Jack Monroe #44 Spoiler

[Britney Spiers Morgan]

Finding this discussion about class really interesting. I don’t really know what it is that defines what class someone is (or what class they perceive themselves to be) but a short spell of “poverty” isn’t it.

I lived in a council house until I was 7 and then we moved to what’s considered to be a nice area. I did very well at school and went to a top university (although part of me is still convinced that I was there to make up some kind of northern state school quota they had to fill). I now have a good job and my own (mortgaged) house. FANCY.

That said, I’d still say I was WC because of how my formative years were spent and where I come from. I work with a lot of poshos and sometimes I feel like I’m the most common person alive. We have a scheme at work to promote and encourage social mobility but that just makes me cringe a bit. I’m sure it’s well intentioned but it just feels a bit patronising.

Lots of outing information there for triangulation purposes.

 

[CottageWitch]

Someone has replied and said she looks awfully small for 10 weeks. Another separate person has respectfully asked why a vet didn’t do something at birth? Radio silence from Jack.
One of her followers has replied witn a picture of herself with rats in her hair. Actual rats. Each to their own I suppose!

Rats are actually great pets! My friend has 4 and they're the sweetest little things. Super clever too, you can train them to do agility courses and mazes!

 

[heretoreaditall2019]

This next comment might be quite outing for me...hope Jack is too busy to triangulate.

Some of the problem in this situation is that the majority of teachers come from stable MC backgrounds. I say the majority, I know not all do but most.

This means that there can be and often is little understanding of the challenges some children have to overcome. I worked in a school where some children didn’t come back in September because the mum couldn’t afford uniform. Yes there was discussion in the staff room about benefits but whilst that chat happened a colleague and me went and picked up the children, took them to the supermarket and bought them uniform. Back in school in an hour. The ability of those children to do homework in a large chaotic household wasn’t understood by the teacher who rolled their eyes when it wasn’t handed in again.

I think awareness is changing in education, I am not saying the whole profession is blind to this but I can believe that when you were at Grammar school it wasn’t there.

Agreed completely, I’m 3 pages behind so sorry if this has been discussed but some of the things I’ve heard MC teachers say disgusts me. A lot of them are poverty tourists looking to rescue what they assume will be down and out kids and have disgusting preconceptions about WC, BAME, and poor (three separate groups Jack, do keep up x) children.

I’ve heard some of the vilest most classist tit and I feel so sorry for the kids that are being exposed to those opinions, I hope a lot of the learnings and resources from the recent BLM wave on SM makes its way into British schools but I highly doubt it. There needs to be anti bias training and sociology lessons as part of PGCE.

 

[TheDragonWithAFlagon]

Yep been there said that. Don't get me started on the 'charity fundraising' idea that a teacher has brought up in December...on top of parties, trips, etc etc Asking parents to send their children in a Christmas jumper is a big cost to find. A £10 supermarket jumper for 3 kids on top of everything else is £30! And then they have to bring in a quid or whatever else to pay to come to school.Then said teacher is proud of what they have raised for charity!!!!!!! Grrrr.

I refused to take part in Christmas Jumper Day at my last place - precisely because spunking twenty quid plus on a novelty nylon jumper just so everybody could SEE you had twenty quid to spunk on something that would be worn once or twice was so bleeping offensive. When I said that on another forum, people went ballistic, claiming they wore theirs every day for six months and it's all for charity, it makes people happy and I was being completely horrible to want to take the magic of Christmas away from children. The magic of Christmas in an ostensibly religious school being that you get to wear a nylon monstrosity covered in plastic trinkets for a day, apparently.

I also got told at work that I was being a grumpy old Scrooge - when I said I don't like the idea of rubbing it in the noses of kids that I've got the money for one when they don't even have a coat, so I put the equivalent into the Foodbank basket, they left me the hell alone. The kid who did ask why I wasn't wearing one got a kinder reply 'Well, I don't need another jumper, so I thought it would be more useful to get some things for the foodbank instead'. He was fine with that - although I have a slight suspicion that he probably went around asking staff why they didn't do the same afterwards.

Someone has replied and said she looks awfully small for 10 weeks. Another separate person has respectfully asked why a vet didn’t do something at birth? Radio silence from Jack.
One of her followers has replied witn a picture of herself with rats in her hair. Actual rats. Each to their own I suppose!

