The Ordinary azelaic acid at £5.50 has transformed my skin.“You can’t get get a cheap product with active ingredients in it”
I just can’t.....
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If someone tags her on Instagram and anyone says anything in the ensuing comment thread that challenges her Skincare Queen status, she will wade in more often than not. I think she watches her mentions like a hawk. She's clearly very invested in her image and cannot abide ANY dissent. No shock given she basically encourages a cult around herself like no other. Vile woman.She sees these things because sometimes ‘fans’ or freaks see people comment on her and helpfully forward it to herThen she will choose whether to wade in with her size 10 gazelles, or not, as the case may be.
In my view, especially the example above, it just makes her look desperate. She wasn’t involved in the conversation, it was just people having a general chat, let them chat, why try and justify your behaviour
Honestly still making myself chuckling thinkiong of it the next day. Thankfully none of the boomers in my life know who Caroline isHyram for Boomers omfgtitle for next thread
I believe I'm a "boomer" - no thanks!Honestly still making myself chuckling thinkiong of it the next day. Thankfully none of the boomers in my life know who Caroline is
Someone pointed out that all her kit hints are Mean Girl quotes - how apt!
so disappointed Ultrasun are ‘official spf sponsors’ 
of the boxCerave does 200ml of the best moisturizer my very reactive skin has ever encountered for at the moment for £6.50 on Amazon. Altruist which has the best filters out there does two SPF50 100ml for £8 or two 200ml SPPF 30 for £8.75. There are supermarket sunscreens that are very good that cost even less. Of course, it's possible to cost less when you don't spend huge money on advertising bugdets, spokesmodels, fancy packaging, and endlessly giving away product, parties, free trips to silly places and cash in huge amounts to influencers. Most skincare ingredients are not expensive at all, in fact many great ingredients are dirt cheap.
I've seen Caroline push the idea that any cleanser under £20 is not 'an investment in your face' kind of thing. Just pulled that amount out of her arse as if the price equates directly with the ability of a product to clean your face. That's the mercenary, manipulative, greedy saleswoman in her, appealing to guilt and emotion, telling customers they don't care about their skin if they don't spend x-amount on the product she wants to sell and make money from. She's utterly abominable, and I don't get why more people don't see through her because it's so obvious with everything she does that she doesn't care about your bank balance or your skin, she mainly cares about her bottom line. She's the counter saleswoman who'll push a whole unsuitable line on a customer with promises and guilt trips and underhand insults, because she's getting commission on every product she sells.
That cleanser under £20 claim is ridiculous. We’ve been told for years that cleanser is definitely something you can save on, because it spends hardly any time on your skin.
my favourite cleanser is actually Anne French, gets everything off and is the only thing that works for my skin when it gets all wintry and eczema-y.
ETA: if the story is true, Brandon Truaxe (RIP) started The Ordinary when he saw a beauty company’s accounts and how huge their markup was.
my favourite cleanser is actually Anne French, gets everything off and is the only thing that works for my skin when it gets all wintry and eczema-y.
ETA: if the story is true, Brandon Truaxe (RIP) started The Ordinary when he saw a beauty company’s accounts and how huge their markup was.
Haha, I remember Anne French! Very 80s! Didn't realise it was still around! My standard reliable cleanser is Simple's Purifying Cleansing Lotion. Can buy it for under £2 where I live. No wonder Simple is on CH's 'Cliff' list. I like their Refreshing Facial Wash Gel too, for mornings. Very, very mild, no foaming, but cleans my face of the night's oils and so on without any stripping effect. Again, around £2. Look at me, not 'caring' about my skin, by using products that help keep it calm and unirritated, for chump change. What a loser, eh?
I really like Avene's Extremely Gentle Cleanser too, especially in winter when my face tends to get very dehydrated and annoyed by central heating and environmental issues like low humidity. Obviously more expensive than Simple but nowhere near £20 a bottle.
