Caroline Flack

[Lucyinthesky88]

From celebrities to people I know IRL, everyone it posting #bekind in relation to this. Obviously, that’s a great message generally, but in response to someone who was arrested for assaulting her boyfriend... it just seems a strange reaction. Was she being kind to have attacked him, if indeed that is what happened?

 

[DowntoearthDawn]

Wow what a disgusting comment, Joe worked with Caroline on I’m a celeb so I can understand he’s upset. I’d hate to have you as a mother and be met with an eye roll when I’m sad about my friends death

I’m a great mother who has seen her own mother beg for life when in agony with cancer. I cherish life. Caroline wanted attention, she’s got it.

 

[Lechat]

Genuinely why has an explosion of mental health come up about CF? If we think back to pre-allegations, were there concerns for her mental health? Or is it just now when she was shown to the world as a domestic abuser and she got - pardon the pun - flack for it and couldn’t take the sourness? She seemed fine with adoration and didn’t mind comments then but then this happened, and the worlds opinion changed a lot and a court case is confirmed and boom now because of this, MH is thrown around and no one is allowed to say anything because it’s not kind

Like. Really?

this is a really good point. No one gave a stuff about her mental state when the allegations and subsequent charges
were made. It was all good goss at that point.

now the Twitter mob and insta huns are posting about mental health, be kind and the Samaritans phone number. It’s naive at best and reductionism at worse to imply mental health disorders can be treated with kindness and a quick chat to the samaritans.

Mental Health problems are complex, hard to treat. They can have ugly symptoms which can be hidden by the person experiencing them. i often think people with mental health problems can become very self absorbed in their own problems - I am not blaming them for this - but it can make them very difficult people to be around. Often people aren’t sure how to handle or deal with someone with mental health problems which compounds the isolation they might feel as well as contributes to the self absorption as everyone is on ‘egg shells’.

at the moment we are obsessed as a society by the ”mental health crisis” but really it’s just words. No one really wants to deal with the hard realities of some mental health conditions. I feel like anxiety or depression are the two palatable mental health issues for the insta huns, who see it as another topic to drive up likes and engagement because they believe it can be solved by being kind or having a chat. It’s bullshit.

 

[Sal152]

I feel for her family, the ones left beind to pick up the pieces. But I'm not on board with this near canonisation of her just because she killed herself. I'm sure this has all been said but if the roles were flipped and a man awaiting trial for domestic violence had done the same, surely there would not be the same outpouring of grief? I'm not a heartless person but she was in the public eye, obviously her ups and downs in life are going to wind up being common knowledge. It irks me because the double standard is shocking. I live in a place that has near epidemic rates of suicide, especially in young people. The posts from people I know are an outcry to the media, that they've caused this. Unfortunately, whilst the headlines could be quite garish, often tacky the media were doing their job. They reported on a person in the public eye, awaiting trial for an assault. This wasn't a "witch hunt" and whilst is has no bearing on your or mine's lives (I'm sure little to none of us reading her actually knew her personally) all these "thoughts and prayers" need to be sent to her family. The ones who will be left tortured by this.

 

[freda19]

Totally disagree with this, I was in a very violent & emotional abusive relationship. I left (eventually) & took my children to a woman’s refuge. I don’t believe with her it was a prolonged abusive relationship. I believe she was drunk & made a mistake, lashed out which is still not ok but we’ve all made mistakes, although my ex was the abuser I definitely lashed out at least once from the emotional abuse & there’s a difference between domestic violence & a one off, it’s never ok but domestic abusive is not a one off. Truth is we don’t know. She Pled not guilty. Her boyfriend denies it & stuck by her & the court case was ongoing so who are you to say coz she died she’s “the victim”. I’m so bad at expressing how I feel in writing but basically what I’m saying is

