Madeleine McCann #3

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I think the media for starters would have been much more critical of them if the were working class. Likewise I’m not sure the British Police would have pursued the case for so long.

May I ask why you are so defensive of them? I don’t think anybody is saying that they haven’t suffered - just that in all likelihood Madeline would never have gone missing had they not left her alone in the apartment while they went out to socialise. Therefore they must shoulder the ultimate blame for her abduction.
They sued many Uk publications (successfully) for unfair reporting. The press were VERY critical. I'm defensive when their guilt seems to pegged to such compelling evidence as: they smiled during an interview, they went jogging in the days after she disappeared and endless unsubstantiated gossip from the internet. The fact is there is no compelling forensic evidence to link the to the abduction or death of Madeleine.
 
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Therefore they must shoulder the ultimate blame for her abduction.
The person who must shoulder the ultimate blame is surely the abductor.

I agree, though, that they, and the rest of their party, were wrong to leave the children unattended while they went out for dinner. I'd never do it, but I do know some people who did - previously - and it wasn't uncommon. The disappearance of Madeline shows how utterly foolish such behaviour was.
 
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In what way have they been given an easy ride? Genuinely, because for the life of me I can't see it. The Portuguese police could have pursued child neglect charges if they wanted but, for whatever reason, chose not to. Possibly because they were more intent with pursuing them for manslaughter/abduction.
They have not been charged with child neglect have they? I am sure you have seen how the UK media go after people who abuse or mistreat children. The police and authorities here seem to dismiss the Portuguese police and their findings from the get go. I’ll say it again, if they were working class do you honestly think they would have been treated in the same way. Do you also think we would still be talking about the child all these years later? How many other missing children have there been over the years who we heard about at the time but not any longer? I don’t know if you have children of your own, but from your comments you don’t sound like you do. I don’t understand how any parent or anyone with an ounce of empathy and understanding can feel ok about the way the McCanns behaved. Whatever happened that night, those two are 100% responsible for Maddie going missing
 
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They sued many Uk publications (successfully) for unfair reporting. The press were VERY critical. I'm defensive when their guilt seems to pegged to such compelling evidence as: they smiled during an interview, they went jogging in the days after she disappeared and endless unsubstantiated gossip from the internet. The fact is there is no compelling forensic evidence to link the to the abduction or death of Madeleine.
The Madeline disappearance will inevitably fuel all sorts of theories unless or until the mystery is solved. Personally I have no idea what happened. I think it is highly unlikely that her parents murdered her. But I do think there is a feasible argument to say that she met with an accident while they were out or, or as has been suggested before, they sedated her and she had a fatal reaction. They may well have decided on a cover up as their conviction would most likely see them lose custody of their other two children. I’m not saying this DID happen. Just that it is an explanation that cannot be unequivocally discounted.

The person who must shoulder the ultimate blame is surely the abductor.

I agree, though, that they, and the rest of their party, were wrong to leave the children unattended while they went out for dinner. I'd never do it, but I do know some people who did - previously - and it wasn't uncommon. The disappearance of Madeline shows how utterly foolish such behaviour was.
Yes that is a fair point. I guess I was thinking , if she hadn‘t been left alone, the abductor would not have been able to take her. So that was the parents’ fault. But I see what you’re saying.
 
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[l


No problem and thank you for sharing what you found, what on earth! What a disgusting person! How did he even think that was acceptable?!

Also I find it interesting that David Payne was always the one to organise these holidays..

I'm currently reading the statement of David Payne and he seems a bit cagey to me.

There are a lot of errs in his statement and he seems to waffle quite a lot. I've not read all of it yet but so far I don't trust the guy at all.

The interviewing police officer also mentions that someone else had said that it was mainly the men going to check on the children, similar to the bathing situation on the other holiday.
Whenever I see his statement, I always wonder if he did ever actually hand those phones in.
 
They have not been charged with child neglect have they? I am sure you have seen how the UK media go after people who abuse or mistreat children. The police and authorities here seem to dismiss the Portuguese police and their findings from the get go. I’ll say it again, if they were working class do you honestly think they would have been treated in the same way. Do you also think we would still be talking about the child all these years later? How many other missing children have there been over the years who we heard about at the time but not any longer? I don’t know if you have children of your own, but from your comments you don’t sound like you do. I don’t understand how any parent or anyone with an ounce of empathy and understanding can feel ok about the way the McCanns behaved. Whatever happened that night, those two are 100% responsible for Maddie going missing
The incident didn't happen on Uk soil though, so only the Portuguese police would have been able to charge them with neglect and they didn't. Most missing children are tied up in domestic squabbles, or are teenage runaways. Stranger abduction is vanishingly rare.
 
They have not been charged with child neglect have they? I am sure you have seen how the UK media go after people who abuse or mistreat children. The police and authorities here seem to dismiss the Portuguese police and their findings from the get go. I’ll say it again, if they were working class do you honestly think they would have been treated in the same way. Do you also think we would still be talking about the child all these years later? How many other missing children have there been over the years who we heard about at the time but not any longer? I don’t know if you have children of your own, but from your comments you don’t sound like you do. I don’t understand how any parent or anyone with an ounce of empathy and understanding can feel ok about the way the McCanns behaved. Whatever happened that night, those two are 100% responsible for Maddie going missing
The social services fail kids here all the time even when blatant abuse is in front of them they don’t care till there’s a dead body and it’s all lessons will be learnt, and resignations. The McCann’s are protected by like minded people they have to be who leaves 3 babies and gets such public support no one involved can see the error in their ways because they are so consumed by arrogance and the money making machine it’s become.
 
