Michael Jackson

[Upintheair83]

I think the same as I always have. He abused those boys because they knew about the vitiligo marks on his penis. There’s no excuse for that.

I still think he’s the reason Macauley Culkin went off the rails but he’s not going to come out and say anything because MJ’s weird fans would hound him and nobody would be interested in giving him a job anymore because admitting abuse hasn’t helped anyone’s career has it?

He groomed the world talking about his abusive childhood though. I don’t buy that he wanted to play with children because he didn’t have a childhood himself, he still had choices like we all have and most of us choose not to repeat the mistakes. We still grow up and want to have adult experiences rather than childhood ones. Having said that I do recognise all of his family seem to be very strange.

Michael was a hard nosed businessman when he wanted to be, the only thing I‘m not surprised about is that he ended up on drugs and dead much earlier than he should have.

He’s a mercurial character though, I can still appreciate his music - well everything before Bad was incredible, after that it all went a bit meh.

I agree, and that's why I said that I feel sorry for him as a child. I truly suspect he was sexually abused as a child- he was in hollywood from a young age- in a time that no one would ever believe or care if a little black boy was a victim. He was sold to the highest bidder in hollywood and I think we would all be naive to think that no abuse happened to him. But I also think that because of his fame, his family and also his own god-like complex, is why he ended up the way he did. He was a complete and utter mess.

And so I suppose I find the whole story sad- the cycle of abuse that goes on- but not just in MJs story, in a lot of stories too. And I admire those adults who stop the cycle of abuse and don't use excuses to take away the innocence of others, and dedicate their lives to make sure it never happens again.

It's the saddest fact that adults let children down time and time again, and in his adult life Michael did the same to the children he abused.
I just think that all abuse victims deserve sympathy- of course some grow up and go on to abuse too- and some dont- but it still doesn't stop me having sympathy for all of them as a child.
Adults have so much to answer for at times, childhood should be treasured and looked upon as the most sacred gift in this world. I actaillt despair for humanity at times that we even have to think about CSA.

 

[Midsummer Son]

Let’s say that MJ didn’t touch kids (he did) but let’s say he didn’t. He still had young children he was not related to in his bed, alone. Bought them gifts.

If a man down the street said let your 12 year old son sleep in my bed, play on the rides in my garden and I’ll buy him presents are you saying you’d say yes?! Nah, you’d say fuck off you dirty pervert.

You cannot separate the grooming and disgust of it all just because MJ has a few good songs. He’s a groomer. People argue he didn’t touch his own kids. Most paedophiles don’t actually touch their own children.

Lack of evidence? Well MJ didn’t need to have tons of child SA material did he really? He had a carousel of young kids in his actual bed . His court case was a farce as well. Jurors dancing to his music in the stands? It was a joke.

I can't believe the jurors danced to his music. Even if you're a fan, doing that shows the highest level of disrespect for the victims of the very serious accusations they had to deliberate on. Of course people like that were going to exonerate him no matter the evidence.

 

[PurvyPanda]

Has anyone watched the Laytoya reality show? Its just appeared on my YouTube suggestions, shes an odd one

They’re all odd to be honest with you. Jermaine Jackson’s son is called ‘Jermajesty’ as in ‘yes, your majesty’. WTF?
AND…
The mother is the ex of Jermaine’s brother, Randy. So their children are cousins and half siblings of hers and Jermaine's children.

The only member of that family who seems like they’ve got their shit together, and dared to question the behaviour of MJ, is Janet. I feel sorry for her. She was great in her own right but her brothers antics always tarnished her too when they really shouldn’t have done.

 

[MunkyMagic]

I just watched it and urgh, it was sickening. I believe Safechuck and Robson. I think (in Robson’s case) just because he’s a known liar doesn’t mean he can’t tell the truth, and in Safechuck’s case he is just hollowed. I watched bits of the Oprah interview before the documentary and looking back it again after hearing his testimony you can visibly see he’s curled in on himself.

They talk of the conflict of deeply loving and wanting to protect Jackson and not recognising their abuse for what it was until they could put it into context as an adult and parent. Robson also talks about the 2014 lawsuit as wanting the same forum to replay the 2003 one to put it “right” - that makes sense in terms of what we know about survivor guilt and wanting to reinact rescue scenarios. In 2003 he was trying to rescue Jackson and in 2014 he was trying to rescue other victims. It just all seems psychologically plausible.

I the case of chandler saying Jackson was circumcised when he wasn’t, without wanting to be too graphic I guess it’s possible for a 13 year old to understand that to be the case when seeing an erect adult penis with the foreskin pulled back and glans exposed.

