Shamima Begum

[Polythene Pam]

Of course I have, I know of few who couldn't produce milk for reasons.. But the vast majority of women who have had kids will produce milk. The very reason you are asking someone this is either you're a male or an idiot

I'm a mom whose baby was readmitted to hospital because an undiagnosed tongue tie meant the transfer of milk was insufficient which affected my milk supply and meant i had to combi feed. So I guess that puts me in the latter category?
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It's pretty clear from the judgement that there is a tranche of information that isn't in the public domain. We can only guess what that might be. My feeling is the government has pursued a policy of depriving citizenship from everyone they thought they could get away with (including some that they eventually couldn't). I don't think that Shamima Begum is unusual in that respect. The major difference between her and most of the other cases is that she was known to the public before the decision about her citizenship was taken. It seems that the Home Secretary saw an opportunity for political capital in her case and put pressure on to get her citizenship revoked asap. However SIAC said that just because the decision was rushed doesn't mean that it was wrong.

They have definitely pursued it wherever a person has even a tenuous link to another country. So it's a two tier system really.
Most other European countries are starting the process of repatriating women and children. Australia too. So it'll be interesting to see what happens when it's just stateless Brits left in the camps.

Does anyone know if any other countries have pursued this policy? As far as I can tell we are an outlier.

 

[Yupitsme!!]

I'm a mom whose baby was readmitted to hospital because an undiagnosed tongue tie meant the transfer of milk was insufficient which affected my milk supply and meant i had to combi feed. So I guess that puts me in the latter category?

Did all of your children have it or just the one child? Think about it.
Don't be fooled or taken in by this woman, she said the Manchester bombing was justified. She's a grade A b of the highest order and said it a few times, throw her to the widows and mothers who lost husbands and children when her band of sperm donars where beheading and murdering them for fun.

 

[Polythene Pam]

Did all of your children have it or just the one child? Think about it.
Don't be fooled or taken in by this woman, she said the Manchester bombing was justified. She's a grade A b of the highest order and said it a few times, throw her to the widows and mothers who lost husbands and children when her band of sperm donars where beheading and murdering them for fun.

I only have the one. We are getting sidetracked but honestly look back even 100 years in this country and babies died all the time.
I'm not fooled by anyone. I don't like her as a person and I don't feel sorry for her. You are misconstruing my posts. I just don't think she should be dumped on any other innocent country to deal with. She should be incarcerated here.
I don't have sympathy for her. I do have sympathy for her innocent children and the thousands of other children growing up in the well documented squalid conditions of the camp.

 

[Piff paff puff]

.

Yet she has clean clothes on, her face nice and clean, her nails done, hair washed and brushed, hardly the super model stick insect.. Admit it they either weren't her kids or she let them die. We only have her word she had 3 of them, and the fact she has zero remorse they died as she stated she's 'over it' don't alarm bells not ring with you or you and empty vessel? When a woman doesn't give a jot her babies (if she of course had them) died then she's hardly going to give a jot about you if she makes it into the uk to kill you. Nobody gets over a child dying unless of course your shamima.

The fact that being part of a death cult, having multiple of your babies die and talk about it all without emotion makes me believe she's a psychopath. She could also just be severely depressed but the fact of her leaving the UK where she could have had a good career, education, life for ISIS and made that decision without being forced...... I believe she's a psychopath.

 

[Yupitsme!!]

I only have the one. We are getting sidetracked but honestly look back even 100 years in this country and babies died all the time.
I'm not fooled by anyone. I don't like her as a person and I don't feel sorry for her. You are misconstruing my posts. I just don't think she should be dumped on any other innocent country to deal with. She should be incarcerated here.
I don't have sympathy for her. I do have sympathy for her innocent children and the thousands of other children growing up in the well documented squalid conditions of the camp.

