UK Politics #5

[monga]

trans rights literally have no impact on my life because i'm not trans. it's that simple. there's no redefining the terms of cis woman bc it literally has nothing to do with us. imo it's on the same level as the covid 5g conspiracy bc 'taking womens rights away' is *not real* they're literally just giving trans people more rights? terfs act like what's happening is robbing peter to pay paul when that's just not the case

Yet! If big Bert wants to pull on a skirt and ogle you in a changing room or shower you have no problem with it ?
There’s already 8yr olds being told to call their teacher they

 

[HelloStereo]

Yet! If big Bert wants to pull on a skirt and ogle you in a changing room or shower you have no problem with it ?

I don't think someone has to put on a skirt if they want to ogle you in a changing room.

 

[monga]

I don't think someone has to put on a skirt if they want to ogle you in a changing room.

How many men get to use women’s changing areas?

 

[HelloStereo]

How many men get to use women’s changing areas?

If someone wants to be a creep and perv on women do you think a sign on the door is going to stop them?

 

[monga]

If someone wants to be a creep and perv on women do you think a sign on the door is going to stop them?

Course not, especially now they won’t need to creep they’ll only need to dress as one and legally enter whatever female space of their choosing…It’ll be the women criminalised for objecting.

 

[HelloStereo]

Course not, especially now they won’t need to creep they’ll only need to dress as one and legally enter whatever female space of their choosing…It’ll be the women criminalised for objecting.

I'm sure if they really wanted to, they'd be able to find a way in anyway without going to the effort of dressing in women's clothing.

 

[Falkor]

If you can't define sex as male and female, you can't spot sex discrimination so easily. Especially in traditionally male-dominated high-paying roles (like finance and IT), it only takes one or maybe two male to female transitioners to close up the gender pay gap. Sport is simply a matter of fairness and safety.

Present however you want, by all means, but we really do need to distinguish between sex and gender for a few areas in life. I'm glad Starmer has rowed back a bit on self ID, I hope he learns from what happened in Scotland and puts some proper work into coming up with an alternative.

 

[monga]

I'm sure if they really wanted to, they'd be able to find a way in anyway without going to the effort of dressing in women's clothing.

The point is Labour will make it legal whether they go to the trouble or not.You can’t take your own child into a different sex changing area once they reach 8yr old why would people think it’s ok to let grown men in because they say they’re a women

 

[Chocolategoggler]

Free speech seems to be gradually turning into a myth

 

[Lilliepad]

The point is Labour will make it legal whether they go to the trouble or not.You can’t take your own child into a different sex changing area once they reach 8yr old why would people think it’s ok to let grown men in because they say they’re a women

My question, as always is when this conversation comes up, is what do people with genuine gender dysphoria do? I understand the concern for the wronguns, of whole I’m sure are a much smaller percentage than people who really feel like they are trapped in the wrong body. Do they go in and change with men? If we note that men are very often violent with women and this puts us at risk, are these individuals not also at risk in this situations?
It’s really such a tit time.

 

[monga]

My question, as always is when this conversation comes up, is what do people with genuine gender dysphoria do? I understand the concern for the wronguns, of whole I’m sure are a much smaller percentage than people who really feel like they are trapped in the wrong body. Do they go in and change with men? If we note that men are very often violent with women and this puts us at risk, are these individuals not also at risk in this situations?
It’s really such a tit time.

I definitely think there needs to be something in place to help these people , both in MH and wider society . I don’t think pushing them as female is doing them or women any favours, it’s a complex MH issue , do you think a woman is long hair and a dress? Or is it genetics and hormones ?

 

[knivesnflowers]

i've yet to come across a trans woman claiming to be female, in fact they're usually claiming to be trans women, which is what they are. female meaning sex and woman meaning gender. sometimes they correlate and sometimes they don't. i don't see a problem with that.

 

[da1sycha1n]

Thing is that those of us that aren't so young remember all too well that Labour are more than capable of big time bleeping it all up just the same, and there's a reason that apart from Blair, Labour have never had more than two consecutive terms in office. The conservatives tend to manage to go 3 to 5 terms before they fully fall apart like they are now.

There is a huge clamour from young people to vote Labour in, and things will all be magically better, just as there was when Blair got in; and no doubt when it happens there will be parties in the street again, I well remember Blair's victory walk to 10 Downing Street and the atmosphere that day. But those parties won't last long, the handouts come for a while but it doesn't take long for the realisation that the fun needs to be paid for and that's when it gets hard again.

