Lucy Letby Case #6

[TwooTwooTwitTwitTwoo]

When you say ‘the deaths are not her fault’ technically they still would be her fault I think? she is responsible for taking care of them so she should have still thought duck I am making too many mistakes and then took the responsibility to go the sick? So if they were going to go down that route would they not be asking for a manslaughter charge or can they ask for that at a later date?

I don't think they can ask for it at a later date, it would have already been presented as an alternate charge during the first address to the court. By claiming she was overworked or unwell she would possibly be saying she did her best and perhaps she feels her best wasn't good enough rather than admitting to being at fault.

I'm just trying to think of the arguments her legal team could make because 'I didn't do anything wrong' alone, doesn't seem like a particularly strong defence in the face of what appear to be events that have occurred with such frequency and in such unusual ways that it can't be explained by accident or coincidence. On a the basis of 'on balance of probability', it's not looking good for her at this stage.

 

[Emmelina Ball]

Not sure but I’ve defo watched crime documentaries about killers who had good character references so I guess it doesn’t mean much either way.



This is what I mean tho non of that report pinned the blame on anyone so why did they still think it was appropriate to call the police. They obviously thought the report didn’t answer all the questions

The review didn’t find a reason for the excess deaths that’s why it needed to be investigated further.

 

[stardust1]

You’re right, I guess I’m struggling to get my head around what would make someone like her do such a thing? There’s no ducked up childhood, no history of violence or abuse, she was successful in her career, doesn’t seem to have been suffering with any mental health issues or traumas, had normal friendships, seemed to get on with colleagues etc. I guess that’s what makes it so weird, because at the end of the day there really aren’t any signs that she would be a mass murderer whatsoever

I feel there may be some evidence come out as to what the hell made her decide to do it (if guilty) although some killers do take the motive to the grave they like the control. People keep saying she didn’t have any childhood trauma etc but actually who knows what goes on behind closed doors maybe she did and it was kept to her self?

I don't think they can ask for it at a later date, it would have already been presented as an alternate charge during the first address to the court. By claiming she was overworked or unwell she would possibly be saying she did her best and perhaps she feels her best wasn't good enough rather than admitting to being at fault.

I'm just trying to think of the arguments her legal team could make because 'I didn't do anything wrong' alone, doesn't seem like a particularly strong defence in the face of what appear to be events that have occurred with such frequency and in such unusual ways that it can't be explained by accident or coincidence. On a the basis of 'on balance of probability', it's not looking good for her at this stage.

I kind of feel like the defence at the moment are simply just going down the route of denying it all. I know we need to see the evidence but I feel the same she definitely does not look good as it stands. theres a lot of things that can be defended as a stand alone event but when you look at them all together I struggle to find a valid explanation especially with the use of the word purpose on the noteWith enough time I think everything will add up.

 

[Lackofimagination]

If she gets away with this I will honestly sob for those parents. It’s too coincidental for me. And yes before anyone says I’d be terrible on jury duty I absolutely would because I’m convinced she’s guilty.

 

[Tofino]

You’re right, I guess I’m struggling to get my head around what would make someone like her do such a thing? There’s no ducked up childhood, no history of violence or abuse, she was successful in her career, doesn’t seem to have been suffering with any mental health issues or traumas, had normal friendships, seemed to get on with colleagues etc. I guess that’s what makes it so weird, because at the end of the day there really aren’t any signs that she would be a mass murderer whatsoever

I don’t think we know anything about her childhood yet do we? I think people presume because her parents are still together and holding hands that she must have had a good upbringing but it means bugger all (not suggesting anything about her parents personally just that we literally have no idea).
My parents are still together and married 40+ years but all us children are ducked up emotionally due to my mothers controlling narcissistic behaviour and my fathers enabling of it. Not to say any of us are murderers or committing crimes but having married parents means nothing about the emotionally wellbeing of their children.

 

[anotheronebitesthedust.1]

As someone else said, she hung the first bag and assembled the IV line. Insulin reacts with plastic causing administration to be erratic. The plastic of the IV line could still be contaminated with insulin when the second bag was given.
Insulin is never given by IV for this reason. There is no way this contamination could have happened accidentally.