She doesn't want to go to any other country because she knows fine well will she be killed for her crimes. Read the room, nobody bar a few want her here, not Muslims not Christians, not Jewish, not atheists, nobody wants her here, the people have spoken.
---

I only have the one. We are getting sidetracked but honestly look back even 100 years in this country and babies died all the time.
I'm not fooled by anyone. I don't like her as a person and I don't feel sorry for her. You are misconstruing my posts. I just don't think she should be dumped on any other innocent country to deal with. She should be incarcerated here.
I don't have sympathy for her. I do have sympathy for her innocent children and the thousands of other children growing up in the well documented squalid conditions of the camp.

I don't care how squalid they are, they all shoulda thought about how it would affect their kids when they joined a terrorist group.
And I grew up watching the Ethiopian famine on the news, now that was horrendous for those poor people, I always remember one mother skin and bones clutching her baby also skin and bones to her breast and kids with ribs jutting out, which those images affect me to this day, so she has it better off considering she's a bleeping basketcase

 

[NeverEnough]

I'm a mom whose baby was readmitted to hospital because an undiagnosed tongue tie meant the transfer of milk was insufficient which affected my milk supply and meant i had to combi feed. So I guess that puts me in the latter category?
---

They have definitely pursued it wherever a person has even a tenuous link to another country. So it's a two tier system really.
Most other European countries are starting the process of repatriating women and children. Australia too. So it'll be interesting to see what happens when it's just stateless Brits left in the camps.

Does anyone know if any other countries have pursued this policy? As far as I can tell we are an outlier.

As you say Google is your friend. Here is a useful study of deprivation models, the UK is one of the top countries who use this method, but we are in no way shape of form the only country.

https://files.institutesi.org/Instrumentalising_Citizenship_Global_Trends_Report.pdf

Interesting little list of page 24. The list of countries who DON’T use this method. Among them Russia, China, North Korea, Turkmenistan, Cuba, DRC, Iran, basically the usual suspects.

If you are calling for a policy which aligns with those counties are you sure that you are on the right side of history?

 

[Polythene Pam]

As you say Google is your friend. Here is a useful study of deprivation models, the UK is one of the top countries who use this method, but we are in no way shape of form the only country.

https://files.institutesi.org/Instrumentalising_Citizenship_Global_Trends_Report.pdf

Interesting little list of page 24. The list of countries who DON’T use this method. Among them Russia, China, North Korea, Turkmenistan, Cuba, DRC, Iran, basically the usual suspects.

If you are calling for a policy which aligns with those counties are you sure that you are on the right side of history?

I'm calling for the UK to take responsibility for its own undesirables like France, Spain, the US, Australia, Belgium and the Netherlands are.
Syria is not a dumping ground for Western terrorists.

France repatriates 15 women, 32 children from Syria jihadist camps

France repatriated 15 women and 32 children held in jihadist prison camps in northeastern Syria, the French foreign ministry said Tuesday.

amp.france24.com

Spanish decision shows tide turning on repatriating ISIS brides | Faisal Al Yafai | AW

Given the secrecy, the government has not addressed whether the ECHR decision was a factor.

thearabweekly.com

Belgium repatriates women and children linked to IS group fighters from Syria

Belgium on Tuesday flew back 16 children of Islamic State group jihadists and six mothers with Belgian nationality, from a camp in northeastern Syria, officials said.

www.google.com

Australia clears way for repatriating Isis brides and their children

A secret Australian government intelligence mission to Syria has cleared the way for dozens of Australian wives and children of Islamic State fighters to be rep

www.thetimes.co.uk

The United States Has Repatriated 27 Americans from Syria and Iraq Including Ten Charged with Terrorism-Related Offenses for Their Support to ISIS

This is archived content from the U.S. Department of Justice website. The information here may be outdated and links may no longer function. Please contact [email protected] if you have any questions about the archive site.

www.justice.gov

The Repatriation of Five Women and Eleven Children from Syria: A Turning Point in the Netherlands?

To read this perspective in Dutch, click here.

www.icct.nl

 

[Bridgegal]

I believe she should return and be kept under scrutiny permanently (perhaps.similar to house arrest?). I have personal reason to hate Islamist extremism and truth be told people would expect me to be part of the "let her rot" camp if they knew my circumstances.