I can understand people having difficulty believing Jackson would carry out such things, though. It’s a huge thing to reconcile.

 

[shellie]

He was a pedalo. No denying it or sugar coating anything. He had 5 year old boys spend the week with him. Why are people so blinded by celebrity? He was a bad man yet people offered their kids up. Sick

He groomed the parents as well. You offer the world to someone who has never seen it (it was always families who were poor and had nothing) and claim there is no strings attached and while they might have some issues, many would take it. With them out of the way getting this and that and going here and there, he was free to do what he wanted with the kids. I'm not saying this to absolve the parents because if something is too good to be true then it usually is, but they get to the kids through the parents more than most realise.

As for people who still refuse to believe it...look at what's come out about Epstein and the others. If you have the money then you can pay your way out of anything but you will eventually be caught. I honestly wouldn't be surprised that if he had lived, there would be more accusations and eventually one would come he wouldn't be able to talk his way out of.

 

[Youtubegossip]

Yeah I’m not convinced by the documentary having watched it.

However,
I still think a grown man wanting children to sleep in his bed isn’t innocent and even if nothing happened is crossing a HUGE boundary. No one would be okay with Roger from down the road doing it.

Also, didn’t one of the boys describe in great detail the marks on the underside of MJs penis which turned out to be accurate?

 

[PurvyPanda]

Micheal Jackson was also rumoured to be “ shagging “ lots of woman to, his former bodyguard who I will add didn’t get paid for his work stated Michael had woman after woman, he said the hardest thing to do was to sneak them in. Michael couldn’t party, he’s was so famous that he was flocked by thousands where ever he went.

These are all money grabbing parasites.. you may think that is harsh but it’s true. Do you really think if there was no money to be had they’d be spitting these lies.. what’s Michael legacy worth now? 3.5 billion?

I hope these lawyers that are defending Michaels estate rip their lies apart, maybe they could chuck in a few acting lessons to.

I’m afraid, I hear more impartiality from the people who are willing to question Michael Jackson’s legacy, than I do from his fans (fan being short for fanatic), who will fervently defend him. The fact of the matter is no one knows, other than his accusers, and certainly not ‘100%’.

Many of the people on this thread have already disclosed that they were fans of Michael Jackson, or there is a part of them that is still able to appreciate his artistry, but still question his very dubious behaviour.
Much like any contentious issue, if people are not prepared to question the status quo, and face the possibility that their own belief system MAY be shattered, then I would question why, and certainly wouldn’t entertain their POV.

 

[Islawight]

As he was so inclined on having little boys share his bed, why did he not have cameras in his rooms to prove nothing untoward ever happened? Seeing as he already had allegations of SA but still invited boys into his bed, you’d think he would cover himself legally if he was innocent for any future ’money grabbing families’.
Being found innocent of charges in court does not mean an individual is factually innocent.

 

[SarahGard83]

Just finished watching it and there's no doubt in my mind that they are telling the truth. Was horrifying listening to them recall the way Michael used his power to abuse them

 

[bottlewrapper]

Plenty has been discussed in the past 17 years. People make up their own minds - but it will be based on his behaviour. What they knew at the time and what they have become aware of more recently.

Victims of SA may not realise they were abused because they were groomed (along with their entire families), it's only when they may become parents themselves that they realise the sleepover games they played as a child with a forty something man weren't as normal as they were led to believe.

Any new cases won't go to a criminal court because MJ is dead. That leaves the civil court, and the Jackson family will want the royalties to keep rolling in, so will be buying the silence of any other claimants and the public would never know.

 

[MunkyMagic]

I watched an interview with LMP and she pretty much says MJ wasn’t anything like he presented to the public; he was astute business-wise and knew his “child like” persona kept him protected, ensured fans loved him and therefore made him money.

He also bought the Beatles back catalogue after taking Paul McCsrtneys advice on investing in music publishing. Bet Macca didn’t anticipate that one when doling our advice.

 

[Abominatrix]

He was a global superstar and lived a life that attracted interest, interest that was frequently capitalised upon.

Considering his lifestyle, and even the circumstances of his death - he is going to be talked about. All the more so, when his estate authorise movies, etc about him.

He will be talked about for years to come, alongside Elvis, Marilyn Monroe, Princess Diana John Lennon, etc. I don’t think we can just say, ignore all the negative sides of their lives because they are dead. Especially if there was controversy around their behaviour, when they were alive.

This is a forum to discuss famous people (dead or alive). If anyone is upset by the discussion content or posts - they can always report it to admins.

Also, there's the block function people, use it!

This is a gossip forum, not a rave thread. I'm sick to death of the internet's "be nice" routine when it's really only "cater to my feelings when discussing the things I personally like" most of the time.

