Real Life Crime and Murder #21

[CabalofBolorneaise]

Harry’s mother even said at the beginning she didn’t want Anna to go to prison because she was a mother herself. She just wanted her to take responsibility for the crime.
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I suppose if the family hadn’t moved here then the man wouldn’t have been able to murder 3 people and run over others - I guess in her mind it’s a way of making sense of it all. Her son was brutally and viciously murdered only a year ago, I think some people are expecting a lot from the families when their journey of grief has only really started.

There are tons of what ifs that would have meant it didn’t happen, focusing on the family moving here over a decade before the incident absolutely has racial undertones and her recent grief doesn’t absolve that.

 

[TheMiceInTheShed]

Harry’s mother even said at the beginning she didn’t want Anna to go to prison because she was a mother herself. She just wanted her to take responsibility for the crime.
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I suppose if the family hadn’t moved here then the man wouldn’t have been able to murder 3 people and run over others - I guess in her mind it’s a way of making sense of it all. Her son was brutally and viciously murdered only a year ago, I think some people are expecting a lot from the families when their journey of grief has only really started.

I agree.

Grief makes you irrational in so many ways - it just tears the earth from under you and you don't know which way is up. I wouldn't criticise them for anything they said or thought at this heartbreaking time - and I do feel sorry for the killer's parents who are being blamed for something they didn't do and couldn't have prevented. It's a very sad situation.
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I'm glad you can do that - for your sake, as it's free ing. Hating is exhausting and poisonous. It doesn't help anyone. Having compassion for that driver frees you and makes your loss easier to bear. Thank you for being that person.
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I agree. It's shades of Denise Bulger (now Fergus) who has never, ever, ever been allowed to have any sort of peace or any sort of reconciliation with the murder of her little boy. I hope to God this doesn't happen with this family.
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QMLAN because I never actually finished that post! The book I recommended was The Devil's Children by Loretta Loach, a history of children who kill and how they've been treated. Another good one about the Bulger case is The Sleep of Reason by David Smith. Cries Unheard by Gita Sereny, about the Mary Bell case, is another very good one.

I don't mean to sound sanctimonious when I talk about this stuff. I'm sorry if I come across thus. I felt, very strongly, similarly to some of the posters on this thread at the time of and subsequent to the killing of poor little James. Hence I did a lot of reading as I like to understand the opposite perspective and where it comes from. I can honestly say that like I said in my other post, condemning a little less, and understanding a little more (unlike John Major, who generally I think gets it right, but I think got it wrong on that occasion) is not only best for society but can do something to alleviate the suffering of the victim's family. Because hatred and condemnation never grow old. They fester and can destroy.

I appreciate it's easier said than done; but I feel, with young children, we need to give it a shot for all our sakes.

Cries Unheard by Gita Sereny

I read this one many years ago - it is harrowing. Mary Bell's early life was HELL with her mother - absolute hell.

We none of us know what others go through or how it shapes them - and it is a cycle that is so heard to break.

 

[AladdinSane]

There are tons of what ifs that would have meant it didn’t happen, focusing on the family moving here over a decade before the incident absolutely has racial undertones and her recent grief doesn’t absolve that.

100%.
His family, unless they literally gave him the knife and told him to go kill 3 people that night, are not directly responsible for his actions.

If he is as ill as it has been reported, I would argue he is not directly responsible. I imagine it is incredibly difficult to fool actual psychologists into pretending you are incredibly mentally ill.
It is a horrific situation for all involved but blaming his family for moving here will serve no one.

I really hope they can all start to heal as much as possible. My heart breaks for them all.

 

[CabalofBolorneaise]

100%.
His family, unless they literally gave him the knife and told him to go kill 3 people that night, are not directly responsible for his actions.

If he is as ill as it has been reported, I would argue he is not directly responsible. I imagine it is incredibly difficult to fool actual psychologists into pretending you are incredibly mentally ill.
It is a horrific situation for all involved but blaming his family for moving here will serve no one.

I really hope they can all start to heal as much as possible. My heart breaks for them all.

Mine too. I thought it was especially ironic when his mum said that the killers family haven’t lost their son… they have in a way, to the mental illness and they have to deal with both watching their son so tortured and the knowledge that he was failed to such an extent that he killed people as a result of his illness. That’s not easy for his parents to deal with anymore than losing their son is easy for the victim’s parents.

 

[Melian]

I really do feel for the families but staying in the anger phase of grief and focusing it in the wrong place will be so damaging to them long term.

