No one seems to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory more than Harry. He is an absolute plonker.
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I think H is not the only one suing in this case though. So if the other two parties have more convincing examples he might win by just being part of it.
what.. you mean you DON'T leave hour long messages to people where you talk about all your secrets and salacious info?!
Well, emails and text messages were less of a thing then - loads of people didn't have an email address and texts were limited characters and charged per text. A friend of my brother's blames phone hacking for getting dumped by Claudia Schiffer - she got papped topless while they were on holiday together and she refused to believe he hadn't tipped off the photographer to where they were staying, so binned him. He reckons her phone was hacked and someone listened to messages from him talking about the holiday.
No you do not have to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt. That is for criminal courts. Civil courts like this only require balance of probability. As the Mirror has already admitted hacking him once and apologised for it he is already half way there.
I would say that he should win. Like you said the Mirror have admitted to hacking him, they’ve admitted hacking others and paid out millions of pounds. There is a high balance of probability here.
The problem is that "they did it before" isn't so good a piece of proof that it can prove on a balance of probability that they hacked where the stories ran in different papers the day prior, or similar.
Even for a balance of probability outcome there needs to be strength to speculative accusations, and what's being reported on sounds like they chose weak examples.
While I think we can all agree that the press are too invasive, and that yes, they have previously hacked phones, that's not the question at hand. Harry's team need to prove, on balance of probability, that they did it to him (and the others, who hopefully have stronger cases) when accused.
If they've gone after MGN for articles and periods in which the speculative evidence is simply too weak, they in some ways undermine the previously proven examples of MGN being scummy, and give them something to point to as being victims. That would not be a good outcome.
I have just read Harry's full witness statement and it makes thoroughly depressing reading. The court will be looking at 50 examples* from him and his lawyers citing reasonable suspicions of what MGN was up to. Some of them are a bit flimsy but the sheer weight of them all is distressing. I was expecting to find the witness statement flimsier and I am now rather cross with the BBC for in no way managing to get across just how damning the whole thing is. If the other 3 participants in the case can produce similar, MGN is going to look very stinky indeed and could be landed with an enormous bill. No wonder they have employed such a notoriously unpleasant barrister, I am wondering if that might have been a mistake. We should also remember that MGN fought tooth and nail to get the whole thing struck out. I can now see why they would have been desperate to do so. I have also gained an understanding of why Harry has become so paranoid.
* just a percentage of the whole.
Prince Harry’s claims... and how they were challenged
The Telegraph examines the courtroom battle so far
These are the strongest articles they have? Most of the stuff in them appeared in other papers before they were printed by MGN and in some cases the information was provided by Harry himself in an interview
So I am not very familiar with legal matters. The lawsuit if I got it correctly is made by a group of personalities. How does it work if some cases are stronger in term of evidences than others? How does the judge make an appreciation of who is a victim, who is not? Or it doesn't matter as long as some evidences are convincing?
I wondered this, could Harry just add a couple of his friends on to the case who want some money? It doesn’t seem he has any proof of phone hacking so could they just say it was their phone that was hacked for stories?
Mirror Group Newspapers are being sued or whatnot by Harry, Michael Le Vell (Kevin in Corrie) and Nikki Sanderson (Hollyoaks ?)
Again, he doesn't need absolute proof. He needs balance of probability (over 50%). All he has to do is show a likely pattern of unethical/unlawful/illegal behaviour by MGN. As he has already had an apology from them for one instance he is well on his way. Also remember that we have only heard questioning from MGN's barrister who is nicknamed 'The Beast' because of his attitide to the people he questions. So far Harry seems to be coping pretty well in that he is not raising his voice, evading questions or losing his temper which is what the barrister would be hoping for.
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And Paul Whitehouse's ex wife.
The full witness statement is sad, but, then you can also read the article by Jan Moir, that says that in her opinion, Harry didnt always get negative stories written about him, so he is cherry picking the ones that do show just one side of the story.
My biggest issue in this whole sorry mess, is that I honestly dont think H was important enough to hack. maybe he was unlucky enough to be hacked by accident, but almost all of these stories are fillers. A spare couple of inches.....what can we add in here...oh I know, a puff piece about Prince Harry breaking his thumb.
These kind of stories dont need hacking, they just need educated guesses. Young man breaks thumb, doctors general advice would be to rest it for 2 weeks, and the Mirror, or People, run a story.
I do think its sad that H had such a depressing and unhappy childhood, and that due to a contractual arrangement, he was born into the Royal family and had his entire life documented in such detail. Its a great example to show that money definitely doesnt bring happiness.
I am no legal expert at all. Im finding the case fascinating, because it is.... And wondering where H is going to end up in the court of public opinion, which ultimately is where his biggest judgements will come from.
I think he is failing badly and even if he wins, this case is going to end up being awful for him! What do others think?
I do absolutely think H was interesting enough to be hacked. And they have already admitted to have done it and apologised. I wouldn’t be surprised if all his examples are the result of this. If they have enough hold for probability is another question. He should win, but I think it might not happen on his “evidence” alone. His examples are not strong enough for that.
