Nurses striking

[miss n thropy]

I was a frontline worker in a supermarket throughout the pandemic and I was bloody proud of that too. We had no ppe at all for the first few weeks and we worked bloody hard going above and beyond what we would normally, we were helping people yes in a different way but we were still helping people. As were many other people who worked through it.
Where would hospitals of been without the people who kept them fed or the lorry drivers who brought in the supplies for example.
There's no need look down on us because we don't work for the nhs.

I absolutely have respect for you and everyone who worked hard in the pandemic and were essential workers. I had to go to work and so did my daughter.

I also think nurses and other NHS workers deserve a decent pay rise and have the right to strike for it. The issue of “average” pay can cloud the needs of those who are at the bottom of the pay scales in any profession.


My biggest issue as can be seen from my previous comments is with this bloody awful corrupt, out of touch, government. They are the ones responsible for this mess and they, together with the gutter press, (yes, I’m talking about you Daily Mail), are the ones who profit from sowing discord amongst the working population.

Love to all who are struggling and fighting for a fairer and more equitable society.

PS. I am not advocating that everyone gets the same pay, nor do I have an issue with rich people. The nature of any society is that some have more than others. I do have an issue with rich people not paying their taxes, and tax avoiding subsidised MPs telling us what to do with our taxes. There is also a wealth of reputable data showing that the gap between the wealthiest and the poorest in the UK has grown exponentially.

I am also wearing a Che Guevara t-shirt, a beret and a “fuck the Tories” badge today. Xx

 

[OnlyHereForTheLolz]

People don’t support staff because they buy into tabloid bollocks and aren’t capable of critical thinking.

It’s terrifying how short sighted and ignorant people can be in the age of compulsory education and easily accessible knowledge via the internet. Terrifying.

Why aren’t we critical thinkers if we are not supportive of the strikes?
People can still form their own opinions and there are plenty of media outlets who support the strikes.
Just because we disagree doesn’t mean you are the only one using your brain

 

[gigilouxx]

Could I ask what it is you do?
---


What’s your occupation? Just out of interest.

Why is that relevant? Can no one comment on this if they aren’t nurses or blowing smoke up their backsides?

 

[Tui]

Like this GP…https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/28/gp-working-home-250-miles-away-surgery/

Right sorry but no. This is BS. She relocated to Cornwall and as a favour to her old practice agreed to carry on some telephone work to help them out with understaffing. And she got dragged over the coals for it in the press. I know this as she is in a Facebook group I am in. But yeah all doctors are twats.

 

[miss n thropy]

to add to that - migration into the U.K. will add more pressure onto existing infrastructure.

im not anti-immigration by any means but the government havent funded public services. Everything, from schools to homes to healthcare has been cut to the bone.

inviting more people into the U.K. when there isn’t existing infrastructure, is a short term solution to a long term problem, and might exacerbate the already tense public feeling towards migration.

by all means, invite in foreign workers but that isn’t enough. They can and should be investing in people in the U.K.

it was a political decision to remove funding though. It was a political decision to cut public spending so drastically, and it was a political decision based on ideaology NOT economics.

and where are the people who made those ideological deceisions? They are multi millionaires who have directly profited and benefitted from their decisions. Keep that in mind next time you read a tabloid coming to their defence and for the love of god, keep it in mind when you next have to vote.

I completely agree. How many in the current government and House of Lords have interests in private health care companies?
There are deliberate ploys to underfund the NHS and turn those who are outside the NHS against it so that more can be privatised. A large number of Tory MPs have interests in nursing agencies which charge huge amounts to the tax payer.

Christ I fucking hate this corrupt Tory government with all of my being. (Took Christmas Day off from my hatred but it’s after midnight now so back to hating them. Love tattlers though)

 

[Blond3g1rl]

Everyone gets a lump sum and a pathetic insult of a rise that still remains a pay cut. I know what I’ll be voting. Sorry, I want this over too but I’m standing my ground.

