The Royal Family #2

[vikka]

Their shtick absolutely is to sell themselves as "just like you!"
That was the whole song and dance about how the "middle class Middletons" would "help modernize the monarchy" and bring "middle class values".

Their shtick is to sell themselves as approachable, because if their are seen as up somewhere in the clouds, on another planet basically, then they will fall even faster. People won't support someone who is filthy rich and so far removed from their people that they can't see past the tip of their nose.

The effort to seem more modern has always been present and that's been very very evident in the "younger" (now middle aged) royals.
"We are just like you" has been an ever-present theme and especially crucial in the Cambs's PR.
"Newlywed couple living in a small cottage in Anglesey, Kate's a simple army wife!" (the cottage was very big actually and they had hired help, but shhhhh), "Kate goes to parents with newborn George for normalcy in Bucklebury" and the supermarket trips conveniently papped etc.

Again, Liz and Phil's failures as parents weren't because they worked or were gone from time to time.

Phil for instance went sailing with mates for funnsies for a whole year, blowing off his wife and kids. Now that's not normal.

 

[Theninth]

[Quote Vikka]

It's an insult (to working parents) to say the Cambs can't work (more) because of their children.
And it is an insult to every adult to say Will and Kate can coast because Will is "only the heir's heir".
Dude's almost 40 for cyring out loud, the teenage heirs in Europe out-do the Cambs!
It's embarrassing.
[/QUOTE]


I didn't say they can't work more I'm sure they certainly could if they wanted to. My original post was stating that I don't judge them for choosing to not work the same amount as other member of the family when at some point in the future William will be in the highest position with far more intense responsibility potentially until the day he dies. They are in position right now where they can take down time I, really can't blame them for choosing to do that. Again you are expecting them to act if they were middle class/working class people which they are not. If I was in their position I would be happily chilling in my country mansion I don't really believe anyone who says different sorry

 

[Vanillaco]

[Quote Vikka]

It's an insult (to working parents) to say the Cambs can't work (more) because of their children.
And it is an insult to every adult to say Will and Kate can coast because Will is "only the heir's heir".
Dude's almost 40 for cyring out loud, the teenage heirs in Europe out-do the Cambs!
It's embarrassing.

I didn't say they can't work more I'm sure they certainly could if they wanted to. My original post was stating that I don't judge them for choosing to not work the same amount as other member of the family when at some point in the future William will be in the highest position with far more intense responsibility potentially until the day he dies. They are in position right now where they can take down time I, really can't blame them for choosing to do that. Again you are expecting them to act if they were middle class/working class people which they are not. If I was in their position I would be happily chilling in my country mansion I don't really believe anyone who says different sorry
[/QUOTE]
I would love to chill in my country mansion, of course I would. But the point is that they will get criticism for it, and deserves to because there has to be a reason we tolerate their existence.They should have to justify their position, because they are basically utterly anachronistic. The Monarchy is a completely self serving and pointless institution. Their role in a constitutional monarchy is entirely ceremonial, as it should be if we want to call ourselves a democracy, but they do not work hard, they are there because they desperately want to be there and no one cares enough to overthrow them. But once The Queen goes, all we are left with is a string of old men. If William and Kate want their children to li e the priveleged life they have, basically sitting around doubt g nothing, then of course they need to prove they are worthy of the position. The Queen can work until she is 94 because the work is not difficult. She reads her red boxes, she could throw them on the fire. It would make absolutely no difference.