We can't call ourselves a civilised society and then ignore the rules we set ourselves (and bemoan other countries of not following) when the situation is uncomfortable or not politically expedient.

 

[monga]

Of course I have, I know of few who couldn't produce milk for reasons.. But the vast majority of women who have had kids will produce milk. The very reason you are asking someone this is either you're a male or an idiot

Her child died from pneumonia but I still think it odd she lost all three, there was talk the baby wasn’t hers it was a prop for the interview, we don’t even know for sure she even had any children only on her say so.

 

[Moth]

I'm calling for the UK to take responsibility for its own undesirables like France, Spain, the US, Australia, Belgium and the Netherlands are.
Syria is not a dumping ground for Western terrorists.

France repatriates 15 women, 32 children from Syria jihadist camps

France repatriated 15 women and 32 children held in jihadist prison camps in northeastern Syria, the French foreign ministry said Tuesday.

amp.france24.com

Spanish decision shows tide turning on repatriating ISIS brides | Faisal Al Yafai | AW

Given the secrecy, the government has not addressed whether the ECHR decision was a factor.

thearabweekly.com

Belgium repatriates women and children linked to IS group fighters from Syria

Belgium on Tuesday flew back 16 children of Islamic State group jihadists and six mothers with Belgian nationality, from a camp in northeastern Syria, officials said.

www.google.com

Australia clears way for repatriating Isis brides and their children

A secret Australian government intelligence mission to Syria has cleared the way for dozens of Australian wives and children of Islamic State fighters to be rep

www.thetimes.co.uk

The United States Has Repatriated 27 Americans from Syria and Iraq Including Ten Charged with Terrorism-Related Offenses for Their Support to ISIS

This is archived content from the U.S. Department of Justice website. The information here may be outdated and links may no longer function. Please contact [email protected] if you have any questions about the archive site.

www.justice.gov

The Repatriation of Five Women and Eleven Children from Syria: A Turning Point in the Netherlands?

To read this perspective in Dutch, click here.

www.icct.nl

The UK repatriated one woman and her child from Syria last October so obviously the government is prepared to contemplate the possibility. There are said to be about 25 adults and 35 children still held in detention in Syria. The woman has not been named and the announcement from the government was made in a tweet sent out overnight. That plus its intransigent stance on Shamima Begum might suggest that the government is at least if not more concerned with the 'optics' of repatriation as it is national security.

 

[Emsie]

Some people on this thread are getting a little confused. No one "wants" her back. She "should" come back because she is our responsibility not Bangladesh who have nothing to do with anything.
I don't want her back here. But here is where she should be facing the consequence for actions and not grooming others. Not roaming the world and filing legal claims with public funds.
She's our citizen and our potential terrorist.

 

[Sir Lancelot]

She can duck right off, as can everyone defending her.

 

[thegirlscout]

Some people on this thread are getting a little confused. No one "wants" her back. She "should" come back because she is our responsibility not Bangladesh who have nothing to do with anything.
I don't want her back here. But here is where she should be facing the consequence for actions and not grooming others. Not roaming the world and filing legal claims with public funds.
She's our citizen and our potential terrorist.

But she’s not out citizen, she’s Bangladeshes. The issue is we revoke her citizenship before they could. Other Jihadi brides have had their citizenship revoked.

 

[Polythene Pam]

The UK repatriated one woman and her child from Syria last October so obviously the government is prepared to contemplate the possibility. There are said to be about 25 adults and 35 children still held in detention in Syria. The woman has not been named and the announcement from the government was made in a tweet sent out overnight. That plus its intransigent stance on Shamima Begum might suggest that the government is at least if not more concerned with the 'optics' of repatriation as it is national security.

It's 100% about optics. For all we know the woman repatriated is more dangerous than Shamima.
She will have attended the same morality police training that Shamima did I expect. I think most women had to do it.
The question is what makes a person less dangerous just because they are not a dual national?