 

[Miss Havisham]

Until fairly recently, I believed that MJ was likely to be innocent. I felt that he had various issues - and was somehow, almost a child trapped in an adults body.
I watched a few documentaries on him very recently (including the recent BBC doc). I realised that I previously knew little about the accusations made against him, and various timelines. I now see him as a manipulative, calculating man.

I do feel that not all his accusers will be genuine - even Saville had some people making false allegations against him, once his offences became official (though after his death ). I do believe he abused children, but he felt that he was smart enough to also have his “friendships” with children that he did not abuse. Knowing full well, that these children will be his “evidence” of innocence.
Even his marriage to Lisa Marie Presley. Hastily arranged after allegations made against him. I don’t know if she knew she was being manipulated - but what an absolute sham.

 

[White rose]

Michael is 100% innocent. People say “ innocent untill proven guilty “ he was proven innocent yet people still insist on dragging this up all the time. these people claiming years later are after one thing and that is money.

Let the man rest.

 

[Midsummer Son]

And ignoring all the showbiz stuff - a serial child predator snagging up a newly divorced woman with serious daddy issues and then him controlling and manipulating her into having children... Just seems like a nasty set up.

Wouldn't be the first time on that mess either, I've seen in happen irl - my good friend was targeted because her mother was extremely vulnerable and had been abused in her youth herself. That predator smell opportunity all over that family, and my friend wound up being drugged and sexually abused over the next 4 years, starting when she was 12.

Her abuser was also, of course, backed by his family who then harassed her for years, calling her a liar and a manipulative slut. So watching people cape for MJ, when he's broadcast his predatory ways again and again and again, is twisted as hell. He's a textbook pedalo, at the time one of the richest, most powerful, and most famous people in the world, people worshipped him.

But yeah, nothing to see here folks. He just didn't have a childhood

I’ve always hated the “he didn’t have a childhood” excuse. Two things can be true, he had a shit childhood but still ended up a päedo. The childhood abuse can explain his adult behaviour but it doesn’t excuse it. Adult MJ had an adult mind, he wasn’t trapped as a psychological child. He knew how to manipulate, lie and take advantage of his fame to get parents to part with their children. Didn’t he even have alarms that would let him know if people were approaching his room? Yes, he was damaged and it’s known that abused people often end up as abusers themselves, but that’s still a choice they make.

 

[Soncna]

Why are you talking about children abuse? There were always only BOYS. There is well documented history of his special friends- holding hands, sitting together,…. Always boys, boys, boys…. I loved his music as a kid/ teenager/ young woman. As a mother of three sons,who saw these pictures, I turn off the radio when I hear his music. His eccentricity is no excuse for the abuse. His fame Is still protecting him. You don’t want be the mother of the boy in Bashir interview. For me the police interview with the boy is enough to believe the children-boys.

 

[shellie]

Sorry but his behaviour is literally textbook grooming behaviour of the entire families of the victims. If it was a random man and not a beloved popular you are a fan of you'd believe it very easily. Look at the shit thats come out about other pedophile celebrities! But just because Micheal had a bad childhood he must be innocent

Add to that, quite a few people who worked for him said they saw stuff and when he was raided, there were books full of pictures of naked children taken which if you saw the pictures were far from the 'art' people claim it was which was completely normal...right?

 

[Soncna]

Sorry but his behaviour is literally textbook grooming behaviour of the entire families of the victims. If it was a random man and not a beloved popular you are a fan of you'd believe it very easily. Look at the shit thats come out about other pedophile celebrities! But just because Micheal had a bad childhood he must be innocent

Totally agree.

 

[Midsummer Son]

I doubt they were up having a party in the court room, I think anyone would find it had not to have a little seat dance to most music.
I didnt realise the documentary was played as evidence, surely they should have shown unedited footage that was concerning if they had to show anything related to Martin Bashier

It wouldn’t be hard at all. An adult is perfectly able to not move an inch or “seat dance” to music in the context of a child abuse trial, the same way you wouldn’t “seat dance” in a job interview or any other remotely serious situation. Can’t believe I’m reading this…

 

[Miss Havisham]

Anyway,14 counts of not guilty so why are we still going on about it,17 years after his death FFS??

Because his behaviour was so suspicious (as well as abnormal) and he was very manipulative.
People will continue to talk about it, especially as information comes out over the years.

Perhaps not all of his accusers will be believed (and likely that some may be false), but many of them will be. Not all of them going to court - and some may never speak of it all.

Sexual assault (especially some time after the event) is sadly, very hard to prove. It’s a fact, that many cases don’t reach court - and if they do, proving guilt is not always straightforward.