She was accused as you said yourself. Not sentenced. Her boyfriend stood by her

I was in a very violent & emotionally abusive relationship that went on for years before I finally took my children to a woman’s refuge but do we actually know 100% she violently attacked someone?! No. He’s denied it. She’s denied it & it was going to court. I’ve heard other stories about where the blood came from. She was self harming & he caught her?! She’s taken her own life. What is it you exactly want? From experiencing what I’ve been through I don’t believe she was like that, I believe it was a drunk emotional one off, still not ok at all but I don’t think she was a consistent violent, emotional abuser BUT the truth is none of us actually know what happened & that’s exactly why this has happened. Who are we to comment. People trolling, talking, speculating, gossiping, hating. At the end of the day this was a private matter no matter the situation & should have stayed that way. Why was it ever allowed so public. Especially before a GUILTY verdict in COURT OF LAW not bloody daily mail or the sun. We’re only humans & theres a fucking lot worse humans in the world. I believe she didn’t deserve this & it could have been prevented

That's all very well but her last ex hinted at a similar style of relationship to what the cops found that night with lewis. The ex (the BB guy) even liked posts about female on male DV on twitter/inst and tellingly posted an image of an NDA, which has been taken as him saying he signed one and thus cannot openly comment. So maybe liking posts about it was as much as he could do to support the guy he saw as another victim. Until Lewis denied being a victim. The ex actually went to Australia to get away from the messy break up with CF, which is pretty extreme. So it may not be a one off incident. Nor should it remain private if it's an on going issue. It had to be addressed, especially after she also went nuts at the cops that night and flipped over a table in her anger so she certainly had a whopper of a temper.
None of us are saints, we are all flawed. I think Caroline just couldn't face the disgrace that airing her flaws in court would bring. Which is sad. If she had found it in herself to admit her part in the mess then it might indeed have been brushed aside by the busy cops as something the couple should deal with privately, but needing restrained by cops at the flat and going postal in the cop shop sealed the deal for charging her that night.
It's sad but it's nobody's fault.

 

[Lollipop19]

I think some of these comments are made like we're talking about a character in the latest netflix series and not an actual human. I've commented before that I am not defending what she may have done, but all this speculation and casual questions- 'Wonder if she left a note?' 'Why didn't she just get away from the media?' 'Why did her friend go to the shop?'- are totally unnecessary. Some of us will have no idea and others may have more experience, but none of us were in her head and I believe that for her to do this, her head would have been a very very dark place indeed. She wouldn't have been thinking rationally. She wouldn't have been thinking about what she'd leave behind. She'd be plotting her escape from her demons and that would habe consumed her. If you think the 'be kind' movement is sickly, then at least have some compassion to avoid the insults right now.

 

[ElectileDysfunction]

Very informative insight from a Barrister particularly relevant to CF's situation is this part-

As a prosecution and defence barrister, I see frequently how, save in cases where an accused has severe mental health problems that impact upon the legalities of the trial process, there is little consideration for the impact of proceedings upon a defendant’s welfare.

Rarely is it acknowledged how the strain of the criminal process - whether the allegation is true or not - can affect a person. Can break a person. And this lack of care pervades not only the system, but our society.

And let's not forget that the stress of a trial is bad enough for the average person, but CF being a famous celebrity would have meant the papers/TV cameras/paps hounding her everyday and exposing all her private details over the front pages and social media. I can't imagine having to go through that very public humiliation and intrusion, especially if I was suffering depression and other mental health issues.

This should all have been taken into account by the CPS when deciding whether to prosecute, but it sounds like they either overlooked her mental health issues or didn't take them seriously enough.

With all due respect, you clearly dont understand how the criminal justice system works.

If the CPS were duty bound to not prosecute anyone whose mental health was fragile, then a lot of awfully serious offenders would remain untouchable. That clearly cannot be desirable. Depression and anxiety are a point of mitigation, not a defence. It would influence her sentence rather than mean there was no public interest in prosecuting at all. The point of that barrister's post was that there needs to be more safeguards in the system to help manage defendant's stress levels - avoiding undue delays before going to trial, press restrictions etc...not that Flack shouldn't have been charged at all.