You aren’t getting a pay cut! Your pay is going up!

 

[OnlyHereForTheLolz]

HCAs do an amazing job. They really do. But it’s common in any organisation for more junior members of staff to be unaware of what their senior staff are doing, and because of that, very common to assume they’re not doing much. It doesn’t mean it’s the case.

I don’t care if nurses are “well paid” they should get more. I saw a tiktok the other day showing a nurse in the us can be on $100k after 5 years. Things have moved on, nurses pay hasn’t moved with it

The US is totally irrelevant in this situation. That is all private healthcare. Most people out there can’t even afford their medication

I support the right to strike but I don’t support any of the strikes that are on currently

 

[Merpedy]

It’s not about us being paid a bigger salary personally. It’s about there being an incentive for new health professionals to join and make the nhs a safe place to be cared for in.

This really should be what the unions/people come out with in interviews and when interacting with nurses

A lot of the current arguments seem to come down to "we are underpaid and have to work hard" - which yes, but who isn't at this point?

 

[shifttea]

I’m with you. I’m a support worker for people with very complex needs. If we didn’t do the job then NHS nurses would have to do it, taking them away from the wards. If my client goes in to hospital, we go with him as he’s a handful and we can communicate with him and know his little ways.
Sort out social care and there would be less people in hospital “bed-blocking” as they like to call it.

social care is a mess right now. the local councils have started block booking rooms and having hospital patients discharged straight into said rooms. my home has over 30 residents and we regularly only have 5 care staff on. Most of our residents need very involved care. around half are hoisted and unable to communicate. the residents that are coming in are completely unsuited for the type of home im in, they require much more advanced/specialist care, but the councils and government just don't care.

The staffing levels are completely unsafe, and we can't take the time to provide care to a satisfactory standard. I leave work every day feeling as though I could've done more.

Plus, the amount that social care (and the nhs) is spending on agency is just absurd. pay your core staff better, train them better, provide incentive for new starts, and you eliminate the need for agency. I am sick and tired of spending time having to show agency workers basic shit like how to use a slide sheet. I am sick of my residents being confused and upset because unfamiliar people are doing their personal care. I am sick of them being paid way more than they ever should be.

anyway, rant 2 over.

 

[Yel]

In fairness though why should she incur personal costs for work calls? I think they need some funding to fund the second London residence and work related expenses like travel but seeing how people have expenses private swimming lessons in Bolivia and the free bar etc is just a joke

Why doesn't Angela Rayner have a contract? Mines unlimited mins for £15 a month rather than doing things like expensing a single call for a tenner. She shouldn't pay for work calls but lots of their expenses don't seem a wise use of public money, it's small change but doesn't inspire confidence.

Angela had that whole airpods fiasco, didn't she buy two £250 pairs charged them to the tax payer and then ended up paying it back. She said she used them for work calls, then it turns out she hasn't been seen on zoom with them and that she could pick up free (non premium) headsets at work anyway.

Fact Check: Angela Rayner Does Not Use Her Expensed AirPod Pros on Zoom

This morning Angela Rayner defended her expense claims of £249 for AirPod Pros, saying she uses them for 4 hours-a-day on Zoom calls; an odd defence given

order-order.com

If they can't be sensible with expenses they know will be made public I can't see how the country would be run any better with them at the helm.

Labour are sat back doing nothing but waiting to get into power.

 

[Sunflower91]

Someone on a work call joked the other day about everyone just going on strike. And even though it was a joke it’s not completely ridiculous to think that things are heading to at least a mass protest of some kind. The reality is that there’s a lot of people not able to survive on their wages, it’ll hard for some to be sympathetic when they don’t have the option to strike because some industries aren’t unionised or because they are at a breaking point with their own situation.