 

[Theninth]

I didn't say they can't work more I'm sure they certainly could if they wanted to. My original post was stating that I don't judge them for choosing to not work the same amount as other member of the family when at some point in the future William will be in the highest position with far more intense responsibility potentially until the day he dies. They are in position right now where they can take down time I, really can't blame them for choosing to do that. Again you are expecting them to act if they were middle class/working class people which they are not. If I was in their position I would be happily chilling in my country mansion I don't really believe anyone who says different sorry

I would love to chill in my country mansion, of course I would. But the point is that they will get criticism for it, and deserves to because there has to be a reason we tolerate their existence.They should have to justify their position, because they are basically utterly anachronistic. The Monarchy is a completely self serving and pointless institution. Their role in a constitutional monarchy is entirely ceremonial, as it should be if we want to call ourselves a democracy, but they do not work hard, they are there because they desperately want to be there and no one cares enough to overthrow them. But once The Queen goes, all we are left with is a string of old men. If William and Kate want their children to li e the priveleged life they have, basically sitting around doubt g nothing, then of course they need to prove they are worthy of the position. The Queen can work until she is 94 because the work is not difficult. She reads her red boxes, she could throw them on the fire. It would make absolutely no difference.
[/QUOTE]

Whether you like it or not, and you clearly don't so we will never agree here, they were born into those positions in my opinion they don't have to prove anything to you or i. A classless society will only bring about a more rapid decline in the degradation of the people. You are happy to pay for a T.V license to go towards shows like Love island and god knows what else be made but not towards the institution of the british monarchy. If you want your children growing up idolising people like Katie Price over Kate Middleton that's your prerogative. You realise that's how low it would be without the monarchy, without various degrees of class within society, we're on our way there already it's quiet scary and it all stems from the envy of those less privileged. People need to accept that whatever position we were born into in society we all have a role to play.
I'm sure you will find the Queen does more than open a few red boxes, the enormous amount of pressure that she has undertaken throughout her life and her work ethic is exemplary. I'm sure she is doing a great deal more than you or I will be doing at her age if we live that long and she could have bowed out by now. To fully commit to anything for any amount of time isn't always easy and to the degree in which she has managed that is exemplary, whether you like her or not you would surely have to give her credit in that respect.
You talk about a democratic society, I simply posted on here stating why I have no bitterness toward William and Kate and my words and opinions have been attacked by yourself and another poster. You want freedom of speech as long as it falls in line with your narrative, not very democratic of you.

 

[Vanillaco]

you want your children growing up idolising people like Katie Price over Kate Middleton that's your prerogative. You realise that's how low it would be without the monarchy, without various degrees of class within society, we're on our way there already it's quiet scary and it all stems from the envy of those less

I agree we will never agree, but you do realise we are in a minority in the world? The rest of the world has not degraded. I agree there will always be class and even in countries with elected heads of state there are huge inequalities but I am actually happy to pay my licence fee to pay for actors, tv presenters science presenters, historians, radio presenters, anyone who have worked to get where they are, yes. I am happy for my children to look up to people who have achieved something through their hard work and effort, who they can aspire to be if they worked hard enough. I would be ashamed if they idolised anyone in the Royal Family or Katie Price ( although she has taken her limited gifts and made a lot of money out of them)
I dont ' envy' the rich. I'm quite comfortable and have what I need. I dont have an issue with any rich person who has worked for their wealth and abides by the law and pays taxes. I don't even care about paying for the Royal Family. Outside this forum I couldn't care less about them. It should be their problem that hardly anyone under 40 could care less about them either. The institution of the Monarchy is wrong in my opinion and it distorts our country,from the institutions to their manipulation of the press.
No one has ' attacked you. We merely pointed out differences in opinion. If we didnt believe in ' free speech' we wouldnt respond to you or address your arguments, just refuse to engage. You are the only one who have used personal attacks brought my children into it and made presumptions about me.
You feel the Royals dont need to prove themselves, but others, including they, think they do. Otherwise they wouldnt spend so much time briefing the press trying to make themselves look good, against other members of their own family and trying to get a fictional tv show about themselves banned.

 

[Girlinabubble]

Well said Vanilla!