The logic is honestly baffling.
---

She can duck right off, as can everyone defending her.

I haven't seen anyone defending Shamima?

 

[thegirlscout]

Her child died from pneumonia but I still think it odd she lost all three, there was talk the baby wasn’t hers it was a prop for the interview, we don’t even know for sure she even had any children only on her say so.

Depends if you believe the man who gave an interview yesterday (the extreme tourist or whatever he calls himself) but he said she wasn’t that bothered by the death of her children. She doesn’t seem bothered by how her actions have effected anyone else but her. Would be interesting to see her profiled by a mental health professional.

 

[Merpedy]

IRC data reveals staggering child mortality in Al Hol camp, Northeast Syria - urging repatriation of foreign children - Syrian Arab Republic

News and Press Release in English on Syrian Arab Republic about Health and Protection and Human Rights; published on 16 Sep 2019 by IRC

reliefweb.int

From 2019. These women are massively restricted in the healthcare they and their children can access which seems to have led to increased mortality rates for children

2021 report which has a nice age breakdown:

https://www.emro.who.int/images/stories/syria/Al-Hol-Camp-Mortality-Annual-Report-2021_Syria_02.06.22.pdf?ua=1

“14% of deaths are attributed to newborns”

Unfortunately can’t find a similar thing for 2019 but the conditions in these camps for kids are rough

It’s also totally possible that she’s traumatised and isn’t processing her emotions as one would be expected to

 

[monga]

Some people on this thread are getting a little confused. No one "wants" her back. She "should" come back because she is our responsibility not Bangladesh who have nothing to do with anything.
I don't want her back here. But here is where she should be facing the consequence for actions and not grooming others. Not roaming the world and filing legal claims with public funds.
She's our citizen and our potential terrorist.

Maybe they’ll give her a job on loose woman , a celebrity terrorist is something the UK is definitely missing…Radicalise with Shamima on your lunch break…tbf I think she’d be the perfect replacement for Noleen Colan.

 

[Polythene Pam]

Depends if you believe the man who gave an interview yesterday (the extreme tourist or whatever he calls himself) but he said she wasn’t that bothered by the death of her children. She doesn’t seem bothered by how her actions have effected anyone else but her. Would be interesting to see her profiled by a mental health professional.

I'd say anyone that believes the DM danger tourist should also be seen my a mental health professional.
---

IRC data reveals staggering child mortality in Al Hol camp, Northeast Syria - urging repatriation of foreign children - Syrian Arab Republic

News and Press Release in English on Syrian Arab Republic about Health and Protection and Human Rights; published on 16 Sep 2019 by IRC

reliefweb.int

From 2019. These women are massively restricted in the healthcare they and their children can access which seems to have led to increased mortality rates for children

2021 report which has a nice age breakdown:

https://www.emro.who.int/images/stories/syria/Al-Hol-Camp-Mortality-Annual-Report-2021_Syria_02.06.22.pdf?ua=1

“14% of deaths are attributed to newborns”

Unfortunately can’t find a similar thing for 2019 but the conditions in these camps for kids are rough

It’s also totally possible that she’s traumatised and isn’t processing her emotions as one would be expected to

The children that didn't ask to be born. That could be saved. That will instead grow up radicalised if they grow up at all.
It's barbaric to leave the babies in the camps.

 

[monga]

Depends if you believe the man who gave an interview yesterday (the extreme tourist or whatever he calls himself) but he said she wasn’t that bothered by the death of her children. She doesn’t seem bothered by how her actions have effected anyone else but her. Would be interesting to see her profiled by a mental health professional.

That’s if she ever had children , nobody really knows.It’s all so staged looking, she never wanted back before the journalist found her had herself resigned to the camp

 

[Polythene Pam]

That’s if she ever had children , nobody really knows.It’s all so staged looking, she never wanted back before the journalist found her had herself resigned to the camp

Why would the Kurdish forces help her lie about delivering a baby? And that baby dying? Its not just her word. She gave birth in the camp. The baby received medical help from camp medics.