Michael Jackson

[Upintheair83]

Could anyone recommend a good documentary about his life? I feel like I actually know very little and would like to before I see the movie (not all that keen on seeing it but promised a friend I’d tag along)

I find the new BBC one a very fairly balanced one. Not too much in favour of him, but doesn't bash him totally either.
I feel its honest and unbiased. Definitely one of the better ones and iv seen and read almost everything on him that's out there. It doesn't shy away from the uncomfortable truths but also remains balanced.

 

[Tuesdaysdoll14]

I think it would be hard not to move a little bit, I'm not saying it was right or that any one would be up partying.

I genuinely can’t believe you. I just have no words at all.

 

[Dexy]

People are starting to notice every time there is something MJ lucrative there’s media slander and some sort of law suit/grifter asking for money. There is a definite pattern.

1993 – Chandler allegations: Emerged during the Dangerous Tour, at a time when the tour was generating massive revenue and Michael Jackson was consolidating control over his catalog assets.

2003 – Arvizo allegations: Surfaced as Jackson was preparing the Number Ones compilation and negotiating his exit from Sony, positioning himself for independent monetization of his catalog as a free agent.

2013–2014 – Robson and Safechuck civil filings: Filed amid a surge in posthumous estate revenue, with Cirque du Soleil shows running and catalog valuation rising toward the eventual $750 million Sony buyout.

2019 – Leaving Neverland: Released as the estate was preparing a Broadway musical and finalizing the latter phase of the Sony/ATV transaction.

2026 – Cascio lawsuit: Surfaced the same weekend Lionsgate released the estate-partnered biopic, which was projected to significantly boost catalog interest and merchandising.

Also Leaving Neverland rushed into Toronto film festival the day Harvey Weinsteins trial started.

 

[GingerSquid]

Naked child videos??!! Where have you seen this evidence? Iv never heard or read that he was found with naked child videos.

Latest doc on Netflix. They show things that were found in the investigation and testimonials etc .. unless you think there is a conspiracy and it’s all been planted etc it’s pretty damming. I was a huge MJ fan and desperately wanted it all to not be true; but now I think he suffered SA as a child and went on to be an abuser himself.

 

[Upintheair83]

I am. He wasn’t a paedophile. A bit odd yes, but not a sexual abuser.

So what would you call having boys as young as 8 sleep in a bed with you? Put aside any of the sexual abuse allegations and I’m sure anybody on this site will agree having a boy of that age in your bed is disgusting. And that is PROVEN. That isn’t “odd”..it’s abuse, abuse of his status and power..and fucking disgusting. I don’t get how so many people believe every other allegation, but when it comes to MJ people continue to support him. Whilst the stories of some of the accusers may not be “perfect”, these are people discussing highly traumatic experiences. And the two people discussed in this thread and in the documentary were not the only two, do your research.

Iv done my research over years....Well the first accusation, Jordan Chandler - if you do your research with that one, his dad, Evan, wanted to ‘get as much money out of Michael Jackson’ (his own words) the markings that Jordan described on his penis did not match up. MJ wanted it to go to court but in the end the estate told him to pay the money that Evan chandler was demanding. And as for the Arvisos....well did you follow the trial?! It was almost laughable. Trying to kidnap them in a hot air balloon?! Ever likely he was acquitted.
It’s a shame that Mj fans make out like he was an angel and there’s no way he could be an abuser- anyone can be. He was deeply flawed, I don’t agree with children being in his bed or room,no matter what the reason or how big the room was, or how childlike he was .You say it was abuse- but the parents were always there so in my mind they are guilty of the abuse too, abuse of their role as a parent. He made the most ridiculous of decisions and by admitting he shared a bed with kids was bizzare and disgusting to say the least. But in my opinion, and I know not many will agree- the ones that have gone public with their accusations I just have never seen any solid evidence at all. Even the FBI files don’t show anything and they can all be viewed online.
I’m not saying he wasn’t an abuser, and I’m not saying I agree with things he did. I also think there’s a big chance he himself was abused as a child. But now because he’s dead, people can say what they want, and he’s worth so much more now he’s dead.
And yes the testimony was horrific, but it was filmed over 17 months and the accused didn’t get their chance to have their say. I just don’t find it fair and I found it to be totally one sided. Maybe if they didn’t want to gain financially from it, it would have held more sway

 

[shellie]

I think the same as I always have. He abused those boys because they knew about the vitiligo marks on his penis. There’s no excuse for that.

