The nurses have literally said they'll stop the strikes for 7%
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Oh dear i was agreeing with everything you said until you said you won’t strike. I’m a medical spr. Consultant pay is eroding rapidly so it won’t end when you cct!! Know your worth
That's one thing that's cheaper in Norway, the overall cost of living is still way higher.Parents of pre schoolers in Norway also spend an average of £240 a month on childcare fees. My sons nursery cost nearly £600 a month and he only goes 2 days a week!!
“Taxing others” nurses pay taxes too
Anyways isn't that an argument for subsidys for childcare for everyone, rather than pay nurses more?
It's making an unfair uneven system even worse by giving pay rises to a few jobs that are highly unionised.
Many unions are terrible for telling their members downright lies with stats and they get parroted as a truth. Good sound bites, but little connection to reality.
You're correct, but I just don't know. I feel the consultant pay is pretty decent. When you factor in on call, unsociable hours as well as potentially doing private work, I feel like its a extremely liveable amount.
That is very true. How anyone manages to get on the housing ladder any more is beyond me. There really does need to be a overhaul of everything, but I'm not sure if I can truly see it happening.
I think as well there is a lot of focus on the poor/those on benefits and there is a load of focus on the wealthy but really the ones now falling through the cracks are those (such as nurses/administration/etc) who are on the middle bracket. They are not rich but they earn too much for extra support.
Private work is separate though and shouldn’t be assumed, some don’t have a private practice.
Doctors are in the middle bracket too. Most of us are not rich by national means on the spectrum of annual earning. We earn more than many nurses but many of us are definitely the squeezed middle. Also consultant pensions are ducked and the tax bills people are getting are insane.
Unions can’t take action to demand subsidised child care for all. Realistically that’s not going to happy with a Tory govt so for the next few years until the next GE . Striking for more pay could see positive consequences a lot sooner and a lot more likely.
Haven’t seen but what does 'recruitment' even mean here? A campaign? If so - pointless. I have two friends who recently changed career to be a nurse, one did adult and one did child, both courses at the uni were oversubscribed. I don't think it is a lack of people wanting to do it in theory, but retention. It's no good recruiting a load more nurses if none of them will stay. Ultimately, there are not enough medical professionals for the NHS to function how it should. In a functional society, when you need more of a particular role, you pay it better and improve the conditions which in turn improves both recruitment AND retention. I completely understand that in a cost of living crisis and about to go into a recession, people will hear 27-33k and think 'hold on, that's a decent wage, it's not worth striking over' but the actual job nurses are having to do now for that salary is not one I personally would be willing to do for even one day on that wage. Not a chance. And that's the key part that's getting lost, the fact that Sunak thinks recruitment is where he should be focusing shows this government hasn't got a clue about the real issues so how can the public be expected to either.
What I will say about the impact on patient safety is again as someone on who works on personal injury/clinical negligence/professional regulation cases, every time I speak to a HCP right now I cross everything in my body that none of my loved ones have to set foot in a hospital or need an ambulance.
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He’s clueless. Does he think just not enough people know about nursing as career? likely they just put the money into going to a developing country and tempting their nurses over here instead (which ethically is dodgy)
I know so many people are paid way less than £27k (which is an issue itself) but its really not the mega salary its portrayed as. Especially for that kind of job.
My partner earns £32k (in Norfolk, not London or SE) doing an administrative job with no entry requirements and no life or death consequences.
Probably. That being said I know someone who works in resourcing at a big London FT and she says they used to get a lot of nurses from the Philippines but these days they struggle getting many to come over here.
I personally do agree it isn't a lot. I just meant that I understand a lot of people will earn less, and that this is also unlike other recent strikes where workers striking have only been paid minimum wage for example.
There are also a lot of admin jobs in the NHS that are paid far more than they should be (on the face of it at least) Equality, Diversity and Inclusion Managers on bands 8a/8b and 'Directors of Lived Experience' on close to 100k. It's nothing short of crazy to me that there's band 5 nurses doing 12 hour shifts then unpaid overtime without eating, drinking, going to the toilet, having too many patients to manage safely, then band 5 administrative staff on the same pay, with no degree, putting their coats on at ten to five.