Insulin is often given Iv Though especially when it’s a GKI infusion

 

[Lucyxxxx]

Slightly off topic but would ADHD/ADD get someone out of jury service? Imagine having an attention deficit and having to go through 6 months of evidence? Curious.

 

[imsohungry]

As have I, all of mine have had NEC with varying degrees of severity, one had a large section of small bowel removed and a stoma for months. And I’ve seen babies crash suddenly, mine included. But it’s the frequency and very sudden decline at which this was happening. One after the other with the same issues. It just doesn’t add up.

An sorry I thought you meant generally, yes I see what you’re saying now x

 

[Tofino]

Slightly off topic but would ADHD/ADD get someone out of jury service? Imagine having an attention deficit and having to go through 6 months of evidence? Curious.

unless they hyperfocus. Pretty much what I’m doing right now

 

[Lucyxxxx]

unless they hyperfocus. Pretty much what I’m doing right now

Same tbh. I know I'd find it so difficult to sit through technical stuff and not completely zone out.

 

[stardust1]

Slightly off topic but would ADHD/ADD get someone out of jury service? Imagine having an attention deficit and having to go through 6 months of evidence? Curious.

When we had a convo about it on the last thread someone said there was no box to tick for having a short attention span. I wreckon you could with diagnosed ADHD tho with a case like this. I was thinking what if you get an absolute menace on jury duty who isn’t the least bit interested, how will they manage

 

[Lackofimagination]

unless they hyperfocus. Pretty much what I’m doing right now

Just got to say your wiki skills are amaaaaazing

 

[Tofino]

Same tbh. I know I'd find it so difficult to sit through technical stuff and not completely zone out.

i wonder if the jury get transcripts of everything? I’d hope so, maybe someone here could clarify. Would help with the zoning out but also just being able to remember what a witness said.

 

[Hannah_204]

The thing for me at the moment that’s making me think she is guilty is all these collapses and excess deaths must have been really distressing for everyone but in the questioning she talks about it like she’s hardly remembered and it’s nothing.
But then she’s sending sympathy cards and looking up the parents years later.

 

[Emmelina Ball]

So the unit operating with only 21% staffing levels has been misconstrued then. It was a 21% shortfall. So relatively speaking that’s having 8 members of staff when you need 10. Or 16 when you need 20. Obviously not great still but nowhere near the same as having 2 staff members when you need 10.

Yep that’s right - might be very serious though when you look at what the ratio should be

It also looks like it wasn’t just nursing staff- other medical staff also reportedly inadequate for a tier 2 LNU

 

[Tofino]

Just got to say your wiki skills are amaaaaazing

oh thank you! Adhd hyperfocus and copy and paste are my superpowers I had practice with doing the Louise thompson wiki too.

tbh it actually helps me get the case straight in my head too. It’s been useful doing it.

 

[Lucyxxxx]

i wonder if the jury get transcripts of everything? I’d hope so, maybe someone here could clarify. Would help with the zoning out but also just being able to remember what a witness said.

I'd imagine they do yeah. I know they have the iPads due to the sheer amount of evidence don't they. Imagine being one of the jury. Dont envy them at all.

 

[Tofino]

Yep that’s right - might be very serious though when you look at what the ratio should be View attachment 1653081
It also looks like it wasn’t just nursing staff- other medical staff also reportedly inadequate for a tier 2 LNU
View attachment 1653087

Yes I’m sure it’s still serious but there was discussion earlier on in the thread about staffing levels only being 21%. And that’s not what the report says.

 

[Gingerfattie]

She’s definitely been deemed medically fit to stand trial. But again doesn’t mean she doesn’t have history of mental disorder or
current mental disorder. Just not of a degree she could plead diminished responsibility. Maybe she’s genuinely
not guilty. Or she’s a total grandiose fantasist and going with not guilty despite legal advice and the evidence. Reckless and risk taking to the end. Who knows???

 

[Emmelina Ball]

Yes I’m sure it’s still serious but there was discussion earlier on in the thread about staffing levels only being 21%. And that’s not what the report says.

Yea I remember reading it that’s why I started reading the report and sharing what it actually says.