Gender Discussion #16

[emm]

For those on Instagram, it's worth reporting the Sussex student profile as harassment. I've just done it. Also don't click on any of the stories as they will see your username.

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Yeah, guess they mean the 11 trans women who were murdered in the UK last year

have done
yeh exactly Have the uni officially said anything yet?

 

[Falkor]

If you ‘fear litigation’ that should be a big sign to you that what you’re doing and saying is wrong.

Not any more, sadly - in the current climate saying "A woman is an adult human female" in certain places will get you litigated against

 

[judgejohndeed]

Not any more, sadly - in the current climate saying "A woman is an adult human female" in certain places will get you litigated against

Depends as Maya Forstater’s case has given some protection against that but I assumed what they meant here was libel or slander in which case that should be an obvious sign to these people that they shouldn’t be saying what they’re saying

 

[katyazamo]

I'm horrified at what's happening with Kathleen Stock. What the hell is going on at Sussex? It's descending into a cesspit. I've also reported the instagram account and the two posts, the username is antiterfsussex.

The way these people will so viciously attack women is beyond me. And it's always women, especially older lesbian women who have constantly put themselves on the line. And the hatred is ALWAYS led by men or trans identifying men. Proof if you ever needed it that TiMs will never be women. There's just that specific type of hatred towards women that you only see in men.

 

[Ispyabudgetbeanblogger]

I have 2 teenagers. I'm terrified for them. As a teen mum my biggest worry when they were younger was teenage pregnancy, now I'm worried they are going to sterilise and mutilate themselves.

If I had girls, I'd be 10x more terrified. I think one good idea (in general, not just about all of this) is to encourage our children to think critically. There are lots of ways to help anyone develop better critical thinking skills. Yasmine Mohammed speaks about this quite often - how she only could leave her faith and the abuse she suffered because people helped her think things through by herself and she was able to come to her own conclusions. She wasn't able to hear 'God doesn't exist' or 'hell is a made-up concept' because she had been indoctrinated. She could, however, ponder questions such as 'If God exsits, why...?' or 'Why would a non-Muslim person who has done nothing but good in their lifetime go to hell?' etc. These types of questions helped her make up her own mind.

I think with kids it's entirely appropriate to ask them regularly about all sorts of things questions like:

How do you know this?
What's the evidence?
What would happen if you swapped X with Y? Would it still be true? Why/Why not?
Why do you think people believe X?
Why do you think people believe different things about X?
This is evidence A and this is evidence B. Which is stronger? Why?

 

[judgejohndeed]

If I had girls, I'd be 10x more terrified. I think one good idea (in general, not just about all of this) is to encourage our children to think critically. There are lots of ways to help anyone develop better critical thinking skills. Yasmine Mohammed speaks about this quite often - how she only could leave her faith and the abuse she suffered because people helped her think things through by herself and she was able to come to her own conclusions. She wasn't able to hear 'God doesn't exist' or 'hell is a made-up concept' because she had been indoctrinated. She could, however, ponder questions such as 'If God exsits, why...?' or 'Why would a non-Muslim person who has done nothing but good in their lifetime go to hell?' etc. These types of questions helped her make up her own mind.

I think with kids it's entirely appropriate to ask them regularly about all sorts of things questions like:

How do you know this?
What's the evidence?
What would happen if you swapped X with Y? Would it still be true? Why/Why not?
Why do you think people believe X?
Why do you think people believe different things about X?
This is evidence A and this is evidence B. Which is stronger? Why?

I completely agree with this.
I mentioned yesterday that the people I'm working with in the NHS said they'd done this transgender training. Well today, two of them were talking about it again and they were saying how while they really liked it (eye roll, they're both pronoun preachers so expected) it would have been good for the training to cover why this is important because they were both on board so the training was really pushing at an open door and so could've been helpful for 'those who aren't convinced.'
This is again eye roll material for a number of reasons but what stood out to me was the fact this training didn't even cover 'why it's important' aka, they assume everyone will just swallow what they're told and won't stop to think about if it even IS important. I find that very dangerous.

 

[House of Tea]

The Trudeau tweet is getting a big audience.

Justin Trudeau uses latest sexual identities acronym 2SLGBTQQIA+

Justin Trudeau has been mocked online for using the latest sexual identities acronym, 2SLGBTQQIA+, in a tweet - which includes the number and letter '2S' which stands for 'Two-spirit'.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[petitspois]

I'm horrified at what's happening with Kathleen Stock. What the hell is going on at Sussex? It's descending into a cesspit. I've also reported the instagram account and the two posts, the username is antiterfsussex.

The way these people will so viciously attack women is beyond me. And it's always women, especially older lesbian women who have constantly put themselves on the line. And the hatred is ALWAYS led by men or trans identifying men. Proof if you ever needed it that TiMs will never be women. There's just that specific type of hatred towards women that you only see in men.

thanks. I looked at the antiterf account and the followers are largely boys that are trying and failing to dress as women. Just pure misogyny.

