I'd never heard of Joanne before I'd started listening to their podcast and I was probably late to the game with their podcast. Before I knew anything about her, I just thought she was a gas friend of Vogue's. It was like you were listening in on a girlie chat while I was out for walks on my own because of the covid lockdowns as restrictions. When I started listening it was like Vogue was the rich successful one while Joanne was the mate who borrowed her clothes and eyed up her gifted pr stuff. It does feel that since I first started listening that the dynamic between them has changed, and that Joanne is now no longer this unknown friend of Vogue's.