 19 years ago and reduced contact with my Mum 15 years ago. Best thing I could have done.
Sometimes I look at friends and think they are so lucky to have normal parents. I never had that. I had parents who embarrassed me my whole life.

omg same. Both of mine are narcissists. Divorced now. I don’t speak to either and it’s the best thing I ever did. They embarrassed me my whole life and I’ve only just realised that their shame isn’t my shame.

so I feel your pain. Hope you’re in a good place.

 

[Zoe88]

These posts are so interesting (horrible for you all to go through). I definitely think my dad is narcissistic and just as parents are very toxic. I'm still close with them, only live 10mins away, I know this doesn't make sense to some people but I understand why they are the way they are, my mum's mum is a narcissist and my dad's childhood was not good. But while I can see that and they can too it still infuriates me that they had me and my sisters and didn't try to better themselves. Part of the reason why I've waited so long to get pregnant is that I knew I didn't want to pass down any of my family history of anger, stress, judgement, anxiousness and timidness. I want a happy baby who's free to turn into whoever they are. My parents messed me and my sister's up. I've managed to work through it, my younger sister pretty much too though she has a shorter tolerance than I do but my older sister is basically still a 6 year old and pretty narcissistic herself. Cause that happens doesn't it. And she is more intolerable than my parents. I just feel as a parent it's your responsibility to sort your tit out and they didn't/haven't even though they know about it.

 

[mcfeez]

Bit of a random but specific one but just something I was thinking of recently due to whats been going on for me personally. Does anyone else dread medical issues - other than for the obvious implications of being very worried for the health ... but then for the extra gut punch of having to tell your narcissistic parent and have them manage to make it about them? I was having medical tests last week (which btw seemed to be alright, nothing of concern) and one of the things that kept popping into my head was dreading potentially telling my mother I was unwell in anyway - not for the normal reasons, but because of how she always turns it around.

I had quite bad depression as a young adult that I was getting therapy and treatment for and I can't even remember how the conversation happened but at some point she got very upset at how I wasn't "keeping her informed enough" and that my depressive illness "was really quite hard on her." She would ring me multiple times after counselling sessions specifically to ask what I'd said about her in the session. It was so stressful it made things 100 times worse.

 

[Zoe88]

Bit of a random but specific one but just something I was thinking of recently due to whats been going on for me personally. Does anyone else dread medical issues - other than for the obvious implications of being very worried for the health ... but then for the extra gut punch of having to tell your narcissistic parent and have them manage to make it about them? I was having medical tests last week (which btw seemed to be alright, nothing of concern) and one of the things that kept popping into my head was dreading potentially telling my mother I was unwell in anyway - not for the normal reasons, but because of how she always turns it around.

I had quite bad depression as a young adult that I was getting therapy and treatment for and I can't even remember how the conversation happened but at some point she got very upset at how I wasn't "keeping her informed enough" and that my depressive illness "was really quite hard on her." She would ring me multiple times after counselling sessions specifically to ask what I'd said about her in the session. It was so stressful it made things 100 times worse.

Yes medical stuff has been an issue in my family too. They make it about themselves or just ignore it. Your mum should be there for you, especially when you're opening to her if she has anything to feel about it it's how she's made it so you can't tell her things.

My dad would just walk away and act like we weren't there if we down or ill. Like rejecting us. If we weren't smiling and getting on with everything he'd just be like what's wrong now? Even though he's been told an it's not going to go away in hour. But if he was down or sick we would all know and he'd be pandered to. My mum wanted to make sure we were ok but there were a few times that she really should've got us checked over or taken to a doctor sooner but she didn't.. out of kicking up a fuss I guess. And now as adults she does get upset if we don't tell her something's happened till after and we've sorted it but she goes in on herself and sulks. My dad still acts as if we made it up or just breezes over it. Or he's had it and worse...

 

[Thank(space)you]

Bit of a random but specific one but just something I was thinking of recently due to whats been going on for me personally. Does anyone else dread medical issues - other than for the obvious implications of being very worried for the health ... but then for the extra gut punch of having to tell your narcissistic parent and have them manage to make it about them? I was having medical tests last week (which btw seemed to be alright, nothing of concern) and one of the things that kept popping into my head was dreading potentially telling my mother I was unwell in anyway - not for the normal reasons, but because of how she always turns it around.

I had quite bad depression as a young adult that I was getting therapy and treatment for and I can't even remember how the conversation happened but at some point she got very upset at how I wasn't "keeping her informed enough" and that my depressive illness "was really quite hard on her." She would ring me multiple times after counselling sessions specifically to ask what I'd said about her in the session. It was so stressful it made things 100 times worse.

Yes, my mum is exactly the same. One of the reasons my niece saw through my mum was because my mum made my stepdad's cancer all about her.

 

[Clairer86]

The medical stuff is a bit of a strange one for me, because i was very poorly as a child and almost died when i was 11. I remember feeling at the time that my parents were loving and caring, they also had to make a decision for me (to get my right eye removed and a prostetic one in its place). I understand it would have been so bloody hard for them as well, but i cant remember them ever sitting me down and discussing it with me or what the alternative was. And they certainly didnt support me emotionally and psychologically either! Just imagine, i was going through normal teenage issues that everyone gets, then on top of that i was so self conscious about my eye, and my parents never once ever talked to me about it or supported me through anything.

 

[Eureka]

It’s one of the reasons I’m non contact. I had some serious health issues in my teens and my parent hated the attention being taken away from her so she hid my meds to punish me.

