Was that the case of Ben Geen you are referring to regarding shift stats? Another interesting one.
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Bail is very rarely given in murder cases in the UK, never mind for someone accused of multiple child murders/attempted murders. It used to be that you faced trial six months after charging in murder cases, unless it was something more complex like a mental health defence, but the custody time limits had to be extended due to the pandemic and now we have even further delays caused by the barristers strikes. Unfortunately, right now, everyone on remand is in the same boat as Lucy Letby. The worst delays are in London.
She was arrested but not charged until almost two years later (from memory, she was rearrested during this time so they could put more charges to her) She was released under investigation but had to report to the police station periodically - I know because The Sun got a photo one time! I'm 100% certain she was not allowed back into the hospital after the first arrest.
Absolutely yes (unless the judge doesn't lift reporting restrictions) although I suspect that, after the opening statements, it will quickly become pretty boring to the vast majority of people.
100% agree on your first point.
The press named her from the first arrest - the police never did until she was charged (as it absolutely should be) They trawled her Facebook account, published photographs of her, her house, her address. If she is innocent, her life is over anyway. Seems they learnt nothing from Christopher Jefferies.
Murder convictions are obtained all the time on solely circumstantial cases - they can surprisingly be more compelling than cases with direct evidence. No doubt I'll be explaining the pencils theory at some point! But I do feel, and have said from the start, that there's unlikely to be a smoking gun and that this will boil down to shift patterns, who else was/wasn't there, ruling everyone else out. I would be flabbergasted if she's kept a diary detailing her child killing exploits for example.
They were all named at the start, including the alleged attempted murder victims. But it was very clear from the last court hearing that severe reporting restrictions are now in place (quite rightly so in my opinion) and they now cannot be named for legal reasons. I would imagine that restriction will be lifted once the trial gets underway.
All of them I would imagine unless the judge doesn't allow it.
The trial is being held in Manchester. It was moved away from Chester early on.
Well, it is alleged because nothing has been proven yet.
I have to say I don't really understand this comment or any of the comments saying how locked down/secretive this has all been.
Just to be clear - that's EXACTLY how it should be. Once someone is charged, all reporting should cease except for scheduled court hearings. We, the public, should know nothing about a murder case, except for the name and age of the victim, where it happened, and name, age and address of the accused, until the opening statement on the first day of trial. Doesn't stop some of us stalking on social media *ahem* but that's not being reported nationally. I suspected it but, as I said, it became very clear at the last hearing that the judge has put in some severe reporting restrictions probably due to the very over zealous (and that's being polite) initial reporting by the media. It is them who constantly muddy these waters. The judge has stamped his authority on this, quite rightly so.
We are NOT the USA where cases are dissected in intimate detail before trial - Lori and Chad Daybell being the new Chris Watts over there - and thank bleeping Christ for that.
Everyone in this country is entitled to a fair trial. Everyone. No matter what they may or may not have done.
Can't think of any off the top of my head although I can say that trials involving gangs with multiple defendants can take months because each defendant has a defence barrister who can question each and every witness. I know of one in London recently that had to be split into two trials due to the number of defendants/Covid restrictions whereas they would usually be tried altogether. We like to round 'em all up at once rather than individual trials like the USA.
The Lucy Letby cases involves a huge number of victims and evidence will have to be heard in relation to each one.
I believe it's just one prosecutor (for the CPS) and one defence barrister (for LL) in a criminal proceeding (and also their junior staff)
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I'll never understand anyone wanting to know the names
Correct - it's always the Crown that prosecutes in criminal cases, not each of the victims. There will be evidence for each though, which is why it's scheduled to take a long time.
The media silence is absolutely correct, anything else would compromise the prosecution. There will be enormous pressure to get things right in this case and I feel for all involved.
Could you point me to the post where someone asked for names please?