As an example, my old company in London would pay graduates £22-£28k, we all know rent in London can be nuts (I lived in a small 2 bed flat with a friend and rent for me was £800pcm +£200 in bills, not including groceries or travel- and I was paying a lot less than most of my colleagues). I honestly don’t know how the graduates could afford it - especially now with bills increasing left right and centre.
I’ve since moved to the north and noticed the rental market there is either scarce or also getting expensive.

With the NHS, I don’t think it’s helped that it’s seen as a service you pay your taxes for. I think it’s been a storm brewing for years, you pay taxes and can’t get a drs appt, the wait lists are huge etc. you think you’re contributing to keeping things afloat and that access will be there when you need it and the reality is that it’s like the money disappears via the government and you have a battle to get something out of it. It’s easy to forget that human beings who have no say in where the money goes, and are in the same boat, are bearing some of the brunt and frustration of this. I don’t think the government care if nurses go to agency work and get paid more for it and that it accelerates the shift to privatisation.

 

[cee-bee]

Absolutely, i think a lot of the public dont care anyway though tbh. I think a lot want a functioning and accessible free at point of use health service, but don't want to support the people who make that happen. It's nothing without the staff. The government can buy the fanciest equipment and buildings but without the suitably qualified and experienced healthcare staff people are still not going to receive any/an acceptable level of care. I suspect a lot of the public aren't arsed until they need healthcare and then complain about the long waits and level of care.

Also agree about sometimes prolonging life to no one's benefit but just because we can. Doesn't always mean we should.

People don’t support staff because they buy into tabloid bollocks and aren’t capable of critical thinking.

It’s terrifying how short sighted and ignorant people can be in the age of compulsory education and easily accessible knowledge via the internet. Terrifying.

 

[popb1tch]

exactly, and people read the tabloid press about how the NHS is in a mess and take it at face value instead of critically thinking, who is benefitting from peddling this?

the NHS is a huge beast, huge. And inevitably some aspects will be poor or not fit for purpose or mismanaged. But this will be exacerbated by indirect attacks on it - cuts to peripheral services for example, means the NHS picks up the bill, it has a domino effect and it becomes poor value for money.

Example? paying nurses/doctors badly will give them incentives to go locum, which means the NHS ends up paying more for their staff, when a decent contract in the first please would avoid this.

properly funded social care, means that people won’t have to wait forever for a home assessment which means they don’t clog up the expensive hospital beds etc etc.

so the NHS is set up to fail and then demonised in the tabloids all while some unscrupulous characters get ready to exploit the situation through their own agencies and investments.

the tabloid press has a LOT to answer for in how it misleads the masses and there’s an element of personal responsibility to question what you read, and read from a variety of sources.

…and most insulting of all is that they think we are stupid and don’t realise all of this…

Just found this thread and have to say that I have never earned anywhere near take home pay of £2,200 nor needed to pay £1,600 a month rent/mortgage. I live within my means, have never (luckily) gone without or been in debt. This nurse needs to consider her finances.

There have been some very good points made in this thread that I'm still reading through. Having spent 11 years working in the NHS I think the problems need resolving with management. There are far too many Chiefs earning fat cat salaries, who can't sort out issues.

Nurses chose their profession as they are caring people who want to help others. But there are far too many "occasional" days taken training, thereby reducing staff on wards. Whilst I agree with keeping up with procedures, etc, whenever I spoke to the nurses they felt there were some who were almost bullied into undertaking more training, yet others had their training cancelled at the last minute due to staff shortages.

Overtime is crazy and contradictory. Perhaps a nurse can clarify if this still happens. Contracted work is one thing, then extra hours are worked when short staffed, up to a maximum of ?? Hours a week. However, many nurses also belong to agencies (called Bank Nurses) and also work additional hours through bank nursing - which costs the NHS even more money.

If the simple fundamentals were dealt with correctly then it would encourage more people to join the profession, retain staffing levels, keep staff happy, not overworked, whilst saving money and using it to pay nurses more.