 

[Banana Man]

Does anyone else think it's absurd the idea of cancelling love island over this?
The deaths involving love island people were about cocaine, alcohol and debt. Nothing to do with a reality TV. What do people want to cancel all reality TV and just have documentaries?
Flack was all about gossip and trashy reality TV, she loved doing it. She wasn't some celeb with a talent to showcase and hounded by the media.

id you don't want to watch love island no one is forcing you to, but why do you want a TV show off the air that others like??

 

[caitlinbullen]

I know no one will ever know but I can imagine this is true, it makes sense why he called 999, more to protect her and stop her hurting herself? I was never her biggest fan, but it’s made me feel so sad she didn’t get the help that could have saved her. She obviously wasn’t a bad person as she has so many friends speaking out saying how amazing she was. Her friend posted this photo of her from Friday and she looks so beautiful and natural View attachment 85394

Jesus I swear I have never seen a bad photo of her?! She was totally my girl crush. I 100% appreciate that being this fit does not prevent someone from having serious problems/hardships, but she was bright, hot as hell, and had plenty of talent. What a bloody waste.

I am ashamed to say that I would watch the police body-cam footage from the evening of the original alleged assault on her b/f in a heartbeat if it was leaked though. I am not proud of that but at least I’m honest. She was reported to be horrified at it being released and in a sick sense that just piques my interest to see it.

 

[YellowTail]

I have been cringing at the #bekind brigade’s instasham crap. Openly blaming Lewis for her death, apparently caused by him deciding to call the police after she assaulted him, followed by #hashtagbullshit. Commenting Lewis should ‘of’ dropped the charges. Their tributes are littered with basic errors which are an insult. ‘fly with the angles’ which angles would that be, right angles? The Zeleb tributes are just as self serving, with dreadful photographs. All chosen where because celeb looks good. It’s not all about Caroline, don’t you know! Stef Davies, Kerry Katona and Katie Price are at the forefront of this nonsense. Just waiting for Daniella Westbrook to post a tribute. That’ll make it a full house, BINGO.

 

[conrea37]

Why was the other thread locked?

I would imagine because it was created following her domestic abuse charge. And when threads come up to 50 pages, new ones are made anyway.

Also to add the Samaritans info which I feel is very useful at the moment, mental health is a serious issue that still isn’t treated as seriously as it should be.

Regardless of how anyone felt about Caroline, this is very sad.

 

[Miss98]

My opinion probably won't be popular. It's really sad that Caroline has died, she clearly had issues going on inside of her and was a deeply unhappy person deep down. She didn't deserve to want to end her life and feel so low. However, this isn't the first time a partner or ex of hers has come forth to allege that she hit him, and she should have sought help for her issues professionally or somehow before it got to this point. She should really have acknowledged that she has issues and her behaviour was not acceptable.

Nobody knows the ins and outs but it seems like Lewis is doing the typical taking back what he said as victim and loving her, and I'm not sure if the truth of that night will ever come out now.

I don't agree to people writing hateful personal things to her, but when you become famous, you choose to put yourself in the public eye and will get scrutinised. Especially in this day and age of equality, you'll have people saying she should be treated the same as men do when it comes to domestic violence cases (to which I agree). Remember when she quit her role as presenter of LI and everyone said she shouldn't have been given a choice, if it were a man etc.

As a person who's experienced abuse, perpetrators are very good at telling you sweet things and saying sorry so that you stay with them and keep schtum, what she did was wrong but of course she didn't deserve to get so low to a point where she killed herself. I wish she got help and admitted her demons.

 

[Greys1324]

No but its life and it happens!!!!! Someone has died here, do you have a heart? Wow

Yes I do have a heart. I care about every person who was clobbered and didn’t dare report it or tell someone because people like you. You should be ashamed of yourself.