I do think it is probably time now to switch to Labour for a bit, just to remind everyone that they are equally bad and wicked and inept as the Conservatives.

A reason for labour ( or for that matter any other Political party if they were able to gain power) not being able to serve two consecutive terms in office is more than likely due to the mess the Conservatives make, the Electorate can have short memories sadly and want over night success, any way Nowadays its a different breed and I don't have any confidence in any Political party at this time they all seem to be corrupt B's
---

Definitely time for a Labour govt, even a Lab/LibDem one would do me.
Another year to wait though
Hopefully the SNP will get their butts kicked here in Scotland too.

agree! can't come quick enough!

 

[Lucy Aeroplane]

Trans rights have the same impact on women's rights that feminism did on men's rights. Giving rights to one group does not inherently mean taking it away from others.

So far, I haven't identified any proposed policies which would have a tangible impact on my rights as a woman or my way of living.

Genuinely glad for you that you have a good enough life to not think about needing single-sex provision in prisons and refuges. Please do spare a moment to think about women with more precarious or unstable lives who aren’t as fortunate as you though. They’re vulnerable for so many reasons already. They don’t deserve to be trapped in places with trans-identifying male sex offenders whose targets are female, who then can and do assault them. And if you don’t know that’s already happening, you might want to broaden your knowledge base a bit.

And if you don’t have a ten year old daughter you might not happen to think about her right not to be violated in a women’s toilet by Katie Dolatowski either. But spare a moment to think about the little girl who had that right taken away from her and who now has to suffer a lifetime of trying to get over an horrific trauma.

It’s not all benign. I used to think like you.

 

[thegirlscout]

If someone wants to be a creep and perv on women do you think a sign on the door is going to stop them?

Single sex spaces provide a reduction in harm which is important since just under 90% of complaints regarding changing room sexual assaults, voyeurism or harassment reported at leisure centres and public swimming pools took place in unisex facilities. Of these, sexual attacks made up 67 per cent.
And it’s not just in public places - girls in school need privacy away from boys especially as puberty has a bigger impact on girls physically.

 

[HelloStereo]

Single sex spaces provide a reduction in harm which is important since just under 90% of complaints regarding changing room sexual assaults, voyeurism or harassment reported at leisure centres and public swimming pools took place in unisex facilities. Of these, sexual attacks made up 67 per cent.
And it’s not just in public places - girls in school need privacy away from boys especially as puberty has a bigger impact on girls physically.

And these attacks in unisex facilities were carried out by trans people or...?

 

[thegirlscout]

And these attacks in unisex facilities were carried out by trans people or...?

I didn’t say that, I was replying to the person who said ‘If someone wants to be a creep and perv on women do you think a sign on the door is going to stop them?’ and reiterating how important single sex spaces are.

 

[HelloStereo]

I didn’t say that, I was replying to the person who said ‘If someone wants to be a creep and perv on women do you think a sign on the door is going to stop them?’ and reiterating how important single sex spaces are.

It doesn't stop them, it still happens whether there is a sign on the door or not. Your own stats show there are still sexual assault complaints in single sex facilities.

 

[Blueblue123]

Genuinely glad for you that you have a good enough life to not think about needing single-sex provision in prisons and refuges. Please do spare a moment to think about women with more precarious or unstable lives who aren’t as fortunate as you though. They’re vulnerable for so many reasons already. They don’t deserve to be trapped in places with trans-identifying male sex offenders whose targets are female, who then can and do assault them. And if you don’t know that’s already happening, you might want to broaden your knowledge base a bit.

And if you don’t have a ten year old daughter you might not happen to think about her right not to be violated in a women’s toilet by Katie Dolatowski either. But spare a moment to think about the little girl who had that right taken away from her and who now has to suffer a lifetime of trying to get over an horrific trauma.

It’s not all benign. I used to think like you.

I was talking about Labour's proposed policies specifically because someone said they wanted to vote for a party that recognised women as women.

Seeing as the Tories are still in power, I'd imagine those incidents were able to occur because of the rules of the organisations that provide these services, not a potentially incoming Labour policy.

 

[monga]

i've yet to come across a trans woman claiming to be female, in fact they're usually claiming to be trans women, which is what they are. female meaning sex and woman meaning gender. sometimes they correlate and sometimes they don't. i don't see a problem with that.

They are not women in any shape or form..Look at what’s going on in the wider trans world ,from fake menstruation to having things inserted internally to mimic giving birth ( butt babies ) even womb transplants being looked at, just because you haven’t come across any doesn’t mean it’s not there.