I saw this first hand with my Nan. She lost her son in road traffic accident and placed all her hurt into anger at the person who hit him. I can’t imagine how hard it is to lose your child but my nans grief was as raw 50 years later as she had never processed it, her anger held her back.

I remember a case years ago where a lad was kicked to death by 3 lads. After being released, one of the killers met the lads parents. The father (and I believe the mother too) said they forgive his killers. They didn't feel that being angry would achieve anything.

That was the Christopher Donovan case.

 

[wibble]

I as watching LawyerYouKnow and he was talking about Sarah Boone.
He played a clip of her lawyer (the latest one trying to get excused from the case) saying that she expected the trial to last 5 days.
Which doesn't sound right.

I get that her lawyer probably doesn't think she has a leg to stand on.
But 5 days?

 

[TapToBoreMeRigid]

I guess the video evidence would show the majority of the crime. Boone wants the battered spouse defence and I wonder if the court app lawyers have been unable to find an expert.

 

[wibble]

I guess the video evidence would show the majority of the crime. Boone wants the battered spouse defence and I wonder if the court app lawyers have been unable to find an expert.

There's some debate as to how he got in the suitcase - or there was.

 

[Tangent Tiger]

With Boone and boyfriend, they sound utterly toxic for each other

 

[HaloGirl]

I feel disgusted with the police in W London and what they did to that poor cow. There was no need to use so much force. As a Hindu it absolutely sickens me. The fail has the video TW

supposedly the cow has a huge cut to its leg but looking the video I wouldn’t be surprised if it has suffered more.

 

[Islawight]

I feel disgusted with the police in W London and what they did to that poor cow. There was no need to use so much force. As a Hindu it absolutely sickens me. The fail has the video TW

supposedly the cow has a huge cut to its leg but looking the video I wouldn’t be surprised if it has suffered more.

Unfortunately, I saw it on DM without a warning. What have the Met said to try and justify this barbaric action?

 

[HaloGirl]

Unfortunately, I saw it on DM without a warning. What have the Met said to try and justify this barbaric action?

They should put a warning. it is under Surrey police’s watch.

TW

 

[Islawight]

They should put a warning. it is under Surrey police’s watch.

TW

Ah, yes please send us any info or footage (before putting it online)

 

[maytoseptember]

I can’t believe that statement from Surrey Police. Asking for video footage? The footage has been everywhere already (I kept scrolling past it on my Twitter feed because I didn’t want to see it).

What is wrong with our police? Imagine being that cruel to a defenceless animal.

 

[Itsallthecheese]

Yet if I as a farmer had done this and been filmed I'd be getting locked up (rightly so). Why didn't they shoot it? They've been quick to do it to other livestock in the past.

I hope someone gets reprimanded, I'm not soft by any means but found that really upsetting.

 

[thegirlscout]

Does anyone know what happened to those students from the agricultural college who were expelled? They were involved in the death of a sheep if I remember correctly
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I feel disgusted with the police in W London and what they did to that poor cow. There was no need to use so much force. As a Hindu it absolutely sickens me. The fail has the video TW

supposedly the cow has a huge cut to its leg but looking the video I wouldn’t be surprised if it has suffered more.

I can’t believe that police took 2 hours to try and secure the cow and decided that hitting it with their reinforced van was a sensible idea. In that time they could have called a farmer, a police unit that deals with animals etc, anything.
I live rurally and if we rammed every loose farm animal that had wandered into a local town or village there would be no live stock left!

 

[Emsie]

Two 12 year old boys found guilty of murder - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles...type=owned&at_format=link&at_ptr_name=twitter

I get adjustments being made for them. We don't need a repeat of Jamie Bulgers killers walking free after 5 minutes but part of me thinks that they need to understand the absolute seriousness of what they've done. Sit them with someone who can explain the proceedings to them yeah but I'd leave everyone with their wigs on looking official. This is serious stuff!!!
I'd be the worst person explaining though "see her there with the hammer and massive wigs, she's gonna send you to prison forever. You'll be eating gruel till you're 90 lad"

 

[cesarea-tinajero]

I grew up super rural and we had cows end up in our back garden several times, which as a kid I thought was excellent. All my parents did was call a few local farmers to find out who they belonged to and they just collected them. Absolutely no need for violence, it's disgusting how they handled it.

 

[Alansbigplate]

I worked for a short time with the police and quite often there were calls about deer in the road I was shocked that they go out and shoot them

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

The farming community will always step in when help is needed. Even if it’s not their animal.

I cannot believe the option they chose was to ram it. They clearly didn’t contact a vet until after it was injured.