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Katherina Gaspar’s statement is unnerving. It takes a lot of courage to come forward about someone in your social circle in that way.

And I find David Payne’s description of Madeleine utterly utterly creepy. 🚩🚩🚩
Strange that his first description of Madeleine is about all about how she looks and how pretty she was.
Usually you’d answer with she was a quiet/lively/happy/bubbly/shy child first wouldn’t you?
Also he used past tense to describe her “she was” until he corrected himself at the end and said ”she is”.

Thanks for posting.

I’m sure I read years ago that it was inferred (not sure by whom though) that it was usual for British parents to leave their children alone which is why the Portuguese police didn’t pursue it.
 
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The comments about social status linked to crime is interesting. What tends to happen is the more educated are better/ ‘smarter’ at covering things up. This is common amongst both child abuse and domestic abuse cases. They’re better at the cover up and therefore get away with it.
 
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The comments about social status linked to crime is interesting. What tends to happen is the more educated are better/ ‘smarter’ at covering things up. This is common amongst both child abuse and domestic abuse cases. They’re better at the cover up and therefore get away with it.
Isn’t there a school of thought that actually a fair proportion of business leaders and captains of industry have high functioning psychopathic traits.
 
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Well if they were up every 30 minutes checking on the kids didn't anyone else in the restaurant notice it?
 
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Isn’t there a school of thought that actually a fair proportion of business leaders and captains of industry have high functioning psychopathic traits.
Surgeons too can be a different breed of their own too. I have had the misfortune of working with some and each one I have met has been a self absorbed, entitled hole to work with. Obviously that isn’t everyone and that does in no way mean you harm your child but it could be why G is seen to be quite cold?
 
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Being a psychopath just means you meet certain personality traits. It doesn't necessarily mean you'll murder people.

It's the traits like delusions on grandeur, being prepared to step on other to get what you want, drive, unempathatic, lack of worry about consequences - that make lots of psychopaths very successful in things like banking, politics and as surgeons.

There is a theory that the financial crash happened because there were so many psychopaths working at the top of the banking system.
 
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Being a psychopath just means you meet certain personality traits. It doesn't necessarily mean you'll murder people.

It's the traits like delusions on grandeur, being prepared to step on other to get what you want, drive, unempathatic, lack of worry about consequences - that make lots of psychopaths very successful in things like banking, politics and as surgeons.

There is a theory that the financial crash happened because there were so many psychopaths working at the top of the banking system.
Yeah it's a common trait in business it's what makes them succeed .
 
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Strange that his first description of Madeleine is about all about how she looks and how pretty she was.
Usually you’d answer with she was a quiet/lively/happy/bubbly/shy child first wouldn’t you?
Also he used past tense to describe her “she was” until he corrected himself at the end and said ”she is”.
It sounds like he couldn't think of anything nice to say about her apart from how she looked.
 
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The incident didn't happen on Uk soil though, so only the Portuguese police would have been able to charge them with neglect and they didn't. Most missing children are tied up in domestic squabbles, or are teenage runaways. Stranger abduction is vanishingly rare.
As you know, they initially came to the conclusion that the McCann’s were responsible for her disappearance/death so why bother with neglect? The British police subsequently became involved in the investigation and could have charged the McCanns with neglect at any point. In this whole sorry saga, it is the only part of the story with concrete evidence and the easiest to prove. As I said before, if the McCann’s had done what every responsible parent would have done in the same circumstances, this thread would not exist.
 
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It sounds like he couldn't think of anything nice to say about her apart from how she looked.
Not sure. She was a four year old, so naturally not THAT deep things to tell about her as a family friend, busy with his own children? Also maybe the question was, since the whole world should search for her, targeted at her looks? It’s not about flattering her with telling nice things about her. Still weird though to be that obsessed with her beautiful appearance.
 
As you know, they initially came to the conclusion that the McCann’s were responsible for her disappearance/death so why bother with neglect? The British police subsequently became involved in the investigation and could have charged the McCanns with neglect at any point. In this whole sorry saga, it is the only part of the story with concrete evidence and the easiest to prove. As I said before, if the McCann’s had done what every responsible parent would have done in the same circumstances, this thread would not exist.
Presumably the british police could only charge them with neglect committed in Britain?
 
Isn’t there a school of thought that actually a fair proportion of business leaders and captains of industry have high functioning psychopathic traits.
yes, there is lots of evidence that in many professions being a sociopath/psychopath and having a lack of empathy is actually very helpful. If you are interested in this you should read The Psychopath Test by Jon Ronson, it is really itneresting

Surgeons too can be a different breed of their own too. I have had the misfortune of working with some and each one I have met has been a self absorbed, entitled hole to work with. Obviously that isn’t everyone and that does in no way mean you harm your child but it could be why G is seen to be quite cold?
yeh apparently this helps with being able to cut into someone, which otherwise kind of goes against instinct in a way
 
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