It's about 8 weeks at best and malnourished to the size of about 5. I've handreared enough to know - and that's giving it the benefit of the doubt that it isn't actually about 6 and a bit weeks, which was my actual first response on seeing it.

 

[Marmalade Atkins]

 

[Aquamarina]

It's so funny - when it's been busy here and Jack has been at her worst it feels like I've had a full day. My husband came home from work recently and my first excited words were 'omg you won't believe it - Jack was on the thread'!
Cue extremely baffled face - 'Who the duck is Jack? What's a thread?' I had been so wrapped up in it it I'd forgotten he hadn't got a clue about any of it or who Jack is. I just say I'm on a 'Commentary forum' and as soon as I go into any sort of detail I can see his eyes glazing over. He isn't on any SM at all and has no interest whatsoever in celebs/influencers of any sort. I think he is bemused why I am so invested in a stranger's shenanigans but I call it an enquiring mind
I used to be heavily involved with a forum for The Archers which could get very nasty (seriously) and he knows this is far more civilised.

Ooh, I’m on some Archers forums too and they can get quite heated at times, with flounces galore. Good job I’m not very good at triangulating like our Jackie
I do wonder how many of us might know each on here, whether it be IRL or via other SM platforms?

 

[bananasplit88]

It’s so obvious she’s prepping the flying monkeys. Look at the cute kitty! See how she purrs. Cut to a few days later - kitty’s vet bills are too high for poor me, please fill my tip jar. And the sad thing is, they will.

* Insert gif of buzz lightyear reporting no sign of intelligent life anywhere *

 

[Alansbigplate]

I’m with you on that one. They would never hear the end of it if anything happened

We had a cat and it was an adult and healthy - yet she would loathe going in the car and got so upset she was traumatised. We wouldn’t be moving her unless she was going to the chattery or the vet.

Is the chattery like Tattle for cats?

 

[TheDragonWithAFlagon]

Ooh, I’m on some Archers forums too and they can get quite heated at times, with flounces galore. Good job I’m not very good at triangulating like our Jackie
I do wonder how many of us might know each on here, whether it be IRL or via other SM platforms?

I avoid them. It's one time where Twitter is a much nicer place, even if you do click through to the feeds of some of the posters and find that their politics are absolutely antithetic to your own. I also avoid gardening fora for a similar reason, as they tend to have a lot of poison everything until not a 1 3/16th" blade of grass dares quiver lest it be cut down. That and hearing about orangeries and tiny gardens of a mere quarter acre/no point bothering with a pond unless it's 20' across doesn't really resound with me.

 

[Silver Linings]

No, no, no! For goodness sake.

I’ve discovered some extra rooms () in my cave away from these people you’re all welcome to join me!

 

[TheDragonWithAFlagon]

Is the chattery like Tattle for cats?

They have special perches where they can sit and shout at pigeons all day.

 

[Aquamarina]

I think she massively does! At times it seems like she was almost thinking she could be part of a gang and I think that was tempting. On Twitter her interactions are either full arse licking (her to blue tickers or non-tick followers to her) or vile insults. Here she thought she’d come in and say her piece and say she’d done battle against the trolls, but I think she started to realise that we were actually pretty reasonable and fair and funny and honest and take-no-tit. I honestly think she wanted to come back and would’ve done if admin hadn’t stepped in.

Loving the insights into the guff other halves and family members watch while we’re tattling! The caravans and plastering! Mine watches endless droning videos of planes coming into land from the perspective of the cockpit YAWN

Babe, same. My other half is big into video games (he’s 47) and spends hours playing COD and PubG in the evenings, shouting into his headset, or swearing lots if his character gets killed.

 

[NP]

Definitely. I have had repeated conversations with members of staff who have wanted substantial payments for things to be demanded with 3 days notice, midmonth with an absolute cutoff point of 2 days before most of the UK get paid their salary. Including the teachers, FFS. I've had to say as diplomatically as possible 'is this payment date absolute, because we're asking a cleaner/catering worker and a self employed builder, who are both either unpaid or waiting for the furlough scheme for self employed people to actually make payments, to come up with (for example) eighty five quid out of thin air?'. To be honest, I suspect one of the reasons I was hired is because of my background, which is clear from my school and qualifications acquired, together with work history - this place is pretty good with listening to me on such things and tends to let me make decisions where 'something' is setting off the 'they can't afford it/somethings's not right here' radar. But then again, there were parents who would make payment in full with such little notice of what, to me, are huge sums. And they've just done it without batting an eyelid.

