Israeli - Palestinian Conflict #16

[Dogmuck]

Imagine if we turned some of what you are saying on its head Moley. It’s your framing for me that is telling. You try your hardest to pretend to be neutral but it’s very clear you are not because the “but for” doctrine is strong the “deemed” the “Islamic terrorists”. I see you Margret Moley!

It is perfectly possible to be disgusted by the actions of the IDF as it is by the actions of FREEDOM FIGHTERS.

That means that HAMAS must stop their incursions into what is deemed ISRAELI territory and that ISRAEL have to stop the SEIGES AND MASSACRES AND ACCEPT THAT PALESTINE ISNT GOING TO DISAPPEAR.

This has nothing whatsoever to do with supporting HAMAS.

The reality of the situation is that without the attack by ISRAEL ON EVERY DAY FOR 76 YEARS we would not be looking at a destroyed Gaza today.

The HAMAS response has been disproportionate but they were never going to let the NAKBA/CHOSE A SLAUGHTER/SEIGE/DISPLACEMENT/ go unpunished.


Has gave those who want the ISRAELIS gone a perfect excuse to do exactly what is happening at the moment.

Being neutral and wanting both sides to stop the violence is not supporting HAMAS. Please stop with this nonsense.

 

[Veronicaaa]

It's funny to say this ~wouldn't be happening~ had it not been for October the 7th, when in reality it has been happening for decade upon decade - Palestinians detained without charge (ie kidnapped), being murdered on the daily, being driven out of their homes, the constant violence or threat thereof. It's just that Israelis were perpetrating it so it was allowed. The minute Hamas treats their lives in the same way the Israelis have treated the Palestinians, suddenly a 'hornet's nest' has been stirred up and Hamas are blamed for the genocidal words and deeds of the Israeli governmnet.

 

[avabella]

It's funny to say this ~wouldn't be happening~ had it not been for October the 7th, when in reality it has been happening for decade upon decade - Palestinians detained without charge (ie kidnapped), being murdered on the daily, being driven out of their homes, the constant violence or threat thereof. It's just that Israelis were perpetrating it so it was allowed. The minute Hamas treats their lives in the same way the Israelis have treated the Palestinians, suddenly a 'hornet's nest' has been stirred up and Hamas are blamed for the genocidal words and deeds of the Israeli governmnet.

It’s akin to saying men wouldn’t rape young woman had they not worn short skirts. Always a DARVO, always the narcs. They show themselves so easily once you know what to look for

 

[Emotional Support Ferret]

With respect, as a person who believes that both sides are guilty of this conflict, I disagree. It is perfectly possible to be disgusted by the actions of the IDF as it is by the actions of Islamic terrorists. It is also perfectly possible to understand that both sides have what they consider to be justifiable reasons for their actions. The Palestinians and Israelis have been chipping away at each other for a very long time. This will not end until BOTH sides accept that the other has a right to live in peace within agreed secure boundaries. That means that Israel must stop their incursions into what is deemed Palestinian territory and that Palestinians have to stop the suicide bombing and terrorist attacks and accept that Israel isn’t going to disappear. This has nothing whatsoever to do with supporting Israel. I know plenty of neutrals who are horrified at their disproportionate response to 7th October and who want to see Netanyahu and his ultra right wing government removed. They, and I, also want to see the extremist faction of Hamas removed. You are welcome to pick a side and believe that you are right but please don’t put words into other people’s mouths are pretend that they support Israel’s actions. The reality of the situation is that without the attack by Hamas on 7th October we would not be looking at a destroyed Gaza today. That is absolutely not condoning some Israelis actions against Palestinian people and the Israeli ignoring of UN directives. In another forum I am called an antisemite because I have been critical of Netanyahu and the IDF. Here I get labelled as Islamophobic because I criticise Islamic terrorists. It does nobody any favours to throw lazy labels around over a very complex and inflammatory situation that has defied attempts to find a peaceful solution for millennia. And yes I agree, there are not two sides to genocide but to use another unhelpful but true statement, if you stir up a hornets nest, expect to be stung.
The Israeli response has been disproportionate but they were never going to let the attack of 7th October go unpunished. Has gave those who want the Palestinians gone a perfect excuse to do exactly what is happening at the moment.
Being neutral and wanting both sides to stop the violence is not supporting Israel. Please stop with this nonsense.