Yeah, never tried The Ordinary, but it's obvious from their success that you can do 'actives' for pretty damn cheap.
Another thing which massively helped my face was ditching foaming cleansers. I don't like balms or creams either. Surprisingly the one which works best is Dermol 500 eczema handwash which I was already using on my sore hands - half a litre for about a tenner.
Thanks for the heads up on this, I needed a new tube and was waiting for an offer!
I used Dermol for years! Mostly the moisturizer, but I used the wash for a bit too in the shower.
I was initially given a sample of it by a nurse at the NHS hospital dermatology unit during a period of very inflamed skin on my face I was under treatment for (seborrheic dermatitis + rosacea) and it worked a treat so I got it prescribed, then kept buying it later myself as I could get 500ml online for the same cost of a prescription which gave me a smaller tube. I think it was the anti-bacterial action that was needed, you know how bacteria can get deep into cracks in very sore inflamed skin and cause diabolical itching? The itching subsided massively after the first application for me. It was like a miracle, the relief. I haven't needed anything like it for a good long while now, thankfully, my skin is in the best condition of my life these days, but it was a lifesaver when I did.
My skin also abhors balms. Anything that requires heat and endless wiping will duck up my skin barrier massively (so piss off hot cloth this or greasy thick cleansing balm that). What my oily/dehydrated/reactive type of facial skin actually loves is a simple, gentle go-over with a mild, unfragranced soap (I know, heresy) once a day after removing make-up if I wore it, and my sunscreen with my normal cleanser, ensuring there is no irritating greasy cosmetic residue left behind. Residue from cleansers and so on really messes with my skin like nothing else. Then I put on a good bland moisturizer (Cerave) and that's the recipe for the best skin of my life, no outbreaks of inflammation or redness anymore even though I have rosacea. I will occasionally use acids depending on what's going on, find them useful in winter more than anything, but I don't sleep in them, just let them work a few minutes, then rinse it off. I have this routine approved by an NHS consultant too. He did tell me that he sees many issues caused by the beauty industry encouraging people to pile stuff onto their faces and then doing anything but getting people to just wash their faces and leave them alone, so to speak.
My skin also abhors balms. Anything that requires heat and endless wiping will duck up my skin barrier massively (so piss off hot cloth this or greasy thick cleansing balm that). What my oily/dehydrated/reactive type of facial skin actually loves is a simple, gentle go-over with a mild, unfragranced soap (I know, heresy) once a day after removing make-up if I wore it, and my sunscreen with my normal cleanser, ensuring there is no irritating greasy cosmetic residue left behind. Residue from cleansers and so on really messes with my skin like nothing else. Then I put on a good bland moisturizer (Cerave) and that's the recipe for the best skin of my life, no outbreaks of inflammation or redness anymore even though I have rosacea. I will occasionally use acids depending on what's going on, find them useful in winter more than anything, but I don't sleep in them, just let them work a few minutes, then rinse it off. I have this routine approved by an NHS consultant too. He did tell me that he sees many issues caused by the beauty industry encouraging people to pile stuff onto their faces and then doing anything but getting people to just wash their faces and leave them alone, so to speak.
I've used the Altruist 10% Urea cream (£5 on Amazon) for hands buggered by too much washing and hand sanitizer lately and it's amazing stuff. Also Avene Ciclaplast.
I use the original Cerave cream for my face, but I buy the big 177ml tubes rather than a tub (don’t like the idea of dipping my fingers in) and I just stocked up the other day when Look Fantastic had an offer on.
You’re absolutely right, there’s no need to spend a tonne on decent skincare, good quality products are all around us at great prices. Hirons is misleading people into thinking they have to spend half their pay packet every month, and have every new product that is launched.
Well, it's that culty thing again. One feature of a cult is that it will take up more and more of your time and energy, not to mention money, the deeper you get into it.