However the court rules though- H has lost in the court of publicly opinion. Even though most probably agree that MGN have acted unlawful and their outlets are pretty crappy/bad if at all journalism. He should stop to sell it as his big deed for humanity. Because, let’s face it, ordinary people won’t experience this. He does it for himself, pleading his case to the public and for all the other a-z celebs.
As long as his statements get reported with a certain angle he won’t win real long lasting support and sympathies though. Most people that care about this read up on it in the usual outlets that report in depth on royals and z-celebs. And they won’t report in his favour. The bigger news outlets won’t give it too much time and are therefore not exactly the go to source. At best people think it’s fair he won before they bash his next stupid statement or move.
However the court rules though- H has lost in the court of publicly opinion. Even though most probably agree that MGN have acted unlawful and their outlets are pretty crappy/bad if at all journalism. He should stop to sell it as his big deed for humanity. Because, let’s face it, ordinary people won’t experience this. He does it for himself, pleading his case to the public and for all the other a-z celebs.
As long as his statements get reported with a certain angle he won’t win real long lasting support and sympathies though. Most people that care about this read up on it in the usual outlets that report in depth on royals and z-celebs. And they won’t report in his favour. The bigger news outlets won’t give it too much time and are therefore not exactly the go to source. At best people think it’s fair he won before they bash his next stupid statement or move.
Ah, Kerry Katona had her phone hacked. If they were bothered about her, then there is no way the 3rd in line (at the time) to the throne would have been considered ‘unimportant’ enough to hack. At the time, it didn’t matter who you were, it was just a pretty routine way of getting a story.
Yeah, you can always rely on Jan Moir and the Mail to be straight down the line and unbiased when it comes to Harry. Not.
You have to be deluded or naive if you think Harry wasn't important enough to hack. They hacked plenty of z Listers at the time, Leslie Ash is one that springs to mind for some reason.
You only need to look at the people bringing their case at the same time to see the level of people they were prepared to hack. Is Paul Whitehouse’s wife famous in her own right? I’ve never heard of her and two Corrie actors who are very famous if you watch Corrie but not for anything else
I wouldn't bother to take my umbrella if Jan Moir told me it was raining! And for the umptythird time MGN has already admitted they hacked him once, and apologised, so yes, he obviously was 'important' enough.
I've read Harry's full witness statement and it is indeed depressing. A part of the press is clearly dishonest as they don't mention the evidences brought by Harry's legal team for each example. It would be interesting to know more about those invoices and how they will be treated by the court.
Harry's witness statement made me feel - like his book and the netflix doc - uneasy. It's not only because his life is sad and he went through a lot. I cannot help thinking he is an entitled guy. It's never his fault. Every negative thing that have happened in his life is because of someone's else. His break-up with his ex-girlfriend? I can believe she was under extreme pressure and hated the scrutiny. But it feels too easy to claim the medias were the sole reason for their breakup. What kind of boyfriend goes to a stripclub but cannot make time for his girlfriend who left her life in South Africa to be closer from him? He had a busy schedule but he does seem to be this kind of person not used to make efforts and to be a bit of a prick. The irony is that before reading Harry's witness statement I had no idea about how was his relationship with Chelsy. I didn't care and like many people I don't take seriously gossips from tabloids about famous people. Which brings me to my net thought: Harry claims people believed what they read about him in tabloids. I can see some naive people religiously reading tabloids. But I cannot fanthom educated people from his background believing those things. Anyone with two brain cells knows that tabloids just want to sell and will come with a lot of bs to fill their columns.
I think that blaming the press for the perception that people have of him and for his own actions (saying that because the press made up stories about drugs made him go down that path etc.) is overexaggerated. But as usual Harry looks for a scapegoat for all the things that didn't go well in his life. Few years ago I had quite a neutral view of him. Since he decided to open his mouth to share his truth I have a much more critical view of him. I am sad for him but at the same time all of his attempts to re-shape his public image just made me think how entitled and petulant he is.
Harry's witness statement made me feel - like his book and the netflix doc - uneasy. It's not only because his life is sad and he went through a lot. I cannot help thinking he is an entitled guy. It's never his fault. Every negative thing that have happened in his life is because of someone's else. His break-up with his ex-girlfriend? I can believe she was under extreme pressure and hated the scrutiny. But it feels too easy to claim the medias were the sole reason for their breakup. What kind of boyfriend goes to a stripclub but cannot make time for his girlfriend who left her life in South Africa to be closer from him? He had a busy schedule but he does seem to be this kind of person not used to make efforts and to be a bit of a prick. The irony is that before reading Harry's witness statement I had no idea about how was his relationship with Chelsy. I didn't care and like many people I don't take seriously gossips from tabloids about famous people. Which brings me to my net thought: Harry claims people believed what they read about him in tabloids. I can see some naive people religiously reading tabloids. But I cannot fanthom educated people from his background believing those things. Anyone with two brain cells knows that tabloids just want to sell and will come with a lot of bs to fill their columns.
I think that blaming the press for the perception that people have of him and for his own actions (saying that because the press made up stories about drugs made him go down that path etc.) is overexaggerated. But as usual Harry looks for a scapegoat for all the things that didn't go well in his life. Few years ago I had quite a neutral view of him. Since he decided to open his mouth to share his truth I have a much more critical view of him. I am sad for him but at the same time all of his attempts to re-shape his public image just made me think how entitled and petulant he is.
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