Caitlin Moran #2 She’s just insulting everyone’s intelligence now

[NomDeGuerre]

Why is she so obsessed with genitalia? In my social circle of reasonably well-adjusted adults, I don’t know any woman who’d define their feminism by how often they wank or any man confident in their non-toxic masculinity who’d conflate that with happily chatting dick size with their nearest and dearest.

As with her treatise on feminism, Moron has resolutely failed to address the socio-economic factors that have a bearing on how masculinity is codified and displayed in the UK.

She is the walking, talking personification of the London media bubble. If you ain’t straight, white, knocking 50 and living in an Islington town house, she literally cannot begin to fathom your viewpoint.

 

[Mselvista]

And there is another wierd thing. She says she knows of no books written about men's feelings or boys growing into men.

As I saw pointed out on twitter, her husband wrote one

 

[PunkyMonkey]

As I saw pointed out on twitter, her husband wrote one

That tracks. Can absolutely imagine her being too self absorbed to know what her husband is actually writing, I think she believes she's the talent?

 

[Vanelope]

I always think she feels very superior to Pete, like she is the cool one and he is the nerd, rather than them both being middle aged and he being an actual music journalist rather than an obnoxious opinion machine.

 

[coolcapitalist]

I don’t want to dox myself but i was briefly in her orbit through dating one of her friends, went to dinner parties at hers etc. She was a great host tbf but the picture you are building is accurate and we’ve all met people like her irl, who think they are the most fascinating person in the room and their default is to broadcast at people rather than converse, if that makes sense. Not my cup of tea.

 

[SharkAttack]

I came across her in the noughties and your description of her ‘broadcasting at’ people rather than actually engaging with them is spot on @coolcapitalist

And that was 20 odd years ago before she got her column at The Times - can only imagine how much worse she’s got since!
---
Love Kathleen Stock

What does Caitlin Moran know about men?

There isn't just one type of masculinity

unherd.com

 

[Shimmering]

Everyone's lining up to have a pop

No, Caitlin Moran: men do talk about their feelings – and birthday parties, and plaits | Gaby Hinsliff

Modern masculinity is increasingly about opening up, says Guardian columnist Gaby Hinsliff

www.theguardian.com

 

[SqualorVictoria]

Brilliant review from Dr Stock

It's really not going the way Caitlin expected, is it? I bet she thought she'd be celebrated for 'breaking taboos' or whatever

 

[jobackhorsewoman]

I came across her in the noughties and your description of her ‘broadcasting at’ people rather than actually engaging with them is spot on @coolcapitalist

And that was 20 odd years ago before she got her column at The Times - can only imagine how much worse she’s got since!
---
Love Kathleen Stock

What does Caitlin Moran know about men?

There isn't just one type of masculinity

unherd.com

I find her expressions in photos so infuriating. Shut yer gob!

 

[PineappleQueen19]

Interesting thread by Otegha, love it when someone addresses the elephant in the room

 

[SharkAttack]

Has 'the tide turned against' her though, or is she just getting some deservedly crap reviews for a crap book she's churned out?

 

[emeraldopal]

I've been reading and thinking up more and more examples of men doing the things she confidently asserts they are not doing. Men don't talk about parenting? Parenting Hell is one of the most successful podcasts going atm, fronted by...two men

I do think she raises valid and valuable points from the extracts I've seen - but this blanket announcement that men don't talk about anything is really hurting her message and her cause

 

[SqualorVictoria]

Has 'the tide turned against' her though, or is she just getting some deservedly crap reviews for a crap book she's churned out?

That's it exactly. We live in strange times where a lot of people think you must either love or hate every single thing a person does, no in between. I mean, one of the reviews said there were 5 funny writers and CM is one of them. They even praised how to be a woman. So it's not like that reviewer dislikes her overall, they just think the book is a load of nonsense

 

[Sideboard Bob]

Has 'the tide turned against' her though, or is she just getting some deservedly crap reviews for a crap book she's churned out?

I think it’s the fact that she’s always taken her own narrow world view and applied it to everything, and it’s only now it’s getting noticed by so many people.