You’ve described the school my eldest goes to, which is in a very affluent MC area, but the pupils come from far and wide. There’s a huge spectrum of very rich Land Rover driving families to WC families who live in social housing and have minimal disposable income. I’m one of the latter. We get asked for payments for things with less than a weeks notice, usually before payday. I’ve always just thought they must be disorganised but you’ve made me think that perhaps it’s too do with the MC area it’s in, the fact that many of the staff are MC and many of the families are very MC, so it’s presumed that we all have the extra cash to spare at a moments notice.

 

[Aquamarina]

Totally agree with this, I am middle class. I can’t deny it, I have a professional job and own my house (well it’s mortgaged), I regularly go to the theatre and galleries, am well travelled and am not in intimidated to eat in nice restaurants. It is how I grew up and it is how I live now, my job and finances are secure. Yes I worked hard at school and university but I simply didn’t have to overcome any adversity, I just had to ‘not duck up’.

I don’t say this to be arrogant but I say it because I fully and wholly recognise my privilege.
As a nation we are obsessed with class but we just don’t discuss the impact that it has on people’s life’s. I work in an environment where I come across lots of people across the class divide, from upper to working. What concerns me is the complete lack of understanding of privilege and the challenge of social mobility.

I have a particular issue with the myth that is; ‘you just have to work hard’ it simply isn’t true. If a child is growing up on a challenging estate and goes to a school that has poor educational outcomes and no role models then the simplistic ‘work hard’ isn’t enough. There is so much work to do in this area, she has a voice and could use it.
There is no hard work going in to your birth situation it is simply the luck of the draw and sadly that draw sets up so many people’s life path.
*I could talk about this subject for hours!



This is exactly what I think.

I am similar to you class wise, although I am extremely fortunate to not have a mortgage at all.
I totally concur with what you say here regarding social mobility and how it seems to be sadly decreasing.

 

[Alansbigplate]

Agreed completely, I’m 3 pages behind so sorry if this has been discussed but some of the things I’ve heard MC teachers say disgusts me. A lot of them are poverty tourists looking to rescue what they assume will be down and out kids and have disgusting preconceptions about WC, BAME, and poor (three separate groups Jack, do keep up x) children.

I’ve heard some of the vilest most classist tit and I feel so sorry for the kids that are being exposed to those opinions, I hope a lot of the learnings and resources from the recent BLM wave on SM makes its way into British schools but I highly doubt it. There needs to be anti bias training and sociology lessons as part of PGCE.

When I did my PGCE English I found the group work so difficult to take part in, once we had to discuss what the most significant aspect was of English teaching and only one other and myself said to ensure kids can read, write and understand. Basic life skills essentially. The others and the tutor were all wanging on about drama and the canon and we just were exasperated.

 

[heretoreaditall2019]

That is it, I'm from a deprived area and I feel that has hindered my ambition and ability to go further my Bachelors degree, had I had more privilege, I feel I would have completed my Masters by now and been in a successful job, instead of not using my degree and having a mundane customer services position. My life has not worked out how I wanted it, but I'm not entirely miserable. I own my own home as well, I have a husband and we are not struggling to make ends meet.

Ambition is something I hugely struggle with too and it’s interesting to see someone else write this thank you for sharing! I also would have loved to have gone into academia but I couldn’t have afforded it, they wanted you to show you had £7k living costs up front in your bank account - what 20 year old can do that? Off their own back? It’s hugely exclusionary and it’s a shame as everyone should be able to enjoy an education if they so wish. I haven’t felt the joy in learning / doing I had in uni since because of what the world is like and that’s sad tbh, at uni it’s like achieving for furthering of knowledge or creating something great. In the real world it’s wanky and tainted, it’s a shame.

