Constance Marten and Mark Gordon Case #5

[Pinkpenguinx]

It’s haunting me that they were carrying around that babies body with them. I just can’t get it out of my mind.

Me too ive not been able to think about anything other than that dear little girls body being left to rot in a bag with rubbish. Honestly I just can not comprehend how they are sleeping at night or functioning after leaving her like that

 

[HistrionicSites]

I suggest you look up the scope of the job title.

I really don’t care what their job title says, the fact is they cannot diagnose (which my OH found out to his detriment).
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Uneducated . Lol!
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There are so frighteningly clueless people on this thread I’ve got to say
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There are some frighteningly clueless people on this thread I’ve got to say
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Have you only ever experienced third world health care?

Well if you call the south west of England third world, then yes. My IH was seen by a nurse practioner for six months for a lump in their neck and was treated three times with antibiotics. On the fourth appointment he demanded that the NP went and ask the GP for a consult. The GP took one look and got an urgent referral to the hospital. If the referral had been made six months previously, treatment would have been radically different.

No, I’m not ignorant, just my life experience.
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Uneducated . Lol!
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There are so frighteningly clueless people on this thread I’ve got to say
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There are some frighteningly clueless people on this thread I’ve got to say
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Have you only ever experienced third world health care?

What a pompous response!

 

[Emsie]

Oh, I agree, but there will be discussion on those circumstances and whether the outcome would have been the same if the search for them had a lower profile.

The irony being that because it was high profile they were found.

 

[TenerifeTigger]

I've been following this thread and the trial a bit. The way that poor baby was found is bleeping inhumane.

My old neighbour lost her baby through sids and the police made a mistake and woke my partner up as they had wrong flat and when he phoned me at 5am (I was nightshift) I could hear her screaming in the background then they moved and never came back to the flat, that's how I expect someone who just lost a baby to react. Not to put it in a bag with other rubbish.

It also made me very paranoid when I had my 2nd and I had breathing pads etc under her. Even now she's nearly 3 I still panic. She was in my room till over 2. My oldest however was in her own room with a monitor at 6 months.

 

[HoneyNed]

Was Victoria still alive when they were looking in the bins for food? I wouldn't be surprised if they thought of leaving her there

 

[Haveyouanywool]

Was Victoria still alive when they were looking in the bins for food? I wouldn't be surprised if they thought of leaving her there

She was almost certainly dead by that point.

 

[Lynn’ssnazzycardigan]

I've been following this thread and the trial a bit. The way that poor baby was found is bleeping inhumane.

My old neighbour lost her baby through sids and the police made a mistake and woke my partner up as they had wrong flat and when he phoned me at 5am (I was nightshift) I could hear her screaming in the background then they moved and never came back to the flat, that's how I expect someone who just lost a baby to react. Not to put it in a bag with other rubbish.

It also made me very paranoid when I had my 2nd and I had breathing pads etc under her. Even now she's nearly 3 I still panic. She was in my room till over 2. My oldest however was in her own room with a monitor at 6 months.

It sadly happened to a neighbour of mine. It was over 20 years ago and she was 10 doors down but I can still remember the sound of her grief and terror as they were loaded into the ambulance. I can’t comprehend how they seemed so unbothered by the worst thing that could happen to somebody.

 

[HotesTilaire]

He might have had trench foot from the outdoor living. He might have broken his ankle. Who knows? Their thought processes aren’t normal. She could have insisted on praying to heal it for all we know.
I will say the papers reporting is terrible. It’s taken half the people here to deduce what was in which bag, by checking reports and podcasts.

 

[Here2BNosey]

The irony being that because it was high profile they were found.

They were found, yes. But sadly too little for three little baby.

I don't believe that's what us in question though, op was saying people may question whether the outcome would have been different and I have wondered this myself. It's difficult without being accused of being in support of them but I do wonder had the police operation been more covert, could they have prevented them from running and hiding? I think they would have run out if cash at some point, become blaze. Thinking they were "safe" and no one was looking for them. I doubt they would have gone so far underground, so thoroughly unprepared if not for the attention and spotlight on them at that time. I mean no one really knows but they were favouring hotels until the point they knew they were front page news, then panic mode set in.

To clarify I don't defend or condone any if their actions, they are wholly responsible for the death of their daughter and I hope it haunts them every day of their wretched lives. I do think things could have been handled differently.

 

[Lady Parker Rose the 3rd]

I think this is insence, probably to cover the smell, and for some reason it's made me so sad, like I didn't realise I could get more sad about this. The reality of it!
I know it ads nothing to the case really...

 

[Blurp]

I really don’t care what their job title says, the fact is they cannot diagnose (which my OH found out to his detriment).
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Well if you call the south west of England third world, then yes. My IH was seen by a nurse practioner for six months for a lump in their neck and was treated three times with antibiotics. On the fourth appointment he demanded that the NP went and ask the GP for a consult. The GP took one look and got an urgent referral to the hospital. If the referral had been made six months previously, treatment would have been radically different.

