I believe it is likely to just have been not part of the main court bundle. So literally in a separate folder. The CPS do not have to use, or refer to all the evidence that is in the bundle. So if she had never referred to being isolated etc then BNE may have chosen not to use it today. Just because you have gathered evidence and its in the bundle, it does not have to be used.
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yes me my love
Really off. Unsettled/worried. Sad for all involved. Overwhelmed.
ohh I love it!!! Genius!! Hahaha!!!
It could have so easily just been put in the usual bundles but he’s made her a nice little photo album of all her final social activities. Hahahaha!!! does she get to keep it?
yes maybe it’s this, was thinking yesterday (after seeing how upset many of the thread were) that a guilty verdict would probably leave the thread totally numb/quiet at first.. maybe I/we are feeling it preemptively because the end hopefully is in sight.
I can’t shake a negative feeling but perhaps it’s more of a self protection thing after a crappy couple of years and an awful couple of weeks to date - I have so little faith in the universe so I think I’m resigned to worry first these days
I was active in these threads at the start and had to take some time out...I've just sped read the most liked posts on last few threads and OMFG I cannot beleive NN is married, I was convinced he wasn't cos I thought giving her use of his car was just too much open behaviour for it to have been a married man...shocked. I am at a loss for words that she drafted a sympathy message which included the name of the surviving triplet, just WHY would u do that. I am convinced still that it started as a way to get sympathy from colleagues and ended as a way to catch NNs attention, I can't forget the testimony that he went for a tea break with a female colleague and before the kettle he was being called back for a crash call by LL. She is an absolute psyco.
Big hugs to us all. I’ve actively avoided pics of the notes, the photos of her house and not really paid much attention to the photos of her just living a normal life but seeing them pics of her with her colleagues has made me feel a type of way. Like I can’t imagine how they feel now, plus she literally looks so normal. And I know serial killers and murderers/narcissists don’t look a certain way but she literally looks so bang average you’d walk past her in the street and not bat an eyelidyes maybe it’s this, was thinking yesterday (after seeing how upset many of the thread were) that a guilty verdict would probably leave the thread totally numb/quiet at first.. maybe I/we are feeling it preemptively because the end hopefully is in sight.
I can’t shake a negative feeling but perhaps it’s more of a self protection thing after a crappy couple of years and an awful couple of weeks to date - I have so little faith in the universe so I think I’m resigned to worry first these days
Today was another interesting day I thought.
The pj's arrest thing - if they were banging on her door at 6am and arresting her, they would literally enter the house and verbally arrest her as soon as through the door. So she was likely to have been in her pjs/nightie/whatever. Removing her from the house isn't the actual arrest. Then it appears that it's been reported that her nightie was on under her deluxe lounge suit (wtf?) I hope that it came across more clearly in court because the way it was reported seems ridiculous to me. It's semantics and if I was on the stand, personally I would have been calling BNE out about the act of the arrest and leaving the house being different things. But then I am argumentative even when giving oral evidence and personally I can't stand a legal professional being inaccurate in court.
So I hope that the jury didn't see this as BNE being a dick swinger and it came off in the right way, which IMO from the reporting it doesn't. I think the social folder stuff also doesn't come across well for BNE and BM made good and valid points about that.
The draft sympathy note - do we actually know that it was written before the babies died? This is something it would have been good to have had better reporting. Potentially it is huge but if it was written after their deaths then its less impactful as the surviving triplet would have been out of the unit.
The Dr NN thing - were they or were they not shagging? Surely if they were there would have been evidence on her phone in the form of messages, something more concrete? Again, potentially I think this could be a bit diluting to the prosecutions case. Presumably if there was evidence that they were shagging BNE would have made it more of a mic drop moment if he is implying that she committed some of the murders/attacks to gain the attention of Dr NN?
I feel concerned that focussing on some of the smaller almost petty little things can detract from the more powerful evidence and this creates reasonable doubt for some of the jury. I think it's a professional mistake to focus on things that can be taken the wrong way by a jury when they add little to the real matter at hand.
I am so firmly in the guilty camp now after some real mic drop moments over last few weeks that the thought of reasonable doubt being handed to the jury on the plate worries me.
I still don't get the why either. I think this is a very different case to almost any other murder/serial killer case. To me, LL as a murderer makes no sense from everything I've seen and read. By that I don't mean she is innocent, I mean the "why" is just unfathomable to me.
