Nurses striking

[whoareyouu]

I missed the bit where they didn't even work through the pandemic, oh well least they were safe up in their ivory tower while us non medically trained plebs kept the country going in our own ways. Hope they didn't have home delivery from tesco how hypocritical would that be

Thats one thing I hate, people looking down on others!

 

[Poppysmimi]

100% this. I am a nurse-20 years in nhs. Did not support the strikes but felt too intimidated to say. Instead told colleagues I was unison but promptly left RCN due to being disgusted when the 48hr strike was revealed. Imo striking is counter productive and I’m embarrassed at my colleagues and friends who jumped on the bandwagon.
Edit sorry if not making sense-v tired

Fellow nurse here and agree wholeheartedly with you x

 

[Polythene Pam]

I agree they deserve better conditions but striking is NOT the answer as far as I am concerned.

What would you suggest as an alternative?

Just found this thread and have to say that I have never earned anywhere near take home pay of £2,200 nor needed to pay £1,600 a month rent/mortgage. I live within my means, have never (luckily) gone without or been in debt. This nurse needs to consider her finances.

There have been some very good points made in this thread that I'm still reading through. Having spent 11 years working in the NHS I think the problems need resolving with management. There are far too many Chiefs earning fat cat salaries, who can't sort out issues.

Nurses chose their profession as they are caring people who want to help others. But there are far too many "occasional" days taken training, thereby reducing staff on wards. Whilst I agree with keeping up with procedures, etc, whenever I spoke to the nurses they felt there were some who were almost bullied into undertaking more training, yet others had their training cancelled at the last minute due to staff shortages.

Overtime is crazy and contradictory. Perhaps a nurse can clarify if this still happens. Contracted work is one thing, then extra hours are worked when short staffed, up to a maximum of ?? Hours a week. However, many nurses also belong to agencies (called Bank Nurses) and also work additional hours through bank nursing - which costs the NHS even more money.

If the simple fundamentals were dealt with correctly then it would encourage more people to join the profession, retain staffing levels, keep staff happy, not overworked, whilst saving money and using it to pay nurses more.

My mortgage is £950 but houses on my street rent for £1,600. It's a 3 bed house in Norfolk, so not London or SE. Market rents are insane, there are a lot of people paying crazy rents and nurses obviously need to live near to their hospitals.

 

[gigilouxx]

A similar issue (I teach English as a foreign language) is the langauge exam they need to pass, is involves thigns that are totally irrevent for practical work, a lot of the people I teach from overseas wanting to go into nursing fall at this (totally unfair) hurdle

I agree 100% I think the fact that the only way of getting into nursing is going to uni makes it harder for people
Not everyone can go uni, not everyone is great at academics but can learn quick and efficiently on the job
I can’t believe that with the shortages the most cost effective and quick recruitment method, apprenticeships, hasn’t been pushed through

 

[Piff paff puff]

How on earth are we in the grip of socialists?! The country is in the state its in right now because of 12 years of Tory rule. It's getting really hard to convincingly blame anything else at this point.

Socialists in disguise. No one would ever vote socialists, that's why they pretend to be Conservatives.

 

[Avenged7Fold]

General medical wards are the kiss of death for anyones sanity or wellbeing
The whole model of care never used to be like this…older general medical patients died at the end of their natural lifespan with little intervention and nursing expertise was focused on specialised medical patients and elective surgical patients

The older medical cohort remained in community based care and nobody would have thought of ringing 999 for an 80 year old with a breathing problem

The problem is the unwillingness of folks to face up to mortality, a modicum of patient behaviour and a whole heap of entitlement etc

This just about sums it up for me. I used to work on a kidney dialysis unit. We were treating people in their 70s three times a week. They had no quality of life. One of them said to me “Why don’t you just let me die” heartbreaking

 

[Polythene Pam]

****It’s MR actually.

Of course it is

Maybe not. But nurses still aren’t getting their 19%.

Have you ever negotiated for anything in your life. Certainly sounds as if you haven't.

 

[OnlyHereForTheLolz]

Lol you have to do a lot more to get struck off than be bit snarky online. I'm actually very nice but tired of reading 26 pages of the same tropes about 'if you don't like it leave' 'whats wrong with working in Aldi' (nothing) and 'lots of people are low paid so why are they a special case'

I never said leave and do retail work, not once. Ihave called you out on looking down and making unsavoury remarks about low skilled jobs. Also in general you have shown that you think you are better than others.

I’ve said from the start why I’m not pro strikes in this economic climate. I have also said I’d be supportive if it was a year or two down the line when the economy have recovered. But still you are continually making remarks about people and how idiotic they are for not being supportive.

