Lucy Letby Case #20

[Tofino]

My only issue is that the dr has said if the nurse says he apologised & did it then it happened. Surely if he was sure it didn’t happen then he wouldn’t have said that??

I definitely think this will be adding doubt for the jury. Although I do think it’s an example of inadequate care allowing her an opportunity but appreciate it throws in the doubt about her guilt

ETA - you all know i think she’s guilty so this is a big bit of evidence for me tbh. First time I’ve felt a little doubt

I can see why there is doubt about LL turning machine off but not sure what that actually changes regarding the rest of the evidence for this incident. Baby vomited and collapsed on her shift yet again when she had been fine for the two weeks since her first collapse. She was behind a screen, the machine was turned off whether it was her or someone else. Her familiar messages to colleague afterwards blaming others and seeking attention.

I really don’t think the doubt around the machine impacts the doubt about her attempt. If the machine was on like previous attempts would there be any doubt?

 

[MmmB777]

Why didn’t the multiple people that knew lots of elderly ladies were dying at home after a visit from Dr Shipman realise and do something about it? I honestly found some of the documentary so incredibly baffling it was nearly laughable if it hadn’t been so awful. But that strangeness didn’t change his guilt. Why if what he was doing now seems so obvious and the prosecution were able to go through hundreds of records and say ah yep there he is at the scene when another old lady dies so we can safely say he injected them too - why didn’t people notice for decades? Some people had BOTH their parents die suddenly with Shipman there each time. Why didn’t they question it? I’m guessing because of the nature of the victims- old but not even very ill on many occasions. Here instead we have premature and in hospital but by no means near death. I’m guessing largely it is because of the utter sense of trust in medical professionals to be caring, to be doing the right thing, to make people better not to be needlessly snuffing out lives. And nobody would find that more unthinkable than another medic. IMO it just doesn’t impact on her guilt at all.

 

[MmmB777]

Yikes.

 

[Treesy19]

The minimum number of jurors required is 9. I am just shocked this case hasn’t been in the main stream news on a regular basis. Many people I chat to have never heard of it!! Perhaps if it was more publicised the operations of it would be smoother! Shambles!

The British media is more invested in trashing an American actress and a Prince in order to deflect the political scandals and chaos from the very hands that feed them. Side story of a nurse on trial, not worthy yet. I imagine when we eventually get to the end and the verdict it will be all over the place. The usual people then emerging from the shadows recounting memories of her. I await!

I count myself as sweetwise crimewise but there are even big shocking cases I don’t hear a dicky bird over until it’s splashed in the paper after a jury verdict.

 

[Treesy19]

It seems the hospital neonatal unit was below acceptable in numerous areas. But they also had a killer on their hands - so they had both things going on. I’m hedging my bets that the former certainly facilitated the latter from continuing for as long as it did. An enabler.

I haven’t totted it up but numerous independent expert witnesses have testified about their conclusions of the air embolisms. Yes it’s the prosecution, but they are giving evidence independently still. I have been called by the prosecution (crown) myself several times (won’t say my line of work) but am still just presenting and basically being asked questions about my expert witness statements and what I did. My answers wouldn’t change no matter who asked me to be there. So I do believe them when numerous conclude about the air.

A doctor admitted she regretted not insisting on a PM for Child E and I can’t fathom why that even went under the radar still. Did no one have balls to step up and say that baby should have one. An understaffed unit that couldn’t be bothered with the admin and possible fallout from it.

And why no proper follow up action was taken when it was known that two babies (F and one upcoming…) must have had synthetic insulin given to them when they should not have.

After all this, there’s going to be a long old report on this for sure.

 

[Tofino]

I forgot these next incidents were on the due date, following the first incident being on the 100th day. And Lucy has yet again deflected the issue on to others (nursery nurse this time - is it always someone less experienced?).

And whilst she’s complaining about the nursery nurses not knowing what to look for (yet baby being in room 4 all weekend with no incidents) the baby stops breathing on Lucy’s shift just after she fed her, not the nursery nurses. That dear old friend bad luck striking her again!

Nah this is all too much to be just a coincidence, on top of baby A-F too.

I’m a bit confused though, if baby was with nursery nurses all weekend (so not Lucy or another nurse) was this Lucy’s first shift with Baby G? Not sure if I’ve missed anything about the shifts. If room 4 is covered by nursery nurses then why was Lucy with Baby G in room 4?

 

[tinkertailorsoldierspy]

I'm glad the court is back up and running again. It must be absolute torment for those families attending and I'm sure any delays or stop starting is just prolonging it.

I thought yesterday was a strong day for the prosecution. It was basically confirmed that poor baby G had been perfectly stable until that awful vomitting episode which has been deemed as non natural. If I were on the jury I think I'd find that pretty compelling.

 

[Windowtothewall]

Really interesting that she’s written ‘what allegations have been made’. That suggests to me she did NOT know she was suspected of murder before her arrest. Yet she’d written that she killed them on purpose on another note…

Good point actually. She knew she was suspected of something dodgy (like negligence maybe) but I doubt she knew it was murder, or wouldn't have kept all the medical notes at home.... At that point, the police weren't considering it murder, they were just investigating unexplained deaths and wouldn't have shared their suspicions or the possible charges with anyone who could have told LL.

LL only found out they considered it murder AFTER her arrest, and that was AFTER she'd written the notes. So why say, "I killed them..."