 

[Jelly Bean]

Her easily disprovable wrong sweeping statements, about men and women, just don't do her any favours. And make her whole thesis seem so flimsy.
It's hard reading a book, even if there are good bits when you are thinking 'well that's just wrong'.
I think it is in the Stock review where she points out the plethora of podcasts men do now talking about both mental health and parenting. Russell Kane, Josh Widdecombe and several others all have 'Dad' podcasts. I know they are celebrities but the podcasts must have general appeal or they wouldn't survive.
Too often it is easy to think of many exceptions to her rule of 'NO MEN do xyz which is why I, a gobby tired woman, am having to'.
It would be like a well meaning man saying 'no women talk about the menopause as it is still so taboo so I will' while numerous people are scratching their heads, showing examples going 'eh?' as the man blunders on 'no no I'm the expert here - I've discovered the problem'.

This isn't even covering the hundreds of examples of coming of age books, films, TV programmes about boys I'm sure we can all think of that I expect Moran reckons simply don't exist. And also ones where the relationship between male FRIENDS is portrayed sensitively. One of the most important programmes I watched when my daughter was small was Thirtysomething - and that was in the 80s.

(Sorry this got long . She annoys me so much that once I start I can't stop with 'oh and another thing.....')

 

[depository]

Her easily disprovable wrong sweeping statements, about men and women, just don't do her any favours. And make her whole thesis seem so flimsy.
It's hard reading a book, even if there are good bits when you are thinking 'well that's just wrong'.
I think it is in the Stock review where she points out the plethora of podcasts men do now talking about both mental health and parenting. Russell Brand, Josh Widdecombe and several others all have 'Dad' podcasts. I know they are celebrities but the podcasts must have general appeal or they wouldn't survive.
Too often it is easy to think of many exceptions to her rule of 'NO MEN do xyz which is why I, a gobby tired woman, am having to'.
It would be like a well meaning man saying 'no women talk about the menopause as it is still so taboo so I will' while numerous people are scratching their heads, showing examples going 'eh?' as the man blunders on 'no no I'm the expert here - I've discovered the problem'.

This isn't even covering the hundreds of examples of coming of age books, films, TV programmes about boys I'm sure we can all think of that I expect Moran reckons simply don't exist. And also ones where the relationship between male FRIENDS is portrayed sensitively. One of the most important programmes I watched when my daughter was small was Thirtysomething - and that was in the 80s.

(Sorry this got long . She annoys me so much that once I start I can't stop with 'oh and another thing.....')

Moran said on Fi Glover’s and Jane Garvey’s podcast yesterday that five years ago no one was talking about the menopause. She seems unable to fathom that just because she hasn’t heard something discussed, it doesn’t mean it hasn’t been or isn’t being

 

[Jelly Bean]

Moran said on Fi Glover’s and Jane Garvey’s podcast yesterday that five years ago no one was talking about the menopause. She seems unable to fathom that just because she hasn’t heard something discussed, it doesn’t mean it hasn’t been or isn’t being

Omg she did not
Please tell me they challenged her on that? Surely Jane Garvey did as she was on Woman's Hour for years and it has always been discussed regularly there.
She just can't grasp the difference between something being a bit zeitgeisty (which menopause is at the moment) to it never being discussed before at all.

 

[SqualorVictoria]

Only one review on Amazon and it's one star

 

[SharkAttack]

Moran said on Fi Glover’s and Jane Garvey’s podcast yesterday that five years ago no one was talking about the menopause. She seems unable to fathom that just because she hasn’t heard something discussed, it doesn’t mean it hasn’t been or isn’t being

I like their podcast but had to give that one a swerve when I saw she was on it.

 

[depository]

I like their podcast but had to give that one a swerve when I saw she was on it.

I don’t like their new gig as much as I did Fortunately. Maybe I’m misremembering but with Fortunately the guests were just on to chat and were rarely promoting anything, whereas the new podcast all the guests are promoting something. I guess it’s because the interviews are just cut from their radio show.

Also the adverts, but that’s not their fault. I do find Jane’s anti-men schtick wearing at times. Appreciated she got quite publicly cheated on by Adrian Chiles (I think) but she seems to have a very low opinion of men.