Anyway, I generally loathe her and all her works, but I will give her props for allowing actual dermatologists to have their say on her site about sunscreen use after the Paltrow debacle. I know she's always been well behind the times with regard to sun protection, and is clearly desperately trying to paper over and correct that, maybe with the hope of getting paid by sunscreen companies (the Ultarsun sponsorship, hello?) but I'd hope even if it's done with her own image in mind it will get the proper info out there.
Thought this was the best statement on her site. Would be interesting to see what other trends and misinformation derms would correct if she gave them the platform on her site.
Dr Beibei Du-Harpur, Dermatology Registrar and Clinical Research Fellow
MRCP (Derm) MBBChir MA (Cantab) PGCert ClinEd
Based in London
Instagram: dermatology_demystified
The burden of skin cancers on NHS dermatology services cannot be underestimated.
Referrals and cases of skin cancer are increasing year-on-year, and this has led to dermatology services pivoting to expand their skin cancer services.
If you have struggled to see an NHS dermatologist for your acne, rosacea, eczema or non skin cancer related concern, this is a big reason why. There are not very many dermatologists in the UK per head, and an enormous amount of our time is now spent dealing with suspected skin cancer. It is true that non-melanoma skin cancers are less dangerous. However, squamous cell carcinoma can be deadly, and treatments of these skin cancers often involve facial surgery, resulting in permanent scars. Most of these skin cancers appear as skin ages, and those who have one skin cancer will usually continue to have more – leading to constant visits to the dermatologist for treatments. This is not how you want to spend your retirement.
Since the 70s, we have come to understand so much more about how dangerous ultraviolet (UV) radiation is, and how important it is to limit our exposure to promote longevity and health of the skin. However, sun seeking behaviours continue to be the norm, despite public health messages. We now know there is no such thing as a ‘healthy tan’ – it’s an oxymoron from a skin health perspective. Healthy skin is facilitated by sun protective behaviour. This includes: avoiding or limiting exposure to sun at high UV index, seeking shade, wearing sun protective clothing such as a wide-brimmed hat, and using broad-spectrum sunscreens. In the past year I have noticed a worrying trend of hesitancy over sunscreen use due to purported ‘toxic chemicals’. This is misinformation spread by commercial organisations. UV radiation is so harmful to skin that humans have evolved an entire DNA repair mechanism to address the damage it causes. The risk from sunscreen is unproven and when theoretical concerns have been raised, scientists at regulatory bodies have evaluated the risk and determined it to be irrelevant in real-world use settings. I have no doubt in safety of the products on our shelves, used according to instructions. On the other hand, the risk from UV is well-established scientifically. It is a grade I carcinogen.
It is important to be aware that sunscreen work because they contain chemicals (inorganic, or organic) with the ability to absorb dangerous wavelengths of energy. It is a product (in the USA, it is considered a drug) with a dose; 2mg of product for each cm2 skin, to achieve the sun protection factor (SPF) stated on the bottle; this is related to the testing standards. Therefore, there is a relationship between its absorptive power and the amount applied. Inadequate application means significant reduction in protective factor. Furthermore, research has shown that people apply woefully inadequate quantities of sunscreen (even when they know they are being assessed on their application!). Studies have also shown that sun-seeking behaviours are incredibly ingrained; they even persist despite a melanoma diagnosis. There is also data suggesting that high SPF sunscreens are used to facilitate sun-seeking behaviour, which, taking into account that true SPF on skin is nowhere near what it is on the bottle due to inadequate application, extremely dangerous.
Time after time, patients report tanning and burning despite using sunscreen – this is because it is being used incorrectly, or as part of a sun seeking behaviour pattern. Our public health message is clear: use sunscreen liberally, as part of sun protective behaviour.
We, and patients who see us, could seriously do without large platforms contradicting our message and misleading the public.
Dr Beibei Du-Harpur, Dermatology Registrar and Clinical Research Fellow
MRCP (Derm) MBBChir MA (Cantab) PGCert ClinEd
Based in London
Instagram: dermatology_demystified
The burden of skin cancers on NHS dermatology services cannot be underestimated.
