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Tofino

VIP Member
@Tofino just went back and had a look at some pics the nurse who looked after my son most in NICU’s badge says neonatal practitioner. She pretty much did everything but that may vary from hospital to hospital? I remember she said she went into children’s nursing then had to do something else to get into NICU.
Hmm it’s just during this case all the nurses are called nurses but then Amy Davies took the stand (baby L&M) and court was told she was a neonatal practitioner - grade 6 - but looked like she was doing similar stuff to nurses.
So just wasn’t sure if there was a difference.
 
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Pulltheotherone

VIP Member
I was reading a book the other night - totally unrelated - but it’s a court drama and it mentioned that the defence get a list of the prosecution witnesses. Is this purely for the fiction book or I assume this is what happens in real life? So she would have known this witness was due to appear?
Yes - it’s all scheduled.
Both sides know who and when they will be called.
 
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slingo16

Chatty Member
It seems to be thought that this was the baby that the judge gave a NG verdict on the murder charge because no evidence was presented. So it appears they tried but didn't have the evidence to show the baby died as a result of her actions.

Edit: https://www.nursingtimes.net/news/c...n-not-guilty-verdict-on-one-count-15-06-2022/
Nah, I get that the cps decided that the evidence didn’t meet the threshold to go to court, I just think it’s strange that a provable (in their eyes) murder attempt happens 3 days before the child’s death and they can’t use that to help prove murder it just seems like pretty good circumstantial evidence to me.
 
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Haveyouanywool

VIP Member
baby was sedated not paralysed, I believe that’s because they’d tolerate the tube without being paralysed whereas in adults something more is required for adequate ventilation. We have a feedback loop/‘reflex’ which forces our respiratory drive and is led by factors such as circulating blood carbon dioxide. So the longer a breath is held, the higher the CO2 rises and this usually then leads us to gasp to exhale the co2 and take in o2. Morphine suppresses respiratory drive but doesn’t stop the breathing. There is more to it than this but easiest way to describe a form of self correction.
I only have experience of ventilation via tracheostomy, which obviously doesn’t require sedation.
If there was no air entry would you expect the baby, who obviously was not supporting her own breathing, to be able to make the respiratory effort required?
 
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Haveyouanywool

VIP Member
it would depend baby to baby and depend on the respiratory drive kicking in. There is a flip side to this which is that a high co2 causes drowsiness and reduces respiratory rate ie in the complex copd patients. So it’s a fine balance. I don’t know enough about neonatal respiratory drive to know when things should ‘kick in’ to stop baby essentially suffocating itself. Baby wasn’t sedated and tube wasn’t blocked so these can be discounted as cause. There is a possibility if she had denied o2/smothered baby to the point of a high co2/peri-arrest situation then the drive or self correction would never kick in - but this is just conversation and not a suggestion she went as far as this from the info given.
Are the prosecution not asserting that the ET tube was dislodged? I think the oxygen sats fell to 40% at one point. Would that be sufficient to, possibly, cause arrest?
 
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Daisydunn15

VIP Member
The only way I can think she poisoned bags she wasn't there to put up, is if she'd left them at the cotside to be "helpful" for the next shift coming on.
They weren't planned bag changes, they changed as the patient continued to have low blood sugars so the treatment plan changed whilst she was off shift, so no way of knowing it would be changed and to which bag. If she'd had them out ready it would be even more sus.
 
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stardust1

VIP Member
Yeah, I’ve read or heard somewhere prior that many Brits do not like the term ( hope Brits is an appropriate term - no offense intended). Panties or underwear is just deeply entrenched here & we don’t give it a thought. I personally like the way knickers rolls off my tongue & may adopt it using cultural appropriation 😊, but feel entitled as I am 57% English!
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I was flabbergasted when my fries (chips) came with mayonnaise, not ketchup, in England. We use crisp as an adjective mostly. And I love the word “loo” - the Beatles brought it to my attention. At home, we say bathroom but out and about it is restroom. My 81 year old mother says toilet. I also love wee - such an apt word and much less crass than pee, in my opinion. I am sure you welcomed the “restroom”!!! There are differences between states here - I’m sure I could be educated with many different terms were I to go out west, for instance. Virginia, being one of the major colonies and home to multiple Presidents, has place names such as Richmond, Norfolk, Pembroke, etc. I am sometimes surprised to see the same ones in the UK. Sorry, rambling a bit. Back to Dan!
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Biscuit and cookie are different things too🤣
 
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MmmB777

VIP Member
I think the nurse from stepping hill was also playing roulette with the bags? Not necessarily a question to you @MmmB777 (unless you know the answer) would the pharmacy ever question why they were giving more than the usual load of insulin to a ward or do the pharmacy just mind their own business so to speak?
I think @Deeznutslol was our resident pharmacist 🤞🏻
 
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tay65

VIP Member
I watched all three episodes last night and highly recommend them to everyone - thank you so much for the netflix recommendation. The kids are ultimately the ones who have paved way for any justice here, the bravery of them and their families (especially Morgan) is unreal. I hope beautiful Mallory’s death may at least lead gp a positive outcome in the whole family being found out and stopped, but the power and wealth of the brothers/son is still a concern. I avoid conspiracy stuff in general as my brain would just spiral but the conspiracies behind this could be 🤯
I've not watched the Netflix documentary so far but I did watch a lot of the trial and verdict on You Tube which was interesting. The American legal/courtroom set up seems quite laid back compared to the British system.
 
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stardust1

VIP Member
I’d love to know if this evidence is statemented and logged/dated somewhere at the time of it allegedly happening.
I remember reading somewhere about a doc raising concerns and being told to drop it Or something like that
 
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LittleMy

VIP Member
The chocolates, asking if she was ok, offering her his car… and when he mentioned cuddling the newborn babies. I was like, stop it! My ovaries can’t cope with this! have my babies right now you sexy sexy man. I hope we get to see what he looks like now 🤣🤣

I must be a big soppy wet wipe too cause I’m a sucker for that! My friend would punch me if she knew I went weak at the knees over something like that.. or if someone said that to me over text 🤣🤣
Would you still be saying that if he looked like a foot? 😝
 
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dual2099

Well-known member
Somebody posted on one of the FB groups about the notes and blood gas readings that were found at her home.,.well she said as a nurse she’s kept such things in her locker for over a year only to take it home to sort out. Also the age old argument again of ‘if she’s guilty why wouldn’t she destroy it’ too many cluedo players around!!😃 I don’t understand she could have destroyed anything relating to the hospital if she wasn’t guilty if she knew she was under suspicion, you’ll hardly leave a blood gas reading under the bed for the police to find to say well I’ll leave it there ok not guilty anyway!
 
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Court0x0

Member
What is it for you that makes you think she is definitely guilty?

I went from guilty to unsure and I hate being unsure!
 
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Appletiser

Well-known member
IMO to centre herself. I can understand being upset, crying but to be in floods of tears that match the parents is totally inappropriate. None of her responses are consistent. She doesn’t show emotions appropriately to me.
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🙄
I do agree that the professional needs to try and hide their emotions as it’s not about them, but sometimes you can’t control those tears.
It makes her seem more human and normal to me.
i was the closest to team G I’ve ever been but I admit this has put me back on the fence again.
 
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