 

[lemonelmo]

I think we can and have all agreed this is a terrible tragedy.

However I think it would be very hypocritical of us to be acting like a lot of 'insta celebs' are doing and pretending she was a Saint.

Most of us who are here have either contributed to the thread about Caroline or atleast read it before and for us to now say we take back everything we say just because she's passed away? Nah, there was still a court case for a serious matter. Innocent until proven guilty yes, but this case was going ahead without the support of Lewis... They must have had reason for this.

I'm unsure if what I'm trying to say is coming across right but basically... From what I've seen here there's been a lot of Rip and being very respectful of this tragic passing... Nobody here wanted this outcome. But a lot of you have also said this doesn't change what you previously thought and I commend you for this.

 

[Notaninstamum]

Come on guys she was someone's daughter/sister/friend and was very much loved, do you not think this should all be dropped now out of respect. She clobbered her boyfriend who more than likely wound her up and made things worse, I myself have been there and so many other people i know. It was blown up, so much she has taken her life and its dreadful

So when I was left black & blue it was my fault? Or when my relative almost died, she was the one who made it worse because she pushed him? Or when my friend killed herself because of abuse it was down to her?

Okay.

 

[sid&nancy123]

I wonder who she reached out to & they said she was draining

 

[Be More Pacific]

Has anyone seen what Andrew Brady has posted ?! Seems very angry and blaming a lot of people but he himself came out publicly and added fuel to the fire ... he isn’t as innocent either !

Wow. I can only hope that when I die and someone decides to leave a 'tribute' for me, they don't use the word 'cunt' quite so liberally.

 

[thegirlscout]

Someone said in the previous thread that there was quite detailed rumour going around in December on the true story of her arrest, what do they mean?

 

[Horatio]

I totally agree with this. It would have taken an extreme amount of courage to end her own life. She must of been in a really bad place.
Mental health isn't the same as cancer. Cancer is in its own court. Both horrible but different.

Totally agree and I think your post and the one you responded to from @indescribe are really important for as many people as possible to see in this conversation.
We can’t create hierarchies of suffering - comparing suicide to cancer or sepsis is not relevant or helpful. It doesn’t make sense. Just like we aren’t about to compare cancer with sepsis either.

Admittedly I used to find suicide a hard one to understand too. Without personal experience it seems impossibly selfish when imagine the pain it leaves behind. But from talking to people, especially a close friend who was on the brink for close to a year, I see that severe mental illness messes up your brain chemistry and you don’t see the world like a healthy person.
So you can honestly believe friends and family don’t really love you. You honestly believe they would be better off without you. That’s how malignant and destructive an illness it is.

 

[SunshineDreamer]

I’m shocked that people are blaming the CPS. Obviously it’s very sad but you can’t stop the CPS from pursuing DV cases because those being prosecuted might be suicidal?
Blaming the CPS is so harmful for DV victims who already struggle to come forward or even get a conviction when they do come forward.

As someone who works for CPS, I have seen too many DV cases cross my desk. They would not have gone forward with the case, celebrity or not, if they didn’t have substantial evidence to make their case. I’ve seen one too many DV case slip through my fingers due to a technicality.

That being said, I feel dreadfully sorry that she felt that this was her only option.

did caroline leave a note i wonder

anyhow.....in my opinion her solicitor would have advised her of the probable outcome of her prosecution and i feel it would have been a custodial sentence, hence her taking her life. cps do not prosecute on a whim. the solicitor would have gone through the evidence etc so they would have a pretty good idea of how it would pan out.

i think it was more likely that that pushed her over the edge rather than the press/social media ......press and media made her what she was after all

Her solicitor would have advised her of the probable outcome but that being said, I would have been incredibly surprised if it had been a custodial sentence. Hefty fine, an injunction to stay away from the boyfriend and a suspended sentence is more what I would lean too.