Constance Marten and Mark Gordon Case #3

[Tangent Tiger]

I'm sure there is potential for the chosen psychiatrists to provide complex diagnoses for the pair of them. To explain and excuse why they disposed of baby Victoria as they did.

Gives you the shudders

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

Post mortem will confirm if that is true. She either died of an infection, starvation or exposure

I hope so. The initial PM couldn’t confirm a cause of death.

 

[thisisme20]

Sorry, what was the point of today then? The exact same thing happened a few weeks ago. Can someone explain?

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

Ah it says reporting restrictions

I think they’ll plead guilty

There’s another case listed there today, I just cropped the screenshot, it wasn’t clear which case had the restrictions (but I’d assume it’s about other children)

 

[Ray_of_Sunshine]

I’m pretty sure when they were charged it was with concealing birth but not death and that was because it was one and the same.
Will see if I can find it.

ETA yes - concealing birth by concealing death

View attachment 2068481

Offences Against the Person Act 1861

www.legislation.gov.uk

Sorry if I sound thick but how has she not concealed the birth from 5th January?? Why is it from 27th to 27th February? Or has it been mis-reported re. the placenta?

 

[Pumpkin84]

I just went looking, and in case anyone else finds it interesting, MG has at least four different profiles, one of which has over 3000 friends, and none of the profiles are friends with CM. I was surprised because I assumed he’d likely be a friendless recluse, but I guess he could be accepting bot accounts.

I had tried searching for him on facebook but couldn't find him, what name did you search?

 

[rainbowtapirs]

ETA wonder if they might say that the baby was stillborn, to avoid the manslaughter charge. That won’t work, though, because the taxi driver heard her cry.

Just theorising, but I wonder if they could try to claim it was SIDS if the next post mortem doesn’t yield a preventable cause of death.

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

When does this case start?

2nd January unless anything changes last minute.

Don’t know if MG has a new lawyer yet though!

 

[heretoreaditall2019]

No it’s the same but being on remand means you have far more privileges.
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I don’t get this? Surely concealment of birth is from the birth itself? If the placenta was found January 5th she was obviously born on or around that date?

Sorry I assumed that the original poster had mistyped as yeah, the baby has to have been born before Jan 5th if the placenta was found on that date. So assuming a Jan 5th birth that would have made the baby 3-6 weeks at death.

Thank you @Dogmuck

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

Delayed until 15th Jan now

Trial of aristocrat Constance Marten and partner Mark Gordon delayed

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon have pleaded not guilty to manslaughter over the death of their newborn

www.independent.co.uk

Thank you, I’d missed that

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

especially when it became sick

Do you know something that wasn’t reported?

 

[neroli]

We are very much a novelty in the home ed community tbh. My kids don't have SEN (although I suspect one is neurodiverse but I don't think it presents as strongly because he doesn't have the challenges he would at school). But we are very pro science, pro vax, not crunchy at all. We largely home ed because the kids are very bright and were getting bored at school, and because there are several things about the UK state school system I don't like which I won't go into as irrelevant. But I have no ideological opposition to school, don't think they are indoctrination factories, don't believe in any conspiracy theories. We have found a few others like us but they are few and far between if I'm honest.

Marten and Gordon don't seem that far removed in terms of their ideologies to several parents I know personally.

Could you imagine those parents doing what M and G planned and did though?

 

[Haveyouanywool]

Is it quite normal to sentence a juvenile to that length of time in the states? This was obviously back in the 80s, did they do mental health assessments prior to sentencing back then, especially given that a 14 year old commited such a terrible crime. I just think theres an awful lot more to all this.
I agree with what someone else said too about the possibility that CM and MG are trauma bonded, they just seem so mismatched that thats the only thing that makes sense.

I’ve no idea, but it was a horrendous crime, so I don’t think it would be too outrageous, for the States.
Did he get out early for good behaviour and/or participating in rehabilitation programs? Because he appeared to be a reformed character? Or a ‘technicality’.
Trauma bonding could be a possibility.

 

[Haveyouanywool]

Next week at the Old Bailey..

Is that when CM’s barrister will ask for bail?

 

[Aberscot]

Looks like the trial has been adjourned until 12.30. Wondering why?

The reporter could have said why! Or maybe not allowed…
Not much to report so far, didnt even say what they were wearing today !

 

[4FoxAche]

Thank you for sharing that!

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

I don’t get this? Surely concealment of birth is from the birth itself? If the placenta was found January 5th she was obviously born on or around that date?

Is it because the crime includes the death when it’s an infant? I think the concealment of death isn’t standalone for an infant as I would be for an older child or adult.
So this date window refers to the death?

(I’m not sure, just thinking out loud really!)

 

[ploddertoo]

Are these two due in court again soon

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

We have private healthcare and I’ve both a) spoken to a private GP who offered a psychiatrist referral if I wanted (outside of the v obvious CBT/trauma therapy I need lol which is what I took the referral for) but it was said more as a “if you want it” thing and b) approached a private MH hospital as a patient and been told I’ve got to have 2 psychiatrist appts before they’ll recommend a course of action. So it varies I guess?

My psych is private because I have healthcare via work and my GP said the NHS waiting list for psychiatry care was long. I needed to be seen quickly as amongst other things the GP needed additional prescribing authority.
I was seen straight away, and treatment suggested in first appointment, but as my therapy is via the same place that probably helped.

The one I see is bloody amazing. My healthcare provider won’t pay any more so I’m now self-funding () because he’s so good and I don’t want to change.
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Not at all. I think she would deny having an MH issue and would not want to take psychotropic meds or be "controlled" in that way. That;s just my view of course. You need to be disciplined to adhere to a complex meds regime. No factual evidence that she has an MH condition of course so I'm just speculating.
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I think you only need a GP referral if you use private healthcare?

I don’t know, I guess it depends on the condition and the impact it has on your life, compared to your life when you’re on meds. The difference can be night and day, and mean that you can actually have a life.

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

Just theorising, but I wonder if they could try to claim it was SIDS if the next post mortem doesn’t yield a preventable cause of death.

I don’t know if they would still be charged with manslaughter in that case, for not providing a safe sleep environment or something like that.