 

[Fourcats]

Anyone who's struggling or wants some insight - I highly recommend this book. Opened my eyes. I'm not normally a self help book type of person but it was recommended to me so I gave it a shot.
Really opened my eyes (and can apply to any family member doesn't just have to be mother/daughter)

 

[Thank(space)you]

My mum's drunk messaging me. She's not done this in a while tbf. She's kicking off that nobody visits her nobody calls her nobody messages her and she quits being a parent, she's going to kill herself etc. I'm so drained. I'm not engaging although I feel incredibly guilty

(I know she won't harm herself as she holds some very Strong disgusting views regarding mental illness, self harm and suicide)

 

[Blonde123]

My mum's drunk messaging me. She's not done this in a while tbf. She's kicking off that nobody visits her nobody calls her nobody messages her and she quits being a parent, she's going to kill herself etc. I'm so drained. I'm not engaging although I feel incredibly guilty

(I know she won't harm herself as she holds some very Strong disgusting views regarding mental illness, self harm and suicide)

Turn your phone off for your own sanity

 

[Rodneytrotter]

My mum's drunk messaging me. She's not done this in a while tbf. She's kicking off that nobody visits her nobody calls her nobody messages her and she quits being a parent, she's going to kill herself etc. I'm so drained. I'm not engaging although I feel incredibly guilty

(I know she won't harm herself as she holds some very Strong disgusting views regarding mental illness, self harm and suicide)

Are you non contact normally? I hope you are ok xxx

 

[Thank(space)you]

Are you non contact normally? I hope you are ok xxx

Yes I am. So was very unexpected to receive any messages from her. She gave up this afternoon when she realised she's not going to get a response.

 

[mcfeez]

My mother misinterpreted something I said last week to an extreme degree, blew up at me down the phone then hung up while I was mid sentence trying to calmly explain what was happening. She started messaging my younger brother the other day, blaming him for some health issues. Frequently reads the riot act totally unprovoked to my dad (he moved out over a year ago she was so hard to deal with) then says she's "done with all of us." It doesn't occur to her that none of the rest of us literally ever argue or fall out with each other, but she falls out with absolutely everyone. When this is mentioned to her she says everyone is just out to get her. It's getting to the point where I don't know how to have a relationship with her where I can remain feeling sane. I'd love it if she were the type of person you could have a sensible adult conversation with but she takes everything negative said about her either as a complete attack or she plays the victim and starts wailing about she's just "an awful person" seeking sympathy.

 

[Thank(space)you]

My mother misinterpreted something I said last week to an extreme degree, blew up at me down the phone then hung up while I was mid sentence trying to calmly explain what was happening. She started messaging my younger brother the other day, blaming him for some health issues. Frequently reads the riot act totally unprovoked to my dad (he moved out over a year ago she was so hard to deal with) then says she's "done with all of us." It doesn't occur to her that none of the rest of us literally ever argue or fall out with each other, but she falls out with absolutely everyone. When this is mentioned to her she says everyone is just out to get her. It's getting to the point where I don't know how to have a relationship with her where I can remain feeling sane. I'd love it if she were the type of person you could have a sensible adult conversation with but she takes everything negative said about her either as a complete attack or she plays the victim and starts wailing about she's just "an awful person" seeking sympathy.

Unfortunately, that's the nature of a narc, they're never in the wrong and it's everyone else who's the problem

 

[Rodneytrotter]

Yes I am. So was very unexpected to receive any messages from her. She gave up this afternoon when she realised she's not going to get a response.

Ah no, it's awful when they do things out of the blue like that.

Well done for not giving a response though, that must have been hard

 

[Thank(space)you]

A close family friend is really poorly in hospital. Lung cancer, heart attack, bleeding on the brain and lungs filled with fluid caused by the cancer. Looking at 6 months left max.
And as awful as it is, what I'm worried most about is how awful my mum is gonna be to make it all about her. She's a narc through and through and we are no contact (my choice) my sister who lives at home with my mum has been telling me mums drinking is getting worse (she's an alcoholic) and idk what to do. I feel heartless not reaching out to her but mentally I know I've been so much better since I've stopped communicating with her.

 

[blueblueindigo]

I opened up about abuse I had experience as a child, unable to at the time... she said I was lying, and then victim blamed me. I couldn't talk about what happened at the time because well, she was the same person back then, the only difference is that I can discuss such an event as it no longer pains me. She's a very ignorant woman, who likes to belittle others and does not take well to be called out on it at the best of times, but her comments and behaviour were really shocking today and it hit home that she's just not a decent person, nor has any intention on reflecting, understanding and growing.

Here's to rising above them, no matter how many lies they tell others about us, how many tears they have caused us, how they manipulate and misinterpret in order to never take responsibility for their awful behaviour, how powerless we have felt and incapable, how they make everything about them.... we are all better people, capable of achieving our own goals and seeing such relatives for the disappointments they are x

 

[Blonde123]

I opened up about abuse I had experience as a child, unable to at the time... she said I was lying, and then victim blamed me. I couldn't talk about what happened at the time because well, she was the same person back then, the only difference is that I can discuss such an event as it no longer pains me. She's a very ignorant woman, who likes to belittle others and does not take well to be called out on it at the best of times, but her comments and behaviour were really shocking today and it hit home that she's just not a decent person, nor has any intention on reflecting, understanding and growing.

Here's to rising above them, no matter how many lies they tell others about us, how many tears they have caused us, how they manipulate and misinterpret in order to never take responsibility for their awful behaviour, how powerless we have felt and incapable, how they make everything about them.... we are all better people, capable of achieving our own goals and seeing such relatives for the disappointments they are x

You are believed and fully supported here. Your mother doesn’t deserve to be a mother. Xx