 

[adult human female]

If I had girls, I'd be 10x more terrified. I think one good idea (in general, not just about all of this) is to encourage our children to think critically. There are lots of ways to help anyone develop better critical thinking skills. Yasmine Mohammed speaks about this quite often - how she only could leave her faith and the abuse she suffered because people helped her think things through by herself and she was able to come to her own conclusions. She wasn't able to hear 'God doesn't exist' or 'hell is a made-up concept' because she had been indoctrinated. She could, however, ponder questions such as 'If God exsits, why...?' or 'Why would a non-Muslim person who has done nothing but good in their lifetime go to hell?' etc. These types of questions helped her make up her own mind.

I think with kids it's entirely appropriate to ask them regularly about all sorts of things questions like:

How do you know this?
What's the evidence?
What would happen if you swapped X with Y? Would it still be true? Why/Why not?
Why do you think people believe X?
Why do you think people believe different things about X?
This is evidence A and this is evidence B. Which is stronger? Why?

Me teens are 1 of each, definitely more worried about where my daughters head is at than my sons. I try to talk to both of them and encourage the critical thinking but my daughter shuts down and has nothing to say, whereas I can have a good back and forth convo with my son.

 

[jordishaw]

thanks. I looked at the antiterf account and the followers are largely boys that are trying and failing to dress as women. Just pure misogyny.

Boys who cannot spell or punctuate correctly, adding insult to injury.

 

[emm]

The Trudeau tweet is getting a big audience.

Justin Trudeau uses latest sexual identities acronym 2SLGBTQQIA+

Justin Trudeau has been mocked online for using the latest sexual identities acronym, 2SLGBTQQIA+, in a tweet - which includes the number and letter '2S' which stands for 'Two-spirit'.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I wonder at what point they stop adding the + at this point what else more could thete be to add?!

 

[thegirlscout]

Never been more glad to have left academia than today. This is obscene.

What was said, the tweet has been deleted

The Trudeau tweet is getting a big audience.

Justin Trudeau uses latest sexual identities acronym 2SLGBTQQIA+

Justin Trudeau has been mocked online for using the latest sexual identities acronym, 2SLGBTQQIA+, in a tweet - which includes the number and letter '2S' which stands for 'Two-spirit'.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Isn’t 2 spirit offensive to indigenous people, the sort that are already oppressed by the Canadian government?!

 

[emm]

What was said, the tweet has been deleted


Isn’t 2 spirit offensive to indigenous people, the sort that are already oppressed by the Canadian government?!

no because don't forget noone is as oppressed as trans women

 

[Thorongil]

I’m interested in this argument that drag is equivalent to blackface. I’ve kind of held that view my whole life. It’s not a subject that has come up very often but when it has I’ve always been told “oh it’s just a bit of fun” by both men and women.

I’ve never seen the appeal in drag. It’s not funny, or interesting or entertaining. I have never understood the point in it and why it was accepted in the mainstream as entertainment.

I’ve always felt that it was an insulting caricature. I would see family and friends finding Dame Edna and Lilly Savage hilarious and think I was missing something obvious about how this was supposedly good. If I’m being totally honest it always gave me the creeps.

 

[petitspois]

I've never liked drag either. It was interesting watching the Greatest Dancer reality show a few years ago with my two daughters and a drag troupe came on. The crowd went wild before they had started to perform and my daughters were perplexed, and asked me why men dressed as woman was a show.

 

[Clover123]

I’m interested in this argument that drag is equivalent to blackface. I’ve kind of held that view my whole life. It’s not a subject that has come up very often but when it has I’ve always been told “oh it’s just a bit of fun” by both men and women.

I’ve never seen the appeal in drag. It’s not funny, or interesting or entertaining. I have never understood the point in it and why it was accepted in the mainstream as entertainment.

I’ve always felt that it was an insulting caricature. I would see family and friends finding Dame Edna and Lilly Savage hilarious and think I was missing something obvious about how this was supposedly good. If I’m being totally honest it always gave me the creeps.

The first time I ever saw drag race, a male housemate showed it to me and said, with absolutely no shame at all, that some of the contestants hated another because he was "fishy." I asked him what that meant, and he explained it was because he could pass for a woman, hence fishy. I still didn't get it and he had to explain exactly why they called it fishy.
Interesting that there's no adoration for women dressing as men, and no offensive term for women passing as men. It just hides a very disturbing view of women as disgusting, and i don't understand how it has become so mainstream. I've always found it a bit disturbing and creepy like you too!

 

[SqualorVictoria]

Oh wow

 

[Clover123]

Oh wow

YES SUSSEX!

 

[House of Tea]

F-Ventrella has amended the message on Instagram. I have screenshot the post, but I also screenshot the original and attach both her in case he deletes post completely. First one is amended, second is original

 

[SqualorVictoria]

For once it's good to see adults manning a Twitter account and not some blue haired intern brat.

Also, this!