I think 1600 a month rent could easily be reached if you worked for a London or South East hospital and maybe had 2 children and not unreasonably wanted them to have a bedroom each

Bank and Agency are different
AfC contract is 37.5 hours a week…some might want to work more for their own hospital…this would be through the Bank (a kind of internal agency)…some might want to work elsewhere for more money..this would be an Agency usually, unless they were in other Trust banks but honestly why would they when Agency pays so much better

 

[Snowjoke]

Tbh if that’s considered a pay cut a lot of the UK are getting a pay cut too

 

[anotheronebitesthedust.1]

It’s still more than the Aldi average wage of 25K.
There was a student nurse on TV the other day saying she didn’t go in to it for the money, she knew it was going to be hard, but she just wants to care for people.
Every new recruit should be like that.

Student nurses are often protected from all the shit that goes on behind the scenes , they are contracted to certain hours for insurance purposes , they don’t stay behind for hours to catch up on paperwork , go withoit breaks because there isn’t anybody to relieve them , ask for extra help on the nhsp rota hoping someone picks up shifts to help out the ward , give up days off to cover shifts

give them a few months of being qualified and struggling to get through their preceptorship period because there’s a lack of support and are just seen as part of the numbers once they Have their blues and they will see the real struggles

 

[Tui]

the sheer amount of wilful misinterpretation on this thread is staggering. Nobody said only nurses deserve better pay or that others are thick as pig shit for gods sake. Get a fucking grip and unionise if you want to be able to strike. It’s not NHS workers problem that other groups are not unionised. It literally is not their fucking problem.

 

[gigilouxx]

Having to have a degree to be a nurse and there not being financial help is a major reason for lack of nurses. I wanted to train but can’t afford it. HCAs are doing what traditionally nurses did. Lots more paperwork for nurses now. I’ve worked for the nhs for nearly 20 years and hope that the love of looking after patients is put back as priority by our government.

I read an interesting comment about the NHS using HCA’s as abit of cheap labour as their pay is absolutely shite. It’s a shame they don’t bring back more on the job training as I’m sure it would appeal to more people

 

[Polythene Pam]

Probably. That being said I know someone who works in resourcing at a big London FT and she says they used to get a lot of nurses from the Philippines but these days they struggle getting many to come over here.


I personally do agree it isn't a lot. I just meant that I understand a lot of people will earn less, and that this is also unlike other recent strikes where workers striking have only been paid minimum wage for example.
There are also a lot of admin jobs in the NHS that are paid far more than they should be (on the face of it at least) Equality, Diversity and Inclusion Managers on bands 8a/8b and 'Directors of Lived Experience' on close to 100k. It's nothing short of crazy to me that there's band 5 nurses doing 12 hour shifts then unpaid overtime without eating, drinking, going to the toilet, having too many patients to manage safely, then band 5 administrative staff on the same pay, with no degree, putting their coats on at ten to five.

Yes I agree. I had a baby last year and my midwife was so apologetic about taking her HALF HOUR lunch break. She'd been with me for about 7 hours at that point. It hadn't even occurred to me that she hadn't had a break until that point. They all deserve way more money. I know it's a tough sell at the moment but the issues are historic. Maybe MPs could all take a little pay cut to fund it.

 

[OnlyHereForTheLolz]

Spend a couple of days working alongside any nurse and then write this comment. You’re clueless

Nah, mate. I’f probably end up lumping you. Again thinking you are the only people doing difficult jobs under pressure.

 

[instasham13]

I agree with the above. While I agree that people working in supermarkets during the pandemic played a vital role, the consensus/guidance during covid was that those with symptoms or were positive didn't go to the supermarket. That's very different to front line workers who were working with actual covid positive patients providing personal care etc.

I'm in no way undermining other people's role during covid but hospital staff were up close and personal with covid positive patients with no more PPE than supermarket workers for a big part of the start of the pandemic.