I still think he’s the reason Macauley Culkin went off the rails but he’s not going to come out and say anything because MJ’s weird fans would hound him and nobody would be interested in giving him a job anymore because admitting abuse hasn’t helped anyone’s career has it?

He groomed the world talking about his abusive childhood though. I don’t buy that he wanted to play with children because he didn’t have a childhood himself, he still had choices like we all have and most of us choose not to repeat the mistakes. We still grow up and want to have adult experiences rather than childhood ones. Having said that I do recognise all of his family seem to be very strange.

Michael was a hard nosed businessman when he wanted to be, the only thing I‘m not surprised about is that he ended up on drugs and dead much earlier than he should have.

He’s a mercurial character though, I can still appreciate his music - well everything before Bad was incredible, after that it all went a bit meh.

Whether anything happened I have no idea but Macauley did admit to sleeping in the bed with him which is weird on it's own as well as claiming an adult having such a close friendship with a child was no issue. He tried to defend him once in a Larry King interview but the problem was Michael himself admitted he always slept in the same bed as the kids, not another one or another room and it wasn't just at Neverland it happened either.

 

[Abominatrix]

What does the fact the the film was successful prove? That the Jackson estate have very good PR and lawyers, and have been able to bury the bad publicity?

Yeah, I don't get that part either. I do want to see the film myself, and I fully believe Jackson was a very powerful pedophile with a fondness for boys.

It's not like he's gonna be getting a cut, and his estate can continue to pay damages for the evils he perpetrated.

 

[shellie]

No videos it seems, just lots of pictures.

There were videos..naturist videos which were often used to get around things back in the day. Someone who worked with him said he was asked to remove stuff including catalogues of videos he requested and it was always ones with naked children in them.

As for the pictures, during the trial, quite a few news stations reporting about it, got hold of the some of the books taken from his house including the one they claim is 'art'. I watched a few clips back then and they are still online now if you look around. If anyone else had books of pictures with young lads naked and their legs spread....

 

[Mayday]

I've only watched part 1 of the documentary so far...but now that I've actually watched it, I believe them. I still believe that Corey Feldman & Macaulay Culkin were never abused (I know that Corey is supporting the two men in the documentary now though).

What I don't get is why the hell the parents didn't question him? The fact that he would always refer to them like 'I'm so glad I have a friend in your son' not even I'm glad I'm friends with your family...always the child. James's mum went from 'you can't sleep in his room' to not even being placed on the same floor as him and making sure he stayed with her...and barely knowing which room they were in at what time in Neverland?? Then Wade's entire family went back to Australia without him and left him in Neverland with Michael for 5 days!! Wtf?!

 

[Upintheair83]

He definitely displayed red flags and id never have allowed him near my child...... but all of his accusers were weak grifters in my opinion.

 

[White rose]

A lot of interesting reading with many pictures

Michael Jackson and Jonathan Spence (1983-1989)

What is the story with Jonathan Spence and Michael Jackson? Jonathan Spence was one of the first boys who had an intense friendship with Jackson. He never gives interviews, or talks about Jackson, …

mjandboys.wordpress.com

.. and all the others are there on this site.
As a mother of three boys, I would never let this man near them after only seeing these pictures.

Where in this article did Johnathan say Michael molested him? No where.. yet its repeated plenty times that people think Michael molested him, the boy is saying it didn’t happen and others are telling him it did happen. These people are not happy unless you agree to their thoughts. It’s the same with Macauley he has said numerous times nothing happened but hes also a liar because he won’t bow down and say “ ok he abused me “

Michael was found innocent on 10 charges. What more do people want?.

 

[Harlot O'Scara]

He also favoured celebrity kids who wouldn't want to go public ala Culkin. He paraded him around like a boyfriend.

I actually don't think he did abuse the celebrity kids, or at least not all of them, because then he had credible people to defend him.

A lot of his supporters use Culkin's defence of him as "proof" he never did anything.