 

[Theninth]

I agree we will never agree, but you do realise we are in a minority in the world? The rest of the world has not degraded. I agree there will always be class and even in countries with elected heads of state there are huge inequalities but I am actually happy to pay my licence fee to pay for actors, tv presenters science presenters, historians, radio presenters, anyone who have worked to get where they are, yes. I am happy for my children to look up to people who have achieved something through their hard work and effort, who they can aspire to be if they worked hard enough. I would be ashamed if they idolised anyone in the Royal Family or Katie Price ( although she has taken her limited gifts and made a lot of money out of them)
I dont ' envy' the rich. I'm quite comfortable and have what I need. I dont have an issue with any rich person who has worked for their wealth and abides by the law and pays taxes. I don't even care about paying for the Royal Family. Outside this forum I couldn't care less about them. It should be their problem that hardly anyone under 40 could care less about them either. The institution of the Monarchy is wrong in my opinion and it distorts our country,from the institutions to their manipulation of the press.
No one has ' attacked you. We merely pointed out differences in opinion. If we didnt believe in ' free speech' we wouldnt respond to you or address your arguments, just refuse to engage. You are the only one who have used personal attacks brought my children into it and made presumptions about me.
You feel the Royals dont need to prove themselves, but others, including they, think they do. Otherwise they wouldnt spend so much time briefing the press trying to make themselves look good, against other members of their own family and trying to get a fictional tv show about themselves banned.

In every one of my posts since the first one I made I have stated that this is all my opinion. In every one of yours and Vikka's posts you have both tried to say everything that I am saying is wrong and what you are saying is fact. That isn't merely engaging in conversation that is trying to over power the narrative, that is not freedom of speech and it is from your response that this conversation has gone the way it has. I don't see what personal attacks I have made against you? Merely pointed out the fact, if there is no high society class then the only people with any fame for your children to look up to are low class with low morals. I personally would hate for my children to look up to someone like Katie Price who has used her gift (tits) to make money. But there you go let's just agree to disagree

 

[Superdude]

if there is no high society class then the only people with any fame for your children to look up to are low class with low morals.

I don't see any evidence a "high society class" has any better 'morals' than anyone else. Quite the opposite in fact. Nazism, affairs, intolerance, unkindness to family members, deceiving the public, treating staff badly, being above the law, hustling for money, misuse of public assets, the list goes on.
I look up to people who achieve something. Scientists. Academics. Sportspeople. Authors. Musicians. It's irrelevant what family they were born into, but important what they do with their lives, how they behave and how they have benefitted others. There's no reason for me to look up to William and Kate. Or Andrew. Or his daughters.

 

[vikka]

Goody goodness, can't even have a discussion, because it's "attacking" apparently.
Someone makes a statement and someone else writes why and how they agree or disagree, isn't that what such a forum is for?


Kate Middleton got where she is by the same means as Katie Price.
Why are these two the only role models and my choice for entertainment "Love Island"?

If the lack of a monarchy leads to the downfall of a society, then France, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Italy, Portugal and so many others are keeping one hell of a facade up.

What would we do without our social betters? One dares not imagine such a cruel and bleak world.

 

[Phoenix Lazarus]

Kate Middleton got where she is by the same means as Katie Price.

Hmm, really?

 

[Theninth]

I don't see any evidence a "high society class" has any better 'morals' than anyone else. Quite the opposite in fact. Nazism, affairs, intolerance, unkindness to family members, deceiving the public, treating staff badly, being above the law, hustling for money, misuse of public assets, the list goes on.
I look up to people who achieve something. Scientists. Academics. Sportspeople. Authors. Musicians. It's irrelevant what family they were born into, but important what they do with their lives, how they behave and how they have benefitted others. There's no reason for me to look up to William and Kate. Or Andrew. Or his daughters.

Apologies if it came across that way but I wasn't talking about the lower classes in general more the celebrities who are pushed into the limelight these days for young children to idolise.
I'm also not talking about political agendas but the way in which people carry themselves.
I personally don't need my children to look up to any of these people which is why I haven't owned a television for the last 10 years. I grew up in a working class family and understand the grit and determination of people of all classes. I specifically mean the way people are portrayed in the media. I wouldn't like my children to aspire to a position of fame in any sense but if they do strive for that then I would hope they would always maintain humility and self respect. Again apologies if my comment was came across in the wrong way.

