Michael Jackson

[KINGAA]

I don't know how anyone could watch Leaving Neverland and not believe those men. It was one of the most compelling and heartbreaking things I've ever watched, that was 6-7 years ago and everyone just brushed over it.

Now with this new biopic that's a total biased account produced by (and starring) his family, I wonder if the conversation will come up again.

read this,

I think MJ was dodgy as they come but that documentary was filled with false and fake scenarios. I don’t believe Wade one bit because of that doc.

Also to note from that article: As for Jackson’s legacy — let us remember not a single dollar goes into his pockets anymore. He is dead. According to his will, his money should be benefiting his elderly mother, his children who have been orphaned, and charity. To date, his estate has brought in at least $1 billion since his death. That means, if his wishes are followed, there’s about $200 million to spare for charities. That’s probably more than any living celebrity has given to charity lately.

 

[Web30]

Jafar is incredible, was worried as the reviews weren't great but its such a good film, definitely made for the fans.

 

[Harlot O'Scara]

He was a paed, the backbending fans will do to excuse him is wack. I loved a lot of his music, honestly I still listen to some of it, they are an undeniable indelible part of musical history. But I can still acknowledge he was a nounce. There is so much similarity in victim testimony. He groomed children and their families; I don't believe he nonced every child he hung out with (like Mark Ronson, mentioned above) but he would test them by eg exposing them to pronography and seeing what he could get away with and which children were more vulnerable or had parents he could fool. He had an alarm system set up so that if anyone approached his bedroom he'd have plenty of notice. His housekeeper warned people to keep their kids away from him. He was pictured with a never ending string of young boys who mysteriously stopped hanging out with him after a certain age. HE LITERALLY SAID WITH HIS OWN MOUTH HE SHARED A BED WITH KIDS. I would not be surprised if some of the details were inaccurate, some of Wade's words sound a bit off to me, but no matter the intimate details it is irrefutable he had sick and inappropriate relationships with children he groomed. He was a nounce. Occams razor.

The fans are on a hiding to nothing trying to quote Mark Ronson as a defence because he himself said Jackson slept in Sean Lennon's bed and Mark slept on the floor.

Jackson was far less likely to predate the rich/famous kids he hung around with because they or their parents had a lot more money and power than the like of Wade Robson or the Chandlers.

 

[Piff paff puff]

So if he was the best dad as they have claimed what is it of your or my business if they are biologically his. Honestly the crap people write in papers and it just escalates.

Imagine living a life where you have to prove every move in life to everyone. Even in death people are still wanting to invade his private life

Unfortunately that's the price of fame and this is after all a forum where within the rules we can all opine and disagree and agree. I don't do social media or news in any form and I've never followed Pop culture to any degree so I don't know the details of any news articles but I love a bit of tattle
If you believe MJ is great, was a great person, great dad, great entertainer then that's great.

 

[Web30]

I've not read it but I understand LMP in her book has said that MJ and LMP were meeting up for like 4 years after the divorce to see if they could make things work between them.

Yes I have heard the same, they stayed close friends. Her daughters said in interviews she remembers it as a real relationship

 

[Dexy]

Still can't get away from the fact he let (mostly)young boys in his bed. Whatever the facts,this is wrong surely??

Of course facts matter! I think he was maybe naive or eccentric but it doesn’t automatically mean sexual behaviour between adult and child if you are a normal human being. He’d grown up in the limelight, I don’t think he had a grasp on what we would call normal behaviour. How could you? Everyone knows your face since five years old. But that still doesn’t make me label him a pedophile.
Most importantly though in court the mother said they only visited four times and I think three he wasn’t even there! It’s just stuff like that that makes me query it. It wasn’t mostly boys either. Lisa Marie Presley has done many interviews explaining this. I’d rather listen to his wife than The Sun paper. I just feel there’s so much that doesn’t add up with this case. No one can know for sure of course but it makes for food for thought. I’m not media lead that’s all. I read the court documents and it really opened my eyes to how much was wrongly put in the press. Since all this stuff with Epstein came out I’ve been a lot more open minded. It seems the real people were protected for years and he’s been labelled over and over in death. Why do they constantly bleat on about it? It just seems really odd to me. Dead, black man accused even in death despite being proven not guilty in court ( even the term Wacko Jacko is racist ) but elite, white men get away with it for decades.

 

[Anotherct]

I am an ex superfan that now sees him as the creep he is. Can’t stand his music and can’t believe it is still played it on the radio in public. Let alone trying to promote a stage show and movie WTF no way. Both would be so biased and not reveal the truth.

Side not: what parent would allow their kids to have sleepovers with a grown man? If I were one of his victims I’d be pissed at my parents.

I’ve only just found this thread so apologies if it’s been mentioned, but his ex body guard describes his bedroom as the average day house. It had two floors and the children slept on a different floor to him, he also states the parents were also there. Do I find MJ incredibly odd? Absolutely. But I’m not convinced he abused all these children. Even Aaron Carter came out against his own mother saying nothing happened and she was trying to make out it did for money. No one will ever know the real truth but I think he was just an oddball. Of course he shouldn’t have been having sleepovers with children but I do think it was just that, a sleepover.

 

[Glaschelle]

My take on MJ is this - he was an incredibly talented, driven person. Probably because of his daddy issues.

He wanted to be the biggest star in the world and he was,

I think apart from one nose job he always denied he'd had any plastic surgery. Which is crazy cos his whole face changed. So we know he didn't always tell the truth about himself.

Regarding the allegations for me it's simple. After the chandler lawsuit and toll that investigation must have taken on him - why did he carry on being involved with wee boys??? Common sense tells you to stay away from them.