Referrals and cases of skin cancer are increasing year-on-year, and this has led to dermatology services pivoting to expand their skin cancer services.
If you have struggled to see an NHS dermatologist for your acne, rosacea, eczema or non skin cancer related concern, this is a big reason why. There are not very many dermatologists in the UK per head, and an enormous amount of our time is now spent dealing with suspected skin cancer. It is true that non-melanoma skin cancers are less dangerous. However, squamous cell carcinoma can be deadly, and treatments of these skin cancers often involve facial surgery, resulting in permanent scars. Most of these skin cancers appear as skin ages, and those who have one skin cancer will usually continue to have more – leading to constant visits to the dermatologist for treatments. This is not how you want to spend your retirement.
Since the 70s, we have come to understand so much more about how dangerous ultraviolet (UV) radiation is, and how important it is to limit our exposure to promote longevity and health of the skin. However, sun seeking behaviours continue to be the norm, despite public health messages. We now know there is no such thing as a ‘healthy tan’ – it’s an oxymoron from a skin health perspective. Healthy skin is facilitated by sun protective behaviour. This includes: avoiding or limiting exposure to sun at high UV index, seeking shade, wearing sun protective clothing such as a wide-brimmed hat, and using broad-spectrum sunscreens. In the past year I have noticed a worrying trend of hesitancy over sunscreen use due to purported ‘toxic chemicals’. This is misinformation spread by commercial organisations. UV radiation is so harmful to skin that humans have evolved an entire DNA repair mechanism to address the damage it causes. The risk from sunscreen is unproven and when theoretical concerns have been raised, scientists at regulatory bodies have evaluated the risk and determined it to be irrelevant in real-world use settings. I have no doubt in safety of the products on our shelves, used according to instructions. On the other hand, the risk from UV is well-established scientifically. It is a grade I carcinogen.
It is important to be aware that sunscreen work because they contain chemicals (inorganic, or organic) with the ability to absorb dangerous wavelengths of energy. It is a product (in the USA, it is considered a drug) with a dose; 2mg of product for each cm2 skin, to achieve the sun protection factor (SPF) stated on the bottle; this is related to the testing standards. Therefore, there is a relationship between its absorptive power and the amount applied. Inadequate application means significant reduction in protective factor. Furthermore, research has shown that people apply woefully inadequate quantities of sunscreen (even when they know they are being assessed on their application!). Studies have also shown that sun-seeking behaviours are incredibly ingrained; they even persist despite a melanoma diagnosis. There is also data suggesting that high SPF sunscreens are used to facilitate sun-seeking behaviour, which, taking into account that true SPF on skin is nowhere near what it is on the bottle due to inadequate application, extremely dangerous.
Time after time, patients report tanning and burning despite using sunscreen – this is because it is being used incorrectly, or as part of a sun seeking behaviour pattern. Our public health message is clear: use sunscreen liberally, as part of sun protective behaviour.
We, and patients who see us, could seriously do without large platforms contradicting our message and misleading the public.
The last sentence, haha. Basically that WAS CH with regard to suncare only a few years ago,
Her scheduling is shocking. Why not do it over the bank holiday weekend when (most) people have more time to pay attention? No, let's schedule it for the day everyone returns to work. Idiotic.
Im no dr dray fan but even she says that morning cleansing isn’t necessary and that washing the face with water is completely fine (i prefer to cleanse in the morning as well) and that you dont need to splash out when cleansers are washed off the face in less than 60 seconds. So why the hell would i buy a cleanser for more than £20 when i use it twice a day?? Kinda like sunscreen i go through it so quick i can only buy the sunscreen when its on offer for £13
This woman grinds my gears so bad
This woman grinds my gears so bad
thread title suggestion:Hyram for Boomers omfg
Caroline Hirons: Hyram for Boomers, shilling products to rabid consumers
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