Constance Marten and Mark Gordon Case #3

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Whataday21

So if they paid in cash for everything does this mean all the reports from the taxi, the restaurant, shops, supermarkets, hotels were from individual reports each time?

It's also quite odd that at least one hotel let them pay in cash. They usually ask for a card incase you steal anything or trash the room/smoke in the room.
 
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iieee

I don't believe her account suggesting SIDS. She also says the child was well clothed and clean, and there's no way that can be true. It's probably true that the child just died in her arms but that doesn't mean there wasn't a cause, e.g. hypothermia, infection, etc. The eyewitness accounts do not paint a picture of a child that was well cared for.
 
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Dogmuck

Yes

There’s always someone somewhere that’s prepared to take cash
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thisisme20 said:
Good one to follow
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Thanks that is a cracker
 
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InTheDollsHouse

flap a doodle dandy said:
what kind of man has 5 kids and doesn't put them first. They both seem as bad as each other but it does annoy how the media seems to be very focused on her and her background.
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Yes! I get that she makes a good front page - aristocrat heiress with trust fund flees and lives in shithole with sex offender - but he is equally culpable for anything that’s happened to their children.
 
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flap a doodle dandy

InTheDollsHouse said:
Yes! I get that she makes a good front page - aristocrat heiress with trust fund flees and lives in shithole with sex offender - but he is equally culpable for anything that’s happened to their children.
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I completely agree - a lot more stories about her parents and hwo much they sold their estate for than his time in prison
 
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Dogmuck

InTheDollsHouse said:
Yes! I get that she makes a good front page - aristocrat heiress with trust fund flees and lives in shithole with sex offender - but he is equally culpable for anything that’s happened to their children.
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Just reading that Twitter feed (total crime), it’s detailed and much of the evidence is focused on her because she’s basically the only one who’s spoken, so far, he’s asked for food . She’s accepted full responsibility for the child’s death by saying shes smothered her while sleeping. She is definitely trying to take the heat off him.

He is equally culpable but she seems set on not throwing any shade on him. It could be that he has some licence conditions on either his American conviction or something else that’s happened here that may mean he could serve heavy time???
 
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SoOverIt84

Agree, evidencing threshold to even get into the court arena is high. Immediate removal on an interim care order higher again.

All of those, can potentially be managed with robust safety plans even when level of risk meets the threshold to issue care proceedings. It might be the first was on an interim supervision order, or an interim care order in a mother and baby assessment placement or a mother and baby foster placement. She’d then have the 26 weeks or so of the proceedings before judgement made about full care order and removal.

Or like you say caring for baby and at some point later, a significant precipitating event happened that resulted in their removal.

Even with subsequent babies, all assessments would repeated so not to preempt any judgement of the court. But also, even the smallest chance of positive change is worth being curious and exploring further so when life story work is completed, they know that every chance of remaining with their birth family was assessed.

InTheDollsHouse said:
on her fb there’s bty / dav / cof - I wonder if a fourth was removed at birth and that’s why no photos
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Even when removed at birth, which could be a few days, there would be the photos in the hospital. Then once removed, supervised contact is promoted, several times a week until the final hearing. After that, contact reduces to once a month until an adoption match has been found and then stops. So even if they didn’t turn up to any of supervised contact, they’d have the hospital ones.
 
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Dogmuck

flap a doodle dandy said:
I completely agree - a lot more stories about her parents and hwo much they sold their estate for than his time in prison
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I think we said this originally though, this wouldn’t be big news if it wasn’t for her. She’s the story and us poors love to see the rich getting some right????
 
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InTheDollsHouse

thisisme20 said:
Good one to follow
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So the first child - FF - was born in winter 2017 - says taken into care when they were found sleeping in a tent, but also says the first care proceedings weren’t started until 2019 (aside from an alert for CM as they believed she needed help when pregnant). That child was 1-2 years old then.

I can’t work out about the second child - GG

Or the third child - HH

The fourth child - II - was born 2021 (after May) and she left hospital without him or her then tried to return the next day.
 
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SoOverIt84

thisisme20 said:
Good one to follow
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looking at this thread, their older 4 were removed for neglect, concealing pregnancy, not engaging with services. Absolutely no need to be sleeping in campervans and tents, both housing and social care would have a duty to accommodate so would offer hotel/ hostel. Plus she had money to house them, so they were making chaotic lifestyle choices.
 
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superhanscrack

Hi, been lurking for ages. Just wanted to say before I catch up that has anyone
Seen a programme years ago called “protecting our children” ? It was about social workers and I remember a case of a couple with previous children taken into care, living in tents etc. I think her name was Marva
 
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InTheDollsHouse

I wonder if they had the two middle children in secret and it only became apparent afterwards.
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I requested one but I don’t think mods have got to it yet.
I’m happy to get it started but also happy if anyone else wants to

@Tofino was the wiki superstar for letby
 
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K

Kittycat86

In her police interview, she apparently purchased petrol to do a DIY cremation so she could remove all evidence of the baby.

She then decided against it as she wanted a PM done and then a burial which apparently she also contemplated doing in woodland but was too weak from hunger to manage so left her in the shed instead.

I really don’t think this woman is mentally well to even contemplate doing any of this to her own child, it’s no excuse but I honestly think her judgement is mashed and she needs some serious psychiatric help.

You could also argue that’s rather calculated and she must’ve been compos mentis to make those kind of decisions depending the way you look at it and why wasn’t loverboy mentioned in any of this?

Either way she’s clearly not well and Folie a deux springs to mind, she will likely do everything in her power to attempt to get him off as she’s clearly smitten regardless that they’re both culpable.
 
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SoOverIt84

that confused me, as they seem far too anti establishment to have signed a s20 and voluntarily hand child into to care, even for a short time whilst they sorted housing
 
Reactions: 6

InTheDollsHouse

Dogmuck said:
He is equally culpable but she seems set on not throwing any shade on him. It could be that he has some licence conditions on either his American conviction or something else that’s happened here that may mean he could serve heavy time???
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Trauma bond. She has been deserted by her father, abused in a cult, then MG swans in and (gives her children so) she’s besotted.
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Kittycat86 said:
I really don’t think this woman is mentally well to even contemplate doing any of this to her own child, it’s no excuse but I honestly think her judgement is mashed and she needs some serious psychiatric help.
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Exactly this.

There’s significant mental illness in her immediate family, before you even think about the trauma from the cult, which her friends have said changed her. That doesn’t just disappear when you’re out of the situation.
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SoOverIt84 said:
that confused me, as they seem far too anti establishment to have signed a s20 and voluntarily hand child into to care, even for a short time whilst they sorted housing
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Yes I can’t work it out. The lack of mention of the other two children seems important.

I also think her meeting MG was when the lines of communication and possible help from her family stopped.
 
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Tofino

haha it was me that did the Letby wiki. Not sure I’d call myself a legend but I’ll take it

I’ve been lurking here but not sure I can get so invested this time though. Letby’s trial lasting 10 months was intense!
 
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InTheDollsHouse

Tofino said:
haha it was me that did the Letby wiki. Not sure I’d call myself a legend but I’ll take it

I’ve been lurking here but not sure I can get so invested this time though. Letby’s trial lasting 10 months was intense!
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Don’t you own tattle
 
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M

MrsJones83

I’m trying to follow the argus live stream thing but it says I need to subscribe to read
 
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