The Death Penalty

[WilmaHun]

Clearly the notion of human rights being inalienable goes over some peoples heads. You cannot differentiate human rights from one person to another. They apply to all. It's not hard to get your head around - if they didn't apply to all then they'd be absolutely pointless! Those at the top would grant themselves whatever rights they liked!

Even where evidence appears "solid" or unwavering new evidence can later come to light! The appeal process has to apply to all in the interests of fairness. The law does not differentiate.

 

[BettyCrocker]

I always think of this case https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derek_Bentley_case

This was in 1952. That’s nearly 70 years ago. Not relevant to a debate for crimes and criminals in 2021

 

[Eltonjohnsflorist]

Killing someone isn’t justice it’s revenge.

you don’t get to decide who is human and who is not. The world is bigger than your view and your view isn’t important. We know what a human is- there is a dictionary definition. It’s not for you to make up your own.

 

[judgejohndeed]

If there is solid unwavering evidence of the crime being committed then why would we allow an appeal?

You don't automatically get a right to an appeal. There has to be something arguable in it, and I mean this in a legal sense. If you are convicted of a crime you don't get an appeal by saying 'I don't like this outcome so I want to appeal'. And if there are objectively legal questions remaining, what is wrong with having an appeal? If you are pro death penalty surely for you it is absolutely crucial that there should be no doubt around someone's conviction so that innocent people are not put to death?

Clearly the notion of human rights being inalienable goes over some peoples heads. You cannot differentiate human rights from one person to another. They apply to all. It's not hard to get your head around - if they didn't apply to all then they'd be absolutely pointless! Those at the top would grant themselves whatever rights they liked!

100% this. If the state could take away people's human rights at their whim there would be absolutely no point in any of us having them and it would be obviously open to state abuse.

 

[The King in the North]

There are 46 crimes that are punishable by death in China. One of them is treason, basically doing anything the government doesn't like, reporting their barbaric crimes against the Muslims. And then cases of robbery, you could litterly forget to pay at the supermarket, and China might kill you if you can't back up your claim.

If there is solid unwavering evidence of the crime being committed then why would we allow an appeal?

Laughing at my post, proves you are letting emotion overthink logic.

 

[BettyCrocker]

“your view is not important”

Get a grip. You are seriously sitting there trying to tell me that a man who RAPES A BABY should be considered human?

 

[WilmaHun]

This was in 1952. That’s nearly 70 years ago. Not relevant to a debate for crimes and criminals in 2021

You do realise our legal system is run on a system of precedents?! Old cases, some from the 1800's STILL impact decisions made in courts today because they created a precedent. I recently studied a criminal case for my degree which was from 1924. Still relevant today.

 

[Eltonjohnsflorist]

There is no such think as solid evidence. Evidence doesn’t exist in a vacuum

 

[BettyCrocker]

There is no such think as solid evidence. Evidence doesn’t exist in a vacuum

Of course there is!!!!!!

 

[Eltonjohnsflorist]

Give me an example of solid evidence, I’ll show you how it’s not solid

 

[The King in the North]

You do realise our legal system is run on a system of precedents?! Old cases, some from the 1800's STILL impact decisions made in courts today because they created a precedent. I recently studied a criminal case for my degree which was from 1924. Still relevant today.

She has no clue about the legal system, apparently. Ched Evans, the footballer, would have been dead due to being found guilty due to rape. A retrial found him innocent, she doesn't think people can have a trial after being found guilty.

 

[BettyCrocker]

She has no clue about the legal system, apparently. Chad Evan's, the footballer, would have been dead due to being found guilty due to rape. A retrial found him innocent, she doesn't think people can have a trial after being found guilty.

His name is Ched.
Not Chad.

 

[The King in the North]

His name is Ched.
Not Chad.

Autocorrect. Now answer the question. Should he be denied a chance of another trial.

I love how mentioned that I spelt his name incorrectly, but couldn't answer if she should have been denied a chance of clearing his name and having another trial.

 

[BettyCrocker]

Give me an example of solid evidence, I’ll show you how it’s not solid

ok then.....

man rapes child. Man takes photos of him raping child. Mans semen is found inside the child.

Solid enough?

 

[ProphecyGirl]

Lee Rigby's killers are alive. One in hospital seriously ill due to COVID.

Why should he be given the help to survive it? He shouldn't. What he did was inhumane

 

[Eltonjohnsflorist]

ok then.....

man rapes child. Man takes photos of him raping child. Mans semen is found inside the child.

Solid enough?

Man is mentally ill
Man was abused himself and failed by the services who could’ve stopped him
Man has a severe learning disability and is not capable of understanding wrong.

is your evidence solid enough to murder him?

Lee Rigby's killers are alive. One in hospital seriously ill due to COVID.

Why should he be given the help to survive it? He shouldn't. What he did was inhumane

Doctors and nurses are better than murders

 

[The King in the North]

ok then.....

man rapes child. Man takes photos of him raping child. Mans semen is found inside the child.

Solid enough?

And should be locked in jail for life. Nobody is defending a child rapist, you can't just a pick and choose who gets the death penalty, it's either no death penalty or the death penalty. What crimes should get the death penalty?

 

[WilmaHun]

ok then.....

man rapes child. Man takes photos of him raping child. Mans semen is found inside the child.

Solid enough?

Not all cases are as black and white as this. In fact, majority of cases are not. Therefore your generalisation that everyone who "seemingly" is found guilty of raping a child should lose their human rights is flawed already.

 

[Punchy1988]

Read the full court reports regarding the Ian Watkins trial. What he did and what he groomed others to do to babies and children is absolutely bleeping abhorrent.

I've read the full report a few times hence my knowledge on the case. I was carrying out my training contract in order to be a solicitor at the time it happened and I was heavily involved in the UK pop punk scene and knew people involved in the case, believe me I know what that man is capable of. I do not disagree with your comments.
I'm simply saying that we're not in a place where we would be able to have blanket rules for the death penalty as in this particular case, he would've slipped through the net anyway given that he was never convicted of rape
I do wish you'd read the comments, a lot of people (on both sides of the fence) have made some really valid points and you're just making sweeping statements and it's clear you're not reading anything anyone has said.

 

[The King in the North]

Lee Rigby's killers are alive. One in hospital seriously ill due to COVID.

Why should he be given the help to survive it? He shouldn't. What he did was inhumane

Probably because we're not savages.