Islamic terrorists?

 

[Jen667]

Very much looking forward to the 'Hamas are not terrorists' explainer

 

[Dogmuck]

Islamic terrorists?

IDF v Islamic terrorists
Incursion v terrorist attacks and suicide bombing
Some Israelis actions v Islamic terrorists
Lazy labels v if you stir up a hornets nest, expect to get stung
October 7th v defied attempts to find a peaceful solution for millennia
Netenyahu and the IDF v Palestinian people

Always the framing - always telling
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Nailed it

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Netanyahu and the IDF

 

[avabella]

Just saw the footage again of the little girl that was trapped yesterday evening. Huge square blocks pinning her upper body and head down.

The fear that must cause. How does anyone get over that? When she had some breathing room, she was shouting for her mama. The rescuers were saying mamas coming, but of course, her mama is dead 🥹

In the picture, you can see her right leg to the left of the picture. The rescuers left arm is at her torso. Her whole head and upper body is under huge blocks of rubble.
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Thankfully this poor baby looks like she’ll make a physical recovery.

For the hard of reading/comprehension;

Photo shows a young Palestinian girl, around 3 or 4 years old, suffering from significant head injuries as the result of being collateral damage for the most moral Israeli army in the world. Silly wee toot, in the wrong place at the wrong time huh!

 

[Charlotte1993]

That’s not what I said and you know it. DARVO strong on this thread too

Not at all you literally said it’s unhealthy to just be focused on Gaza
Don’t try and gaslight me wrong girl.
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Take Eurovision back to the Eurovision thread. Who cares.

The truth is voter fraud is real I literally read a woman on twitter say she voted twenty times using five credit cards and a lot of pro Palestinians were boycotting the event entirely so wouldn’t have voted at all so yeh it’s not black and white anyways.

 

[carriage120217]

With respect, as a person who believes that both sides are guilty of this conflict, I disagree. It is perfectly possible to be disgusted by the actions of the IDF as it is by the actions of Islamic terrorists. It is also perfectly possible to understand that both sides have what they consider to be justifiable reasons for their actions. The Palestinians and Israelis have been chipping away at each other for a very long time. This will not end until BOTH sides accept that the other has a right to live in peace within agreed secure boundaries. That means that Israel must stop their incursions into what is deemed Palestinian territory and that Palestinians have to stop the suicide bombing and terrorist attacks and accept that Israel isn’t going to disappear. This has nothing whatsoever to do with supporting Israel. I know plenty of neutrals who are horrified at their disproportionate response to 7th October and who want to see Netanyahu and his ultra right wing government removed. They, and I, also want to see the extremist faction of Hamas removed. You are welcome to pick a side and believe that you are right but please don’t put words into other people’s mouths are pretend that they support Israel’s actions. The reality of the situation is that without the attack by Hamas on 7th October we would not be looking at a destroyed Gaza today. That is absolutely not condoning some Israelis actions against Palestinian people and the Israeli ignoring of UN directives. In another forum I am called an antisemite because I have been critical of Netanyahu and the IDF. Here I get labelled as Islamophobic because I criticise Islamic terrorists. It does nobody any favours to throw lazy labels around over a very complex and inflammatory situation that has defied attempts to find a peaceful solution for millennia. And yes I agree, there are not two sides to genocide but to use another unhelpful but true statement, if you stir up a hornets nest, expect to be stung.
The Israeli response has been disproportionate but they were never going to let the attack of 7th October go unpunished. Has gave those who want the Palestinians gone a perfect excuse to do exactly what is happening at the moment.
Being neutral and wanting both sides to stop the violence is not supporting Israel. Please stop with this nonsense.

Moley, you have an exception talent of saying a lot, yet saying nothing at all.

What's the point of asking for a peaceful solution when you're failing to acknowledge that one side, as the occupying force, has the power to end this tomorrow by agreeing to a ceasefire and giving the other side equal rights and statehood?