The pj's arrest thing - if they were banging on her door at 6am and arresting her, they would literally enter the house and verbally arrest her as soon as through the door. So she was likely to have been in her pjs/nightie/whatever. Removing her from the house isn't the actual arrest. Then it appears that it's been reported that her nightie was on under her deluxe lounge suit (wtf?) I hope that it came across more clearly in court because the way it was reported seems ridiculous to me. It's semantics and if I was on the stand, personally I would have been calling BNE out about the act of the arrest and leaving the house being different things. But then I am argumentative even when giving oral evidence and personally I can't stand a legal professional being inaccurate in court.
So I hope that the jury didn't see this as BNE being a dick swinger and it came off in the right way, which IMO from the reporting it doesn't. I think the social folder stuff also doesn't come across well for BNE and BM made good and valid points about that.
The draft sympathy note - do we actually know that it was written before the babies died? This is something it would have been good to have had better reporting. Potentially it is huge but if it was written after their deaths then its less impactful as the surviving triplet would have been out of the unit.
The Dr NN thing - were they or were they not shagging? Surely if they were there would have been evidence on her phone in the form of messages, something more concrete? Again, potentially I think this could be a bit diluting to the prosecutions case. Presumably if there was evidence that they were shagging BNE would have made it more of a mic drop moment if he is implying that she committed some of the murders/attacks to gain the attention of Dr NN?
I feel concerned that focussing on some of the smaller almost petty little things can detract from the more powerful evidence and this creates reasonable doubt for some of the jury. I think it's a professional mistake to focus on things that can be taken the wrong way by a jury when they add little to the real matter at hand.
I am so firmly in the guilty camp now after some real mic drop moments over last few weeks that the thought of reasonable doubt being handed to the jury on the plate worries me.
I still don't get the why either. I think this is a very different case to almost any other murder/serial killer case. To me, LL as a murderer makes no sense from everything I've seen and read. By that I don't mean she is innocent, I mean the "why" is just unfathomable to me.
If she’s been nicked off a 6am knock up and she’s got a nightie on they would’ve let her put clothes on to cover herself, especially if it’s cold but it’s not a case of spending time picking an outfit they’d have either gone up with her to get the Lee cooper leisurewear or sent her parents up if they were there
ETA; that’s the one thing I do believe that she’s said about having her nightie on underneath. They don’t duck about the old 5-0
ETA; that’s the one thing I do believe that she’s said about having her nightie on underneath. They don’t duck about the old 5-0
Yes but they would arrest straight after entering. Then let her put her sexy suit on before leaving the house - which is not the actual arrest. Again yes they don't even let you go to the toilet without coming with you whilst in the house.
Are we still waiting on our @nosycowmoo tonight?
Just reread the Sky article and now the sympathy note doesn't make any sense in the way BNE portrays. Sky are saying that she wrote it after she was suspended and it was on their birthday - so presumably their first birthday. So she clearly knew that the surviving triplet was alive and well. So how can it be a sign she planned to kill all 3? This makes no sense.
Literally, even though my logical brain knows she’s guilty after hearing all of the evidence, there are still times when I find myself thinking… nah surely not, this has to be some sort of awful misunderstanding? It’s so difficult for me to comprehend how someone could be so bleeping evil, I can see why there are some people who are still desperately clinging on to anything which suggests she’s innocent bc realistically, it’s far easier to do that than to accept that someone would do something so deeply disturbing and cruel to helpless little newborn babies.
A life sentence isn’t enough for her and there can never truly be justice with something like this, but I just hope she gets properly seen to in prison by the other inmates.
Right now I just feel so angry for the parents having to go through all of this, as if it wasn’t enough for her to take their child away, she has also forced them to suffer a ridiculously long trial rather than just admit to her crimes. it’s heartbreaking.
Sorry this has kind of turned into a ramble, but this case really messes with your head at times.
It’s not about whether they were shagging or if she was wearing her pjs, it’s about her lying and being manipulative on the stand.
her actual evidence (reported by Dan O’Donohue) was she was taken away in her pyjamas.
This is a lie, she was allowed to put a tracksuit on over the top or was already wearing it, and so it seems she is trying to manipulate the jury into how badly treated she was at the time of her arrest.
she has also massively down played her relationship with Dr NN. Forgot to mention the trip to London during her defence. It doesn’t matter if they were shagging or not, we don’t need evidence of that. Their relationship was totally inappropriate for a married man. Meals, meet ups in various towns, a second trip to London planned but cancelled, love hearts on messages.
