Lucy Letby Case #6

[Ivysnan]

There’s also the sheer volume of evidence in the case which would need to be consistent in how it points which would be exceptionally difficult to fudge at this sort of volume.

I also think the number of years that this case has been built across and how much time both the police and CPS have spent on it examining it would have brought up more questions if this was scape goating as having multiple people “in on it” would have created mistakes, mess and inconsistencies that they’d then have questioned or challenged. It just seems a real stretch that the CPS and the police would conspire to cover NHS failings which at worst would have put them on emergency measures and got the trust a slap on the wrist - yes there would potentially have been financial implications but a trial will cost exponentially more. There is no logic whatsoever to scapegoating In this scenario for me at all and I’ve tried to approach it from various angles.

I agree. To have all these failings exposed would be bad enough, but to have them made public and an alleged serial killer on top, is beyond horrific.

 

[Lucyxxxx]

The sarcasm on this thread is really off-putting. Think I’ll stick to reading about the trial on my own.

Seems you can’t ruminate out loud on here without someone jumping down your throat about it. If I don’t like a certain poster’s stance, do you know what I do? I scroll by. You don’t need to bite and suggest they’re wild conspiracy theorists.

@avabella was a good contributor to other trial threads and I like that she thinks of all other possibilities. It’s a weird case and there’s only so much information to go by just now. I expect there’ll be much more by the end of the 6 months.

Literally just came to say... not trying to police the thread but it is feeling a bit catty in here. Please can we not get the thread shut down or users banned. Understandably emotions are high but let's just agree to disagree on things and move on?

 

[sickofsm]

About the TPN bag... few points first of all...

- bespoke bags come from pharmacy, labelled for the baby, titrated based on their blood results.
- stock bags kept in the NICU, used if needed until bespoke bags are ready.
- they are ran through a plastic line (giving set) into the blood stream, either peripherally (cannula) or centrally (in this case, long line).
- changing bags without changing the giving set is poor practice in neonates.
- moving a bag and line from a peripheral access point (cannula) to a central access point (in this case, long line) is a big no no. High risk of introduction bugs into a central vein.
- however, bags can happily be moved from a central access point to a peripheral.
- TPN contains dextrose (sugar) at a concentration of 10%.
- Dextrose bags can be given separately, at higher concentrations.

Onto the case...

- LL attached a TPN bag to baby's long line on her night shift. This is the one they suspect was contaminated. Let's call it Bag A. It is unclear if this was a bespoke bag or a stock bag.
- 11am. Day staff. LL is off shift. Babies blood sugars are poor. Dextrose is commenced via the long line instead, to fix the low blood sugars. I assume this Dextrose is high concentration. High concentration dextrose MUST be given centrally.
- 11am. Bag A is moved to a peripheral line meantime. It contains other nutrients so cannot be stopped completely. Bag A now cannot be moved back to a long line, as it has been flowing through a peripheral line. Hence the comment, they were inserting a new long line.
- the Dextrose infusion increased baby's blood sugar, but the contaminated TPN (Bag A) counteracted this, as it was still running peripherally.
- 4pm. A new TPN bag arrives from pharmacy. Let's call this Bag B.
- 6pm. Blood sugars remain low. They stop TPN altogether. They replace all fluids with Dextrose only.
- 7.30pm. Blood sugars are finally normal.

 

[MmmB777]

The sarcasm on this thread is really off-putting. Think I’ll stick to reading about the trial on my own.

Seems you can’t ruminate out loud on here without someone jumping down your throat about it. If I don’t like a certain poster’s stance, do you know what I do? I scroll by. You don’t need to bite and suggest they’re wild conspiracy theorists.

@avabella was a good contributor to other trial threads and I like that she thinks of all other possibilities. It’s a weird case and there’s only so much information to go by just now. I expect there’ll be much more by the end of the 6 months.

Why shouldn’t people continuously suggesting scape goat be asked to explain why or how it makes sense? Lots of people are saying well it happens- yes but how did it happen here and why? And that’s what those suggesting the evidence is quite clearly not showing a cover up of any sort are continually met with. And if you say I think this means she’s guilty you’re met with - “god no point in a trial is there” . It works two ways. My post was ridiculous to point out the ridiculousness of this theory. It wasn’t a personal attack for people to get upset about.

 

[stardust1]

The sarcasm on this thread is really off-putting. Think I’ll stick to reading about the trial on my own.

Seems you can’t ruminate out loud on here without someone jumping down your throat about it. If I don’t like a certain poster’s stance, do you know what I do? I scroll by. You don’t need to bite and suggest they’re wild conspiracy theorists.

@avabella was a good contributor to other trial threads and I like that she thinks of all other possibilities. It’s a weird case and there’s only so much information to go by just now. I expect there’ll be much more by the end of the 6 months.

so we aren’t allowed to ask why she believes something now? It was only a few days ago she was belittling another poster for their opinion.

 

[Emmelina Ball]

‘They’? Who do you mean by they? Staff suspected something and they called the Police in to investigate. That would happen in any company, say a financial organisation (or any workplace) where fraud or thief was suspected. The alleged culprit could be named etc but the Police would do their own investigation and evidence gathering. Then the CPS would evaluate all this. I think once the investigation was handed over to the Police it would be out of ‘their’ hands.