 

[Charlotte1993]

It's funny to say this ~wouldn't be happening~ had it not been for October the 7th, when in reality it has been happening for decade upon decade - Palestinians detained without charge (ie kidnapped), being murdered on the daily, being driven out of their homes, the constant violence or threat thereof. It's just that Israelis were perpetrating it so it was allowed. The minute Hamas treats their lives in the same way the Israelis have treated the Palestinians, suddenly a 'hornet's nest' has been stirred up and Hamas are blamed for the genocidal words and deeds of the Israeli governmnet.

Exactly and since when is keeping 2.3 millions people locked up behind a wall controlling what they eat and their electricity and water and movement acceptable?
Isn’t that a concentration camp with perks ?
Come on this is 2024 even South Africa didn’t do that tit and they were sanctioned by the world and called out and they didn’t lock millions inside an enclave. It’s unbelievable that this was ever allowed to happen at all in my humble opinion it’s heinous.

 

[ordinaryjelly]

Just saw the footage again of the little girl that was trapped yesterday evening. Huge square blocks pinning her upper body and head down.

The fear that must cause. How does anyone get over that? When she had some breathing room, she was shouting for her mama. The rescuers were saying mamas coming, but of course, her mama is dead 🥹

In the picture, you can see her right leg to the left of the picture. The rescuers left arm is at her torso. Her whole head and upper body is under huge blocks of rubble.
---
Thankfully this poor baby looks like she’ll make a physical recovery.

For the hard of reading/comprehension;

Photo shows a young Palestinian girl, around 3 or 4 years old, suffering from significant head injuries as the result of being collateral damage for the most moral Israeli army in the world. Silly wee toot, in the wrong place at the wrong time huh!

I saw that video and was holding my breath wondering what condition her head would be in once they got her out. Thankfully (not the right word at s?all) she just looked to have one area of laceration.

But that poor little girl, and she is just one of thousands, what does the future hold for these little ones? 🥹

 

[Charlotte1993]

I saw that video and was holding my breath wondering what condition her head would be in once they got her out. Thankfully (not the right word at s?all) she just looked to have one area of laceration.

But that poor little girl, and she is just one of thousands, what does the future hold for these little ones? 🥹

I know right, when I was a child a girl in my class died and it was hailed as a tragedy and the whole neighbourhood and school were traumatised by her passing and it was a tragedy she cut her hand on a rusty barbed wire fence and I don’t remember the exact details but she got very ill from the small Injury and eventually died, I just remember my parents forbidding us from using the park and not long after the fence was replaced. It made me think of the children in Gaza and the thousands of little ones that have been killed and not accidentally but on purpose and in horrendous circumstances and yet some people think that’s okay ?
It’s not OKAY they are all a tragedy and the Palestinians are equally traumatised and to think otherwise is just dehumanisation period.

 

[Ennui]

 

[IBH8-8]

 

[Dogmuck]

this is devastating. Warning he describes in graphic detail, it’s audio so AirPods if necessary. This English surgeon is obviously Hamas


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In the west kids are getting brutalised by police and Zionists, losing job offers, their education etc for sitting on a lawn asking to stop a genocide…meanwhile in Israel this is what the young people are doing and nobody is saying tit. Which one is Netanyahu?
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And now they are setting fire to Palestinian land in the West Bank - crops & trees while being protected - this will be Netanyahu and the IDF obviously


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[avabella]

But they’re looking for hostages, right?

 

[Ennui]

This is interesting. From 1983!!

 

[ordinaryjelly]

Still nothing from Bisan. 🥹

I pray wherever she is safe and is just out of Egyptian esim range.

 

[Wee Nora]

This has absolutely broken me

 

[Veronicaaa]

It is just bleeping UNBELIEVABLE that this is still going on, that it's getting worse, and that people are either defending it or ignoring it. THEY'RE TRAPPED IN THERE WITH NO FOOD OR WATER AND BEING SYSTEMATICALLY KILLED. What the duck is wrong with people, what the duck is wrong with the world?