With the sympathy message, yes it’s my understanding it was written for their birthday a year later. The third baby was alive and away from Lucy. But who writes a sympathy message for a baby that’s still alive? It’s sick!!! They are saying she included the third baby in the sympathy message because it had always been her intention to kill all 3.
The proof of her lying and manipulating over things that are relatively minor, what you call petty things, are actually very strong for the prosecution. She can’t even be honest about really simple things. Why should the jury believe her word over anything. She has zero credibility.
Them poor parents seeing the photos today of her living her best life. Not a care, whilst their whole world has fell apart. Cool calm and collected.
Can one of u clever clogs on here actually explain that sky thing please cos I’ve confused myself, if the note re triplets was made after she was moved how’s BNE used his magic powers to stick it to her that she planned to kill the 3rd triplet?
ETA: thank u @Tofino w ur big clever clog energy
Can one of u clever clogs on here actually explain that sky thing please cos I’ve confused myself, if the note re triplets was made after she was moved how’s BNE used his magic powers to stick it to her that she planned to kill the 3rd triplet?
ETA: thank u @Tofino w ur big clever clog energy
So true, I had armed response at my door, they secured the suspect, even let them have a fag and dress appropriately. I was bleeping fuming
I don't remember who it was but they'd said that when they were arrested the police let them get dressed and have a quick wash before they were taken away (thank you whoever it was!)
Of course they'd LL do the same. But LL brought up being in her pyjamas for sympathy.
Of course they'd LL do the same. But LL brought up being in her pyjamas for sympathy.
Exactly @Tofino
It showed you cannot trust Letby on the big or small things as she lies about literally anything and everything.
She is compulsive.
It showed you cannot trust Letby on the big or small things as she lies about literally anything and everything.
She is compulsive.
I notice the reporting also says ‘Letby says the police knocked on her door at 6am.’
Not really sounding like a ‘raid’ now either, although not sure if that was ever said in court but certainly the impression some had.
You can even see clearly here (presuming reporting is accurate) how she doesn’t answer questions honestly.
she says she’s not sure she was taken away in a blue track suit. NJ offers to show the video. Now she agrees (without seeing the video) that NJ is correct. If you were genuinely unsure wouldn’t you want to see the video? More likely she thought she could get away with not agreeing with NJ until he had evidence to show. Makes all her other ‘im not sure’ ‘I can’t recall’ incredibly weak now.
but it doesn’t end there, she then goes on to say it was the first arrest she was taken away in her pjs. I mean, is she stupid? Does she think he doesn’t have a video of the first arrest when he’s just offered to show her the 2019 arrest?
this is just a bloody ridiculous point to 1. Lie about in the first place and 2. Continue to be obtuse and defensive about it when she’s told there’s a bloody video
Btw I think it’s more likely we will see an arrest video in the media now
Not really sounding like a ‘raid’ now either, although not sure if that was ever said in court but certainly the impression some had.
You can even see clearly here (presuming reporting is accurate) how she doesn’t answer questions honestly.
she says she’s not sure she was taken away in a blue track suit. NJ offers to show the video. Now she agrees (without seeing the video) that NJ is correct. If you were genuinely unsure wouldn’t you want to see the video? More likely she thought she could get away with not agreeing with NJ until he had evidence to show. Makes all her other ‘im not sure’ ‘I can’t recall’ incredibly weak now.
but it doesn’t end there, she then goes on to say it was the first arrest she was taken away in her pjs. I mean, is she stupid? Does she think he doesn’t have a video of the first arrest when he’s just offered to show her the 2019 arrest?
this is just a bloody ridiculous point to 1. Lie about in the first place and 2. Continue to be obtuse and defensive about it when she’s told there’s a bloody video
Btw I think it’s more likely we will see an arrest video in the media now
I got nosy and had a look for the Lee Cooper lounge suit.
Guess who used to own Lee Cooper?
Never let it be said that we haven't had her bang on the entire time!
Guess who used to own Lee Cooper?
Never let it be said that we haven't had her bang on the entire time!
wonder if they’ll release the body cam footage of her arrests at some point after this is over
Yeah my brothers used to get nicked in the house all the time, they’d cuff em and send one of us up to get a t shirt or something if needed
Yeah my brothers used to get nicked in the house all the time, they’d cuff em and send one of us up to get a t shirt or something if needed
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