I thought they were required to report it to the police as a result of the RCPCH review as they made a recommendation to conduct a thorough external independent review of each death - was the external body not the police? Maybe I have it wrong though that’s what I took from it.

 

[jackolantern]

Why shouldn’t people continuously suggesting scape goat be asked to explain why or how it makes sense? Lots of people are saying well it happens- yes but how did it happen here and why? And that’s what those suggesting the evidence is quite clearly not showing a cover up of any sort are continually met with. And if you say I think this means she’s guilty you’re met with - “god no point in a trial is there” . It works two ways. My post was ridiculous to point out the ridiculousness of this theory. It wasn’t a personal attack for people to get upset about.

It's such a harrowing topic I think a bit of comedy here and there is much appreciated!

 

[LittleMy]

You can do what you want, I’m just saying as an outsider who hasn’t posted my thoughts on this trial yet but has been following closely, the sarcasm is pathetic. That’s my opinion.

Please carry on, I’d hate to derail the thread any more.

 

[stardust1]

I thought they were required to report it to the police as a result of the RCPCH review as they made a recommendation to conduct a thorough external independent review of each death - was the external body not the police? Maybe I have it wrong though that’s what I took from it.
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I don’t think it necessarily has to be the police, although I’m not sure who else would come in to investigate. I’m sure someone with in the NHS could explain more.

 

[aalmaalm]

You can do what you want, I’m just saying as an outsider who hasn’t posted my thoughts on this trial yet but has been following closely, the sarcasm is pathetic. That’s my opinion.

Please carry on, I’d hate to derail the thread any more.

Jokes, sarcasm & morbid humour are some people’s way of coping/dealing with things. This is a deep, deep case. A bit of light heartedness is actually needed now & then in my honest opinion!

 

[LittleMy]

Jokes, sarcasm & morbid humour are some people’s way of coping/dealing with things. This is a deep, deep case. A bit of light heartedness is actually needed now & then in my honest opinion!

At the expense of other people? It came right after Avabella’s comment. I thought that was a bit cheeky.

I’m not saying any more on it.

 

[Deeznutslol]

At the end of the day it’s a very upsetting case but I don’t think we need to be getting angry or upset with each other about it. So what if someone thinks she’s innocent/guilty? None of us are on the jury so it’s not like any of our opinions matter or are going to have any impact on the outcome of this trial anyway lmao.

 

[Emmelina Ball]

I don’t think it necessarily has to be the police, although I’m not sure who else would come in to investigate. I’m sure someone with in the NHS could explain more.

I thought given a review had already been carried out by RCPCH the next step was the police?

 

[Aberscot]

There was a Facebook comment before the trial started ( I know could be made up ) from someone that said they knew parents of 2 babies that were allegedly murdered. i can’t remember where it was did anyone else see it?
One of her other comments was interesting about more to come out or something to that effect.
Was keen to read it again now that we know there was twins murdered she maybe was legit.
Also how long was Lucy on admin duties before she was charged ? Imagine the collegues having to work with her then, there must have been rumours of why she was moved

 

[jackolantern]

At the expense of other people? It came right after Avabella’s comment. I thought that was a bit cheeky.

I’m not saying any more on it.

Pretty much all black humor is at the expense of other people, no? Like that's the whole point. Although I don't even think that could be considered black humor tbf, it was just lighthearted poking fun at the concept of some elaborate conspiracy theory. Nothing personal at all.

 

[Lucyxxxx]

Moving the thread in a slightly different and more trivial direction.. I think we are gonna end up with about 300 threads on here if they keep at this rate. I think we will have a few influxes of newbies when particularly shocking evidence comes out.

 

[stardust1]

At the expense of other people? It came right after Avabella’s comment. I thought that was a bit cheeky.

I’m not saying any more on it.

So what about the poster she was picking on in the previous threads because she didn’t like their opinion? If you’re going to keep coming back with the same theory people are allowed to ask how that conclusion is made.

 

[MmmB777]

At the expense of other people? It came right after Avabella’s comment. I thought that was a bit cheeky.

I’m not saying any more on it.

Cheeky - I’ll take that- guilty as charged I am not trying to make anyone upset. I find absolutely nothing about this case funny except the wild theories and I sometimes can’t resist pointing out how wild they are! It’s not a personal attack ever! I don’t see why people can’t say well why would it be this or why would it be that?

 

[Emmelina Ball]

Moving the thread in a slightly different and more trivial direction.. I think we are gonna end up with about 300 threads on here if they keep at this rate. I think we will have a few influxes of newbies when particularly shocking evidence comes out.

The rate we’re going we could nearly have the thread title as what day of the trial it is! Fastest moving thread I’ve contributed to I reckon it will get a lot of traffic the deeper we get into the evidence

 

[stardust1]

I thought given a review had already been carried out by RCPCH the next step was the police?

does it not mean post-mortems etc or would the RCPCH have already done that?