 

[Upintheair83]

Yes I have heard the same, they stayed close friends. Her daughters said in interviews she remembers it as a real relationship

Her interview with Oprah after MJs passing gets buried abit under other quotes of LMP. But she clearly adored him, and was so upset she couldn't save him in the end. She said any anger she had towards him had subsided.
Abit off topic but ..
I always thought it fascinating that she once told the story about when she was little. her and her father were at the breakfast table and Elvis saw someone on the TV he didnt like. He got his shotgun out and fired straight at the telly!
She always said that whe was the only one who truly could understand the level of fame that MJ and her dad had and just now bizzare and unconventional their lives were as a result.

 

[Soncna]

A lot of interesting reading with many pictures

Michael Jackson and Jonathan Spence (1983-1989)

What is the story with Jonathan Spence and Michael Jackson? Jonathan Spence was one of the first boys who had an intense friendship with Jackson. He never gives interviews, or talks about Jackson, …

mjandboys.wordpress.com

.. and all the others are there on this site.
As a mother of three boys, I would never let this man near them after only seeing these pictures.

 

[Miss Havisham]

He also wasnt alone with them, from other interviews the siblings or other kids that were round would stay in his room at the same time. Again something the media ignore.

With no other adults in his very large room / rooms.

 

[Web30]

I'm not really sure what to believe. Apparently Macaulay Culkin & Corey Feldman have both defended Michael Jackson again. I think they've always said their relationship with him was innocent. I feel like if it was otherwise they would've said - especially once he died. Corey has been going on about making his own documentary on paedos in Hollywood for years (he even set up a fundraiser at some point) but nothing has come of it.

I read Corys tweets. Apparently he has a phone convo of him at 13 and michael at 30 thats shows how innocent their friendship was. Also Bret barnes has always said nothing happend.

I find it hard to belive only 5 people have ever come foward with claims when thier were hundreds of kids he was friends with.

 

[Youtubegossip]

Im sure it was all his step dads doing. Didnt he come out and say his dad made him lie about it all

How can you lie about the underside of a mans penis - who when checked matched the description - apparently there were marks where it had been bleached etc that you wouldn't know unless you saw it?

 

[shellie]

I suppose people will look at further information, that comes to light as the years pass. I didn’t pay much attention to the MJ accusations back in the day - thought it likely that he was an oddball, but probably harmless. I felt it likely that he could have had false accusations made against him.
On gathering more information recently (including the recent BBC documentary), I feel that it is very likely that he was guilty.
Still an oddball, and likely that some of the accusations against may have been false - but I do now believe some of the accusations and feel that he did abuse children.
Some of the children (who are now adults) will defend him, as I feel that MJ was manipulative and clever enough, not to abuse all of the children that he “slept with”.

We know that guilty people leave courtrooms every day, with a “not guilty” verdict. There is also the possibility that he may well have been both guilty and innocent of the various accusations made against him.

There are plenty of abusers who got away with it plain sight - Saville being the obvious example.

I've said it earlier in the thread but a few of the jurors were asked and they said the same thing...there wasn't enough to prove to them he was 100% guilty but they didn't think he was innocent either. Then there was also the fact that at least one juror should never have been there to begin with as she lied and claimed not to be a fan/could be partial, then years later in a show about celeb cases and jurors being asked with what they now know, would they still say the same thing, admitted she was always gonna find him not guilty.

 

[PartOfMe]

Anyone seen the new documentary leaving Neverland?

Radio 2 has dropped all of his music since it came out so must be serious. 4 hours long tho.

Vanity fair has 10 undeniable facts that are enough for me (warning it's very grim) https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywoo...-the-michael-jackson-sexual-abuse-allegations

 

[Abominatrix]

I’ve always hated the “he didn’t have a childhood” excuse. Two things can be true, he had a shit childhood but still ended up a päedo. The childhood abuse can explain his adult behaviour but it doesn’t excuse it. Adult MJ had an adult mind, he wasn’t trapped as a psychological child. He knew how to manipulate, lie and take advantage of his fame to get parents to part with their children. Didn’t he even have alarms that would let him know if people were approaching his room? Yes, he was damaged and it’s known that abused people often end up as abusers themselves, but that’s still a choice they make.

My heart aches for the child MJ once was, and same with all the Jackson children, who didn't really have a healthy childhoods at all. But as you say, that's no excuse for any of this. He then went and took the childhoods and innocence of others, as many abused people do.

Bless the ones with empathy and inner strength, who would rather choke on glass than visit that kind of evil upon a child, because they know exactly what it means to survive that nightmare.