Even if you've done nothing wrong and only have the best intentions towards these kids, surely as the biggest star in the world with a "brand" to protect, some level of self preservation would kick in??? But it didn't. Very strange.

But the fact is if you think MJ is innocent, you're not gonna change your mind. Same as if you think he's guilty.

Personally I think he was a total oddball that I wouldn't let anywhere near my kids. But if I had a son who liked singing and dancing and the biggest star in the world said they could help him, would I change my mind???

And 2 final things, this one is especially for UK tattlers - if you believe MJ is innocent after paying out cash to the Chandlers, do you also think the Artist formerly known as Prince Andrew is also innocent as he paid out a civil claim, which was raised during the platinum jubilee???

And lastly - who's Bigi!!!

 

[Miss Havisham]

She married him days after the divorce from her previous husband - with her mother warning against marrying him, concerned she was being used.

They divorced quickly - with LMP citing his controlling behaviour. It’s well documented that he was pressuring her into having children (she already had two) and she feared that she would be then dumped with a custody battle to follow. She said he was controlling and isolated her.

As for her maintaining a connection to him following the divorce, I’m sure there were complexities - but they were literally married for a year. Likely that the year that they were married, was not normal in any sense.

The overall impression is that she was used and also seemed vulnerable.

Not the first sham showbiz marriage - and certainly wasn’t the last.

 

[AllSeeingEye123]

She keeps distancing herself from her father. She didn't support his movie with the rest of the family and now a weird mother's day post that feels there is a lot more to it than celebrating her mother.

 

[Sir Lancelot]

As an artist, MJ was incredible and truly a genius.

As a person, he was deeply flawed and throughly broken by his father and his upbringing and by being famous since being a boy.

His behaviour, whether you believe he was up to no good or not, was strange to say the least.

Should we stop listening to his music?
No.
Art and artist are always two different things; otherwise we'd lose everyone from Elvis to Bowie to who-knows-who else.

I do still think he started to looklike Michael Morbius by the end, though...

 

[annanuttall]

I always thought his lawyer was kind of creepy himself.

 

[GiggleBee]

Jimmy Saville is dead and can’t defend himself, Doesn’t mean he wasn’t a weirdo ffs.

MJ is such an icon that people don’t WANT to believe it. There’s a lot of evidence and statements from other people that don’t look good on him

He was never going to say when he was alive ‘yeah I’m into young boys’ was he. Let’s be realistic

I just think that once a person is dead it should be laid to rest.

 

[Miss Havisham]

If nothing has come out in 17 years,it ain't coming out now.

Plenty has been discussed in the past 17 years. People make up their own minds - but it will be based on his behaviour. What they knew at the time and what they have become aware of more recently.

 

[Horatio]

Yes I have x

I watched the documentary and I believed they had been abused. It's very convincing and upsetting. But I wanted to look into it further. There's a good documentary on YouTube called entering Neverland which is an eye opener. Wade is so shady. I just thought, Michael isn't here to defend himself and it's only fair I took a look at the other side x

Ok fair enough. I was asking genuinely and wondered how anyone could watch it and not believe them so I will look into these things.
I do think the argument of him “‘not being here to defend himself” is a weak one though. In fact him being dead is quite clearly what seems to be empowering people to speak - his power was too great when he was alive. People were scared.
And no one said that about Jimmy Saville - because he doesn’t have a devoted fan base determined to defend him.
But still, as I said, I will look into your links.

 

[Prince fan 1999]

Either way,I really can't bring myself to listen to any of his songs anymore,which is a huge shame. It just feels so wrong...

 

[Abominatrix]

I am an ex superfan that now sees him as the creep he is. Can’t stand his music and can’t believe it is still played it on the radio in public. Let alone trying to promote a stage show and movie WTF no way. Both would be so biased and not reveal the truth.

Side not: what parent would allow their kids to have sleepovers with a grown man? If I were one of his victims I’d be pissed at my parents.

Hollywood is absolutely overflowing with them, parents who want fame/wealth for themselves or their children and will do anything to get it.

I don't doubt that some of the parents were successfully manipulated by an absolute master of the game (that Peter Pan bullshit of his was worth its weight in gold, it's still doing the work of making people think he's just an overgrown child) but there are a number for sure that didn't care and were happy to look the other way.

Hell, I'm still reeling after watching a horrible story about a woman who basically let a total stranger walk off with her daughter for the promise of a WalMart gift card and some McDonald's.

 

[Libertine1975]

They asked potential jurors if they were fans and many either said they weren't or they could be impartial which clearly wasn't true. It happens more than people realise. Everybody wanted a part of the trial, even non fans so it's not a surprise his actual fans were willing to lie so they could be close to him even with what it was.




BIB - There is a well known UK singer who has had a lot of accusations thrown at him over the years and even had his home raided but they found nothing. He played the victim and many believed he was innocent but the rumour is after he got his fingers burnt years ago, he stopped shitting in his back yard and only did it in places he knew he could get away with it...countries where there were lots of poor people who he could throw money at to turn the other way. A few people have come forward saying he abused them when they were kids but it was ignored and anytime something turned up online, it was quickly deleted because he was part of a wider circle.

Is the singer a bachelor boy? Trying to think who it could be and that's the one which springs to mind having been raided?

 

[Prince fan 1999]

I loved Bohemian rhapsody,and the critics panned that too.

 

[Prince fan 1999]

Yes I have heard the same, they stayed close friends. Her daughters said in interviews she remembers it as a real relationship

LMP was completely broken after he died. She stayed with his coffin after everyone left. Theres a photo