I mean on social media. At the time, people were asking foe the names to be released. Never mentioned on here
I was thinking I'd missed a post or something then. So trial is next Tuesday. I await with baited breath.I mean on social media. At the time, people were asking foe the names to be released. Never mentioned on here
I'm actually dreading the trial and what will come out. I don't think I could listen to it all of I was a parent of one of those babies.
Like someone said above though. IF she is innocent, he life is over anyway. She'll always be the nurse accused of murder and attempted murder of babies.
Like someone said above though. IF she is innocent, he life is over anyway. She'll always be the nurse accused of murder and attempted murder of babies.
It's going to be interesting albeit sad.
It'll be just sad. We've all said we want to know what evidence there is.. I don't think anyone will like hearing it.
Thing is. If they've got something concrete, something completely concrete against her, why the duck wouldn't she jusy please guilty.
Thing is. If they've got something concrete, something completely concrete against her, why the duck wouldn't she jusy please guilty.
The names have been released in the past. If you search “Lucy Letby victims” the results will come up.
I was most horrified about the fact that one triplet died one day and another died the next
if she did commit these crimes I don’t know how anyone can live with themselves after
I was most horrified about the fact that one triplet died one day and another died the next
if she did commit these crimes I don’t know how anyone can live with themselves afterI’ve seen the babies named in older articles but I don’t know why people would seek them out.
Unfortunately I think she is guilty. I don't know any of the facts but I can't see why there would be a huge trial otherwise. I hope I am wrong.
Innocent until proven guilty imo. I’ll wait to see what evidence they have against her before I cast aspersions. There must be something linking her to the deaths of those babies. It’s all very strange but should become clearer once the trial begins.
Just correcting myself - I realise it's the word 'attacked' you had the issue with, not alleged. Apologies. It was very late and I didn't have my glasses on
I would also add to my original post that a proprosed trial date was set early on but then both sides, prosecution and defence, said they wouldn't be able to meet it due to the sheer volume of work they had to do and so it was put back six months, which will have actually ended up being nearly ten months if things kick off as planned next week.
She was charged in November 2020 so it's taken almost two years to get to trial. That's a very long time here. I think it feels every longer because she wasn't charged until almost two years after her first arrest, in July 2018, so she's been in the public conscious for over four years now.
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It's a shame that some people think she's guilty before trial... I'm not saying there's zero possibility of her being guilty because the CPS would not have make the decision to prosecute had there not been enough to provide a "realistic prospect of conviction" against her on each charge but don't people want to read the evidence presented (which is one of the purposes of a criminal trial) before they make up their mind? If she is innocent of the alleged crimes I genuinely feel awful for her because her life will never be the same. I don't think it's easy to get away from the fact you were arrested for murdering and harming several babies.
She still might. She can change her pleas at any time including on the day of the trial and during it. But this is one of the things that makes me lean towards there being no smoking gun.
Someone on the Real Life Crime & Murder thread said a while back that it would be one of the trials of the century. Whilst I wouldn't go that far - personally, I think it's probably going to be quite tedious day to day - but there's no doubt it will be massive nationally. That said, unless you're my age and/or take an interest in crime, a lot of people now have never heard of Beverley Allitt - she had almost faded from public consciousness until Lucy Letby was arrested. If she's found guilty, will people be talking about Lucy Letby in thirty years time like they still talk about Thompson & Venables or almost sixty years like Brady & Hindley? Right now, I doubt it but that very much depends what comes out during the trial and after the verdict.
I would like this a million times if I could.
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She will have legal representation. They will be advising her the whole way and if they believed a guilty verdict was a sure thing and there were horrific things going to come out they would advise her to plead guilty, not to say she has to though. Its her choice. I do think the defense will have a job convincing the jury to the high profile nature of the case.
However in a situation like this where there is many other people dealing with the care. Reasonable doubt can probably be argued.
However in a situation like this where there is many other people dealing with the care. Reasonable doubt can probably be argued.
There are so many people who don't understand the term innocent until proven guilty.
This timeline of the murders and attempted murders comes from the YouTube video linked below.
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