Initially the thread was called OPINIONS and we shared them.
And if you are tired of the thread why keep returning trolling those you consider “below” you.

Let’s be honest not a single person have been able to show where in the public media it’s not been about pay. You can’t quote the RCN and some nursing magazine/website. Who outside of the medical field reads those?
But the biggest issue is the union reps who go on tv, smirking and just talk about pay

 

[Avenged7Fold]

Not every staff member who works for the NHS is in the pension, simply because they can’t afford to be in it.

I entered my profession to care for people but also because I need to earn money to live. Nobody I know goes to work for the fun of it.

There are a lot of jobs that don’t earn as much as nurses and they want to live too.

 

[Former_Antelopee]

Touching on the paid training and that
They should bring it back to what it was 15 years ago when I was a student nurse
NHS paid for all the university fees , you could enter on advanced diploma and qualify with that and then do a degree in house when qualified and also bring back the busary too
It is hard for students to find jobs while on training because which employers are gonna let staff take 8-12 weeks break at a time while they go out into placements

Did they do the same for doctors, radiographers, physios or whoever else works in a hospital? As imo the government paying for degrees shouldn’t be a thing. They still at the end of the day chose to do it. Why should nurses get them paid and not the others who work in a hospital? Also did you have to agree to work for the NHS for so long for them to pay? Or could you leave and work private as soon as you qualified?

 

[Eltonjohnsflorist]

Why is this problem more prevalent in the UK than other places though? The problem is we want to have a European style welfare state paid for by US style taxes.
The rich definitely need to pay more tax. Are we not being held to ransom by threats they'll leave?

Why do you think it’s more of a problem in the U.K.? Isn’t it just that you wouldn’t know about the tax affairs of countries you don’t live in so you’re assuming it’s different?

Nursing, like any other line of work, is a choice. You surely don’t go into the profession for the money. You go into the profession to make a difference and save lives of the vulnerable. Striking goes against that very ethos in my opinion. You don’t like the pay, the conditions, or the fees you have to pay for your pin or for parking, then leave. As for saying everyone feels the same and everyone will leave and the NHS will collapse etc, surely that’s not the concern of those who chose to jump ship. You don’t want to be a nurse because you don’t like the way the profession is, then don’t be. Why should anyone be held to ransom with the threat of pay us more or we’ll strike and withdraw labour. Pay us more or we’ll leave. There are always people wanting to do the job you’re complaining about. Nobody, apart from the elite, have had fair pay rises and nobody is managing very well with the rising costs of everything. It’s not just nurses!

What kind of shit way is this to view the world? You aren’t concerned one day when your parents get admitted to ICU and there are no nurses to look after them? That’s just tough luck hey? Zero medics? What kind of person thinks that’s in any way a realistic outcome? You sound bonkers

working in retail will keep you humble for the rest of your life!

I worked in law enforcement for a while and even then didn’t receive as much abuse as I did when working retail



Youve totally misread my point. I meant it as a criticism. A criticism to the double standard in that corporate/head office are treated totally different, in that they aren’t constantly being told the lie they are lucky to have a job and aren’t constantly being threatened with redundancy, within the same organisation.

I wasn’t saying anyone should just move to corporate, I was saying that the attitude and treatment of workers there is usually different and it’s an conscious secession made by those in corporate roles to keep the lower ranks subdued.

@JoeBloggs as an independent observer I feel
Obliged to point out you have indeed misread cee bees post.

 

[Polythene Pam]

I don't understand this constant comparing of retail work with nursing. They literally couldn't be more different.
Clearly retail is more appealing if nurses are leaving their profession to work in supermarkets. How many people are critically ill in Tescos? Many sick and dying in Sainsburys? Premature babies in Morrisons? Nah, didn't think so.

Before anyone says it I'm not a nurse and I don't work in the NHS. I did have a baby and attend A&E during the pandemic. I also went to lots of supermarkets.

 

[Emsie]

Loool I love you

Honestly! I can't cope with the superiority! Especially when I went on to read they didn't even work themselves during the pandemic. Sit the fuck down then

 

[mcfeez]

Would there be an influx of nurses though? I understand the importance for the current staff and honestly they can all strike away to their hearts content and I hope something is achieved, but at the same time I don't see this fixing the staff shortages in the long term if people don't see nursing as an attractive option because the profession overall is demanding and will likely remain underpaid based on that

But nursing has always been demanding, like many jobs, and there have always been people who are nurses.

Conditions worsening over time is what is discouraging people from entering the profession.