 

[vikka]

Hmm, really?

Yes, really.
Being dubbed "the mattress" by Will's RPOs, partying all days of the week, being papped drunk and with her undies on show.

I also want to just quickly add that for one, forums are places of discussion. For another, I think most of us have posted opinions and had other posters written reply posts with their disagreements. I think this thread is one of the politer ones. Everyone is free to state their opinion and no one's "job" here is to change anyone else's. My intention is not to argue. A difference in opinion was stated with a few examples as to why.

No one wants their children to idolize utter morons. Part of it is taking action as parent during the kids' upbringing and once they're teens it's partly out of the parents' hands, as kids can do a 180. A royal family isn't going to keep a society's moral picture up, I mean hello? Charles&Cam back in the day, Diana and her affairs, Phil and his, Randy Andy (need I say more??), Margaret and literally everyone else. They are hardly the beacons of society or role models. I'd be disappointed if my kid looked up to any of these wastrels in the same manner as I were if they were to watch shyte "reality" programmes or look up to the Kardash/Prices (and worse, buy their shyte and financially support them that way).

 

[Theninth]

Goody goodness, can't even have a discussion, because it's "attacking" apparently.
Someone makes a statement and someone else writes why and how they agree or disagree, isn't that what such a forum is for?


Kate Middleton got where she is by the same means as Katie Price.
Why are these two the only role models and my choice for entertainment "Love Island"?

If the lack of a monarchy leads to the downfall of a society, then France, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Italy, Portugal and so many others are keeping one hell of a facade up.

What would we do without our social betters? One dares not imagine such a cruel and bleak world.

I said that you have attacked because there is a way in which you respond was quite belligerent.
I really don't want to have to engage with you anymore as we obviously have very different opinions and will go around in circles.

 

[Vanillaco]

I don't see any evidence a "high society class" has any better 'morals' than anyone else. Quite the opposite in fact. Nazism, affairs, intolerance, unkindness to family members, deceiving the public, treating staff badly, being above the law, hustling for money, misuse of public assets, the list goes on.
I look up to people who achieve something. Scientists. Academics. Sportspeople. Authors. Musicians. It's irrelevant what family they were born into, but important what they do with their lives, how they behave and how they have benefitted others. There's no reason for me to look up to William and Kate. Or Andrew. Or his daughters.

Absolutely agree with you. My children love learning about the Royal Family. They do not Idolise' them, and I dont encourage them to do so, because there is nothing there for them to look up to. Same as there is nothing there for them to look up to amongst all the reality tv nonentities. I even told my son about Prince Charles and his environmental campaigning before it became fashionable. But they look.up to people they admire and who they want to be like, whether that be scientists or artists or actor or tv presenters.

 

[50sGirl]

Kate Middleton like Katie Price? Yeah, you lost me right there!

Never seen Kate being paid to have her baps out and I must have missed her porno and endless Instagram publicity stunts...

 

[Phoenix Lazarus]

Being dubbed "the mattress" by Will's RPOs

Does RPO mean Royal Protection Officer?

 

[Vanillaco]

Does RPO mean Royal Protection Officer?

Yes it does

 

[Phoenix Lazarus]

Yes it does

Thought it might; just checking.

Kate Middleton like Katie Price? Yeah, you lost me right there!

Never seen Kate being paid to have her baps out and I must have missed her porno and endless Instagram publicity stunts...

Whatever you think of royalty and the royal system, I think Ms Middleton's elegance and class is far more attractive than Ms Price's attributes.

 

[50sGirl]

Thought it might; just checking.



Whatever you think of royalty and the royal system, I think Ms Middleton's elegance and class is far more attractive than Ms Price's attributes.

I agree!
It was a ludicrous comparison to make!

 

[Owlssayhoot]

What so you all think of the Wessexes? Sophie has totally upped he style stakes on the last decade (since her Gibraltar trip for the jubilee). Don't know much else about them though bar all the articles claiming she's the Queens favourite and Diana claiming Sophie wanted to copy her.