No, I’m not ignorant, just my life experience.
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What a pompous response!

We hear stories like this about doctors, GPs all the time. My friend died from cancer because her doctor fobbed her off. Another friend's mother died from cancer because she was fobbed off by more than one doctor over years. No one says that all doctors are tit. Yet your story of a single experience damns all nurse practitioners as incompetent?

Yes, they can diagnose and prescribe. So can doctor's assistants. We have both at our practice as well as doctors and practice nurses.

 

[Bagpuss20]

My first thought was that MGs leg injury was through him injecting drugs and his leg was ulcerated which in my head could also explain the chaotic way they were living but there’s been no evidence of this and if there had I’m sure it would’ve been discussed by now?

I was wondering about trenchfoot. Middle of winter, wet conditions and probably unsuitable leaking footwear. Not removing his shoes and socks and the skin constantly being cold and wet. He had a plastic bag over his shoe- either to keep the damp out or contain the wound leakage?

 

[pommobear]

I am actually and you have been one of the worst offenders for it. I understand it’s hard to look outside our own experiences of life and love but it’s perfectly possible for people to just be plain evil
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Because since they both took off it was all pure speculation that their motives were that they were just scared loving parents who wanted to raise their baby in a loving but alternative way of life. Even as more and more evidence came out to the contrary people were still insisting they meant well. And even now the baby was found rotting in a bag and the parents were more concerned about crisps and the rights and wrongs about the law of concealing a birth people are still insisting well it’s their form of love. There has been no love shown all along, take it from someone who has worked in a professional capacity with many sociopaths incapable of emotion and stop the faux naivety that nobody is capable of being evil

You've totally misunderstood and misinterpreted my posts by the sound of it. I've at no point said or even implied they were scared and loving parents, or that they meant well, and I've also said multiple times they deserve to be locked up.

 

[neroli]

It sadly happened to a neighbour of mine. It was over 20 years ago and she was 10 doors down but I can still remember the sound of her grief and terror as they were loaded into the ambulance. I can’t comprehend how they seemed so unbothered by the worst thing that could happen to somebody.

I suppose they thought they could just have another one as a replacement?

 

[Emsie]

You've totally misunderstood and misinterpreted my posts by the sound of it. I've at no point said or even implied they were scared and loving parents, or that they meant well, and I've also said multiple times they deserve to be locked up.

You'll go round in circles explaining yourself. People cannot seem to understand that both things are true.
They are Hideous abusive parentd who caused the death of their daughter.
They thought they were doing the right thing because of xyz
They were definitely not doing the right thing and deserve to punished.
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They were found, yes. But sadly too little for three little baby.

I don't believe that's what us in question though, op was saying people may question whether the outcome would have been different and I have wondered this myself. It's difficult without being accused of being in support of them but I do wonder had the police operation been more covert, could they have prevented them from running and hiding? I think they would have run out if cash at some point, become blaze. Thinking they were "safe" and no one was looking for them. I doubt they would have gone so far underground, so thoroughly unprepared if not for the attention and spotlight on them at that time. I mean no one really knows but they were favouring hotels until the point they knew they were front page news, then panic mode set in.

To clarify I don't defend or condone any if their actions, they are wholly responsible for the death of their daughter and I hope it haunts them every day of their wretched lives. I do think things could have been handled differently.

No I get that.
It's a balance of risk though isn't it. No one really cared until the placenta was found. Two grown consenting adults can traipse the country and live in their cars if they want to, but babies can't.
Yes the media pushed them further into panic mode but I don't know what else they could have done. Without the public on the Outlook the police wouldn't stand a chance finding them the way they zig zagged around.

 

[pommobear]

You'll go round in circles explaining yourself. People cannot seem to understand that both things are true.
They are Hideous abusive parentd who caused the death of their daughter.
They thought they were doing the right thing because of xyz
They were definitely not doing the right thing and deserve to punished.

Thank you. I'm autistic and can find it quite distressing when people don't understand what I've said!

 

[neroli]

They were doing what they wanted to do which was "right" to them because it meant defying the authorities. I doubt whether they will have considered whether it was right for their baby. It was right for them.
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Thank you. I'm autistic and can find it quite distressing when people don't understand what I've said!

Don't worry. You express yourself very well.

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

Thank you. I'm autistic and can find it quite distressing when people don't understand what I've said!

It’s no reflection on anything you’ve said. We’re just screaming into the void.

 

[Ittybittytittyclub]

Thank you. I'm autistic and can find it quite distressing when people don't understand what I've said!

You’re fine. We understand what you’re saying and what you mean. There is an ignore button if some people are too much.

 

[pommobear]

I think it is quite important to try to understand motive. It may help the next time something like this happens. Like it or not there are now quite a few people out there who are utterly convinced that those in authority - doctors/nurses, social services etc - at best do not have the best interests of their children at heart and at worst are actively trying to steal/harm them, and that only they (the parents) know what's what. Delusional thinking. I see it constantly in the home ed community. Not to this extreme a degree but the thought process is the same.