 

[Yel]

You hear talk a lot about people need to be "paid fairly" which of course everyone does.

But it's so hard to actually quantify what is fair pay as the amount each individual needs for a good standard of living can vary so much.

A nurse that bought a house a while ago so has a mortgage of £200 a month (with much of the house already paid for) and who had funding for training could have a very good lifestyle with a take home pay of £2200 a month.

Someone paying £1600 rent a month, 90k debt to pay off and taking home £2200 is in a very different situation. Council tax £150, energy £200, water £50 and that's just £200 for everything else. It's not hard to imagine with so little buffer that some face hardship.

Where I am £1600 gets an ex council semi, that should have been paid off decades ago and should be let to someone for a reasonable rent, not going lining the pockets of a speculator.

My Swedish friend was saying the other day they have a huge problem near the border as nurses can commute over to Norway to earn way more.

 

[gigilouxx]

Okay so will this payrise reduce bed blocking issues caused by cuts to social care?
Will it stop people using A&E for minor issues cos getting a GP appointment is like pissing in the wind?
Will it reduce the effects of the ageing population where hospitals are full to the brim of elderly people in winter with flus and colds?
No one has came on this thread and said nurses are overpaid and don’t deserve a fair salary, my main issue is the comments regarding food banks, everyone’s skint they aren’t the worst off. But this “we’re doing it for you!” rhetoric might not sit so well with people who have had chemo appointments cancelled or have an elderly relative lay on the floor for 48 hours because £33k a year isn’t enough.

 

[Yel]

I would say the next election can't come soon enough. Wes Streeting is not the man for the job,but anything is better than the current lot.

Agree the election can't come soon enough but we've heard so much "anything is better" and it just gets worse. Despite the current mess there's still lots of room for stuff to get worse.

Countries like Venezuela and Sri Lanka totally collapsed in recent years thanks to mismanagement.

 

[Polythene Pam]

In fairness people paying for cancer treatments are sometimes paying for extraordinarily expensive drugs which might add a few weeks lifespan if anything and it’s judged not cost effective to use public funds for drugs like that. It’s harsh but the pot has to get divided up somehow and unless the evidence supports it then the drugs don’t get funded.

That's not always the case. My friend has pretty much gotten rid of the cancer she was riddled with. She shouldn't be paying for her treatment. It's insane.

Well for a start my FIL had a shoulder replacement late in his 70’s and he is doing great. He’s healthy and active. So why shouldn’t older people be entitled to have these operations?
Not all the elderly are “old” and dying or decrepit.
I find this sort of idle opinion incredibly insulting

I actually think we should have a properly funded health service so that everyone can get the treatment they require, but if things are being prioritised it should be cancer treatment (or treatment of any terminal illess) over hip or shoulder replacements.

 

[Merpedy]

no one thinks the NHS staff are the worst off, but we can recognise they have it bad.
Not a single person on this thread had suggest only nurses are deserving of a pay rise.

I think there have definitely been a few posts which make nurses sound like they are the worst off and deserve the most though and that sort of attitude understandably doesn't receive good reactions. We've also really have been hearing about how nurses have it bad and deserve more frequently since COVID, and even before then NHS staff would be praised highly, so it's easy to see how everything is getting a bit messed up when everyone is facing difficulty

 

[Tui]

Would love to know exactly what job you supposedly do for the NHS?

I’m a hospital doctor as I’ve said several times.
---

I can see both sides of the coin. I’m very much pro-strikes, not just with nurses but I can’t see how this will do anything for pay or conditions. We’ve had a Tory government for 13 years - if they would’ve given a pay increase, they would’ve done it now.

I think most of us are struggling money wise as well and finding it hard to make ends meet. Not a lot of people agree with me on this but I do think some nurses have a chip on their shoulder since Covid - my Nana has weekly district nurses and the amount of times I’ve been there when they visit and heard them say they don’t have time to do that (one example being they couldn’t change a leg ulcer dressing that had been on a week as the nurse ‘didn’t have time’ yet was the reason for her visit!). My boyfriends had a heart valve operation cancelled twice due to nurses strikes as well.

Basically our entire healthcare system needs overhauling starting from the bottom up; bringing back nursing bursaries, re-structuring NHS management etc.

I think the system as we have it needs properly funding to know if it works or not before more restructuring. We have had constant restructuring in the hope of politicians looking like they’re doing something. We need to disassociate the NHS from politics and set 10-15 year plans not just short term plans to get us to the next election. Tories going to continue running us into the ground until the next GE as they don’t give a fuck