When I started work I realised the biggest determiner of success was the ability to be like these people and chat a certain way not actual intelligence / qualifications? It was really shocking and quite heart breaking tbh. I had definitely drunk some of the MC juice cos I genuinely thought life would be easier now I’d endured 3 years at a redbrick (btw let’s not get into the essay of the uni experience when you’re not posh and/or minted) to get my first class BSc it’d just be chill here on out? I didn’t realise how cringe and uncomfortable a professional spaces would be for me, like it sounds am dram but in assimilating or code switching there is some level of self betrayal and mask wearing and it grinds you down. I have never enjoyed it.

cos it’s an essay sorry

Spoiler

I’ve got/had a career I love and ended up doing really well (head of department) for young age but I’m aware I’ve been taken advantage of and massively underpaid throughout, and hugely overworked. I’ve been naive to the fact your bosses can sniff this sort of stuff out and they want to exploit it cos it looks great on them that they can get in this person who does xyz for the same salary as someone who can just do x. No one will ever advocate for you as they do not have your interests at heart. I never have advocated for myself enough, I’ve always been too scared to walk away from offers or requests for additional responsibilities, I’ve always been made to feel grateful I’ve got a seat at the table so tolerated a LOT for that. Looking back I can’t believe some of the stuff that’s been said to me, I’ve cried it off in the work loo, then gone back to work for the rest of the day?!

I’m massively struggling with it now I’m due to become a mother too. I’ve endured mat discrimination and my bosses felt comfortable enough that I am a big enough mug to disclose a ton of stuff to me so I can see it for what it is. I’m ridiculously privileged in that whilst I am financially independent in my own right and earned well (not a humble brag cos trust me RIP hun to that was nice whilst it lasted xo ) I also have a husband in a significantly better position. On salary too, I find it disillusioning because I’d have outearned my dad in my first role so don’t really know where to go from that, I don’t know what to expect from life and I’m not money motivated at all? So I’d rather do without the grief and battle they make salary negotiations as I feel fine on what I’m in, and I just have to ignore being hugely underpaid / valued? Which is bizarre writing it out - why have I done this!

I’ve struggled with the concept of being reliant on my husband financially as I’ve seen what men do to women, a tale as old as tiiiiiime init, but finally my mental health has broken & ive ended up in therapy for self esteem/kindness and it’s to the point where work has done me in so bad I’m gonna end up impacting the baby that I’ve been brave enough to step away and look after myself for once? I just have to have faith that I’ll be okay in this situation and if I’m not, then I’ll survive, maybe I’ll do a JM and write a book on all the foods a bit of brown sauce can improve to sell to MC Lib Dem voters.

But up until 3 weeks ago I was enduring that tit because I felt lucky to have a seat at the table and a chance, a chance to work for people who’ve gotten their positions through nepotism btw they’re all friends and fam of the founder... No one has checked up on me despite me being 8 months pregnant and signed off with mental health issues and they know I’m going through a second minor cancer scare. If that doesn’t tell you it’s not worth it idk what is I’ve spent the last decade playing the stupid MC male determined game of what success looks like and I can assure you it’s bleeping tit. I don’t know what to do with my life, husband thinks I should stay at home but I have definitely got less good pre conceptions I need to work on about that path which is funnily likely due to my exposure to so many MC professional #girlbosses who don’t disclose all the additional support they’re getting to make it work looool.

Sorry for essay x

 

[Silver Linings]

Spoiler: Kitten. Jack’s followers

‘Jack wasn’t having that.’

(Minions gif)

 

[Aquamarina]

When I did my PGCE English I found the group work so difficult to take part in, once we had to discuss what the most significant aspect was of English teaching and only one other and myself said to ensure kids can read, write and understand. Basic life skills essentially. The others and the tutor were all wanging on about drama and the canon and we just were exasperated.

I too did my PGCE in English. Now I feel like I can be easily triangulated!

 

[Veronicaaa]

She says she 'rescued' the kitten from being PTS so presumably the owner of the mother cat also got that advice from the vet before Jack swooped in and took ownership, only to be told exactly the same thing by her own vet.

 

[colouredlines]

I feel like she went into this cat situation with the "we saved each other" narrative in mind already. Unfortunately for the poor cat, that's just not the case.

Honestly, I find it harder and harder to comment. I miss the days when she just made tit food and lied about photoshopping her hips.