 

[candyland_]

I’m hoping to catch up a bit.

Nobody is clicking that there’s a killer on the ward. But we’re being told it’s so obvious now because of x y z. I’m not talking about action to help the child. I’m talking about action in terms of finding out wtf is going on and why all these unexplainable and unprecedented events are constantly occurring. I honestly don’t see how nobody noticed her at all these happenings at this point. We’ve only been over a 3 month period so far and how many charges are we in? So what 90 days in roughly and we’ve got 7 babies crashing in unexplained circumstances 4 die ( off the top of my head) It just doesn’t make any sense that nobody has raised any concerns yet, in my experience neonatal nurses aren’t in it for the money they love children and I feel if they even had the slightest bit of suspicion not even necessarily LL that they would have been raised in some way by now

Very early on colleagues were saying she had a bad run at work and as we moved to Baby E and F they had started to gossip. Most of them knew they were happening around Lucy even though she wasn’t the designated nurse in a lot of cases.

I think the fact Baby G was an IVF baby is why she was so determined to kill her. She’s sicker than I thought.
She dropped into the police interview that Baby A and B were much longer for too and I’m sure another baby was IVF. She went for the ones that would hurt the parents the most imo. I’m not saying others are less hurtful but she knew how long their parents waited for them.

 

[stardust1]

Not followed as closely with the days off, will hopefully get back into reading. Think the threat of permanent banning has scared people off

 

[tennis ball michael]

I’m voting guilty at the moment (subject to terms and conditions, I am open to having my ideas challenged by the defence) and one of the reasons is the Daily Mail podcast. For me, cynically, I think they know this is going to be huge and that she will be found guilty and loads more will come out. I think the podcast will win journalism awards and be the go to source for info for years to come. I just don’t think they would invest in the podcast unless they thought it was going to get them millions of world wide clicks.

Although Tofino’s wiki is the real gold standard.

 

[Lovely_rita]

I am so curious what will come out the woodwork when the trial is over. So far what little we have heard that Lucy is a nice, normal woman.

Beverley A had a ton of stories about her being unpleasant, attention hungry and just plain weird. The 'it's all the drama, Mick, I just love it' part of me can't wait to hear from those who knew Lucy before.

 

[Deeznutslol]

I never said they were. They've got more free time to do jury duty than most working folks is all I meant.

Indeed they do, but would you really feel comfortable knowing that if you were accused of a crime the jury would only contain elderly people and unemployed people? Would you feel comfortable with a jury which was made up of only white people? Or black people? What about a jury which only had men on it?
I get what you’re saying, I’m sure most would agree that jury service is inconvenient, but at the end of the day there is a reason why we don’t exclude entire sections of society from participating in juries…

 

[tennis ball michael]

My two penny’s worth:
I don’t think she realised the implication of the monitors being off when she gave her statement, but when she heard the opening statement by the prosecution she wanted to offer this bit of information/context. She’s careful not to align herself with LL- she doesn’t agree that she remembers LL being the one to say you should take this further.
If I’d been a previous colleague I’d want to make sure I was totally upfront and transparent- I couldn’t have sat on the additional info I had after hearing the opening statement as I’d want the justice system to just have all the facts that I know- I wouldn’t want to feel I personally was responsible so let for some being found either guilty or not guilty wrongly.

Dr G seems to take it in the chin and offers her the professional courtesy of saying that if she has said that it must be true. Either way- it didn’t seem to have been a big deal for him at the time and he’s not saying he didn’t do it and LL did.

I did enjoy how BM didn’t get the corroboration he seemed to be angling for and as pp have pointed out- it doesn’t change what happened the baby G.

‘Tis a shame how it was woven into the prosecutions narrative though. Has made them look reaching.

Feel free to say if you think I’ve missread the situation though and if it is more damning.

 

[Wellthisisinteresting]

me until the 9th of Jan - will miss you Tatlers!

 

[Blockedbyadmin]

BM is accusing Dr Bohin of colluding with Dr Evans to make their evidence the same. That’s clutching at serious straws

 

[raspberryjuice]

Something about this bothers me. The nurse would have reviewed and signed her statement when she gave it, and presumably reviewed it again before court. It would have been clear that the two doctors claiming to have turned off the monitor weren’t mentioned at the time in that statement. The doctor can’t actually remember removing the monitor, stresses it wouldn’t be normal practice etc. It seems highly unlikely that not only would the doctor not follow normal practice by leaving a vulnerable baby without monitoring, behind a screen but that LL would just happen to be there and the baby would suffer an unexpected collapse.

I would be interested to know how close the nurse who has changed her statement is to LL, and whether she is one of those who was protesting her innocence on social media.

 

[MmmB777]

I miss @OldBlondie she would have emailed Mark and Dan O by now to find out what’s going on

 

[Deeznutslol]

Well this forum is no different when it comes to impartiality, just on the opposite side of the fence but that appears to be acceptable because on here most people are on the 'right' side (in their eyes)

I disagree tbh. With regards to impartiality, the mods on here ONLY delete things which specifically break the general rules of tattle, where as the mods on fb groups delete anything which goes against their personal opinions.
So I’d say that in general tattle is far more impartial.

 

[Parsnipface]

I'm not able to dip in with this as much as I've never once doubted guilt and I really was invested to hope some doubt would be cast and it was all a horrid mistake.
Not happened fellas. I just hope life for her is filled with the horrors she deserves x