Yes I agree. I had a baby last year and my midwife was so apologetic about taking her HALF HOUR lunch break. She'd been with me for about 7 hours at that point. It hadn't even occurred to me that she hadn't had a break until that point. They all deserve way more money. I know it's a tough sell at the moment but the issues are historic. Maybe MPs could all take a little pay cut to fund it.
They’re getting a 3% pay rise! bleeps! (The MPs i mean)
Mp salaries are almost the least important thing, it is all of the extra things they get, all the expenses(rent ewvn when the mp lives in london), the insanely subsidised food but also the alcohol , there is a case to have cheaper food in workplaces (I imagine none of us get that now though?) But having bars subsidised is just ridiculous
I think I read the other day that something ridiculous like 60% of people on the nursing degrees don’t even finish it for whatever reason, which is bloody sad considering. They’ve got away with paying public services lower than they should for years by calling the courses “vocation” as that makes it seem like less of a profession. That goes for carers too, because there’s no way in hell I’d work in a care home for £9.50 an hour not a chance
Right?! Leave the salary where it is and withdraw the expenses. They should have a state funded hotel for MPs to stay in when they're in London.
I’d say it’s just the Cuntservatives but Labour as bad, I live in Angela Raynors constituency and I’n sure she expensed a £9.60 phone bill. Whilst on £80k a year
Yeh I agree, in terms of expenses they are all just awful.
This exactly.
Labour are sitting back and not saying anything. They'll win the next election and then spend their time blaming the Tories, just as the Tories did. They haven't earnt their poll boost, just been the recipients by default.
There's no simple fixes, a long term strategy is needed. The nursing issue is nothing unique to the UK, so many other countries have the same.
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I think change will come when things reach breaking point. Which can't be far off.
There's definitely an issue with middle income people falling through the cracks. You can out earn a nurse working part time on min wage with all the top up benefits. Seems like a crazy system where people are encouraged to not work more than the bare minimum or ever get a promotion.
In fairness though why should she incur personal costs for work calls? I think they need some funding to fund the second London residence and work related expenses like travel but seeing how people have expenses private swimming lessons in Bolivia and the free bar etc is just a joke
I voted to strike, for me it was an easy decision. When the media tells you patients will die because we’re out on the picket line. Here’s a fact, people are dying every single day, preventable accidents are happening every single day. Departments are staffed at unsafe levels every single day. It simply cannot continue, we have highly skilled staff leaving daily as they can’t take it no more, we can’t recruit and retain.
In real terms of GDP our NHS has been massively underfunded, multiple community services have gone. We are seeing patients at the front door of AED who do not need to be there.
We have the Health Secretary telling us to suck it up as we have a good pension, we are taking money away from patient care. We haven’t had any adequate funding to provide good patient care for years! It’s like a postcode lottery for what services you can access. This is not proving a good standard of care.
Of course I want to be paid fairly , we’ve been robbed of fair pay for too long. Just because we’re in the caring profession doesn’t mean we should suck it up and struggle financially until we reach pension age, that’s if we make it to pension age.
Those opposed to striking are you happy with the current care offered?
What do you suggest instead of striking?
In real terms of GDP our NHS has been massively underfunded, multiple community services have gone. We are seeing patients at the front door of AED who do not need to be there.
We have the Health Secretary telling us to suck it up as we have a good pension, we are taking money away from patient care. We haven’t had any adequate funding to provide good patient care for years! It’s like a postcode lottery for what services you can access. This is not proving a good standard of care.
Of course I want to be paid fairly , we’ve been robbed of fair pay for too long. Just because we’re in the caring profession doesn’t mean we should suck it up and struggle financially until we reach pension age, that’s if we make it to pension age.
Those opposed to striking are you happy with the current care offered?
What do you suggest instead of striking?
I neither oppose or support the current strikes. I would hugely support strikes if they were to reform the NHS based on far more successful services that get significantly better outcomes like the French or Canadian.
No more quick fix bandaids, reform and save more lives.