Ioan Gruffudd & Alice Evans #173 We stand with Ioan Gruffudd and Bianca Wallace

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I’ve emerged again from my pit because I’ve seen a lot of posts talking about Ella’s personality, and how she’s an Alice Mini-Me.
I used to be an Ella.
When I was in my early tweens/teens I went to a private school with a lot of wealthy kids. My father had just discovered alcohol and was rapidly working his way up to 3-4 bottles of wine a night. My mother had become hyper-religious in response to all the abuse. I had no-one at all. Being autistic didn’t help. (I’m not at all implying that Ella is autistic - I’m referring to my situation.)
I lied like mad and said I was rich because I wanted people to like me. I wrote someone a horrible anonymous letter. I even stole something from school. I took pound coins from my father’s coat pockets to buy my mother ;and even him, to get him to like me) presents, to stop her pulling away from me.
I can’t believe that I did such things now, but I’m kind to my younger self and realise why I - she - acted that way.
I wanted my mother to protect me from my father, not in essence leave me. I wanted my narcissist alcoholic father to praise and love me - more than that, I wanted him to recognise I was a valid and valuable person in my own right. I wanted an ally, not a mother who was off completing her interrupted (due to my father) education or a father who was endlessly self-pitying and self-victimising.
I blamed my mother because I felt abandoned. I acted out horribly in front of her because she was safe.
I’m not a carbon copy of my narc father and Ella is not a narc copy of Alice.
I pulled away from them both in the end. I didn’t rekindle a relationship with my mother until I was in my twenties. I can be cordial with/to my father but the damage is done, and it’s ineradicable.
Ella is angry. All she’s done - taking $400, hacking, this latest stunt - is actually because she WANTS her father. She needs him. But she needs to keep her dangerous ‘mother’ sweet because, for now, she’s stuck with her. She feels completely abandoned. IG put on his own oxygen mask first. He came back with a live-in girlfriend. Ella’s been dealing with her mother’s’ self-pity and addictions. She knows she’ll never get real love from Alice. She feels IG no longer loves her and has moved on with BW.
She’s a kid. A kid in horrendous pain. I think that if IG steps away now, she’ll go on to a very dark path. She’ll attack someone who neither knows nor cares about her and face the full force of the law. Her ‘mother’ is enabling and contributing to this behaviour, rather than reinforcing early lessons about moral wrongs.
I turned out just fine. My moral centre is absolute. I break no commandment.
Please can we cut Ella some slack?
I’m interested in this post because I could so easily be an Alice.

I was a pretty, good-looking relatively indulged child. I’ve struggled with adulting and always made rash decisions and expected someone to swoop in and rescue me.

The big difference is when I realised this was not going to happen I did not become angry and vindictive, I put on my girl pants (very late) and whilst I still do not have my tit together I am living a much better life Alice.
 
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I’ve emerged again from my pit because I’ve seen a lot of posts talking about Ella’s personality, and how she’s an Alice Mini-Me.
I used to be an Ella.
When I was in my early tweens/teens I went to a private school with a lot of wealthy kids. My father had just discovered alcohol and was rapidly working his way up to 3-4 bottles of wine a night. My mother had become hyper-religious in response to all the abuse. I had no-one at all. Being autistic didn’t help. (I’m not at all implying that Ella is autistic - I’m referring to my situation.)
I lied like mad and said I was rich because I wanted people to like me. I wrote someone a horrible anonymous letter. I even stole something from school. I took pound coins from my father’s coat pockets to buy my mother ;and even him, to get him to like me) presents, to stop her pulling away from me.
I can’t believe that I did such things now, but I’m kind to my younger self and realise why I - she - acted that way.
I wanted my mother to protect me from my father, not in essence leave me. I wanted my narcissist alcoholic father to praise and love me - more than that, I wanted him to recognise I was a valid and valuable person in my own right. I wanted an ally, not a mother who was off completing her interrupted (due to my father) education or a father who was endlessly self-pitying and self-victimising.
I blamed my mother because I felt abandoned. I acted out horribly in front of her because she was safe.
I’m not a carbon copy of my narc father and Ella is not a narc copy of Alice.
I pulled away from them both in the end. I didn’t rekindle a relationship with my mother until I was in my twenties. I can be cordial with/to my father but the damage is done, and it’s ineradicable.
Ella is angry. All she’s done - taking $400, hacking, this latest stunt - is actually because she WANTS her father. She needs him. But she needs to keep her dangerous ‘mother’ sweet because, for now, she’s stuck with her. She feels completely abandoned. IG put on his own oxygen mask first. He came back with a live-in girlfriend. Ella’s been dealing with her mother’s’ self-pity and addictions. She knows she’ll never get real love from Alice. She feels IG no longer loves her and has moved on with BW.
She’s a kid. A kid in horrendous pain. I think that if IG steps away now, she’ll go on to a very dark path. She’ll attack someone who neither knows nor cares about her and face the full force of the law. Her ‘mother’ is enabling and contributing to this behaviour, rather than reinforcing early lessons about moral wrongs.
I turned out just fine. My moral centre is absolute. I break no commandment.
Please can we cut Ella some slack?

Exactly this.

We've all sympathised with Ioan, excused his not getting the hell away from Alice sooner as being scared too as he knew what would happen when he did. Same with this poor child. She is probably fully aware that what's going on is wrong, but maybe the alternative is worse? Don't got along with what Alice wants, and that girl's life will be a bigger shitstorm than it already is.

My daughter is older now, but I can remember her coming home from school as a young teen full of angst and rage over a falling out, and raising merry hell at home if she was over tired and something upset her. Imagine going through all those normal teenage emotions and confusion in the arms of a loving family, and now imagine going through it with Alice. Ella may be "old enough to know better" but she's probably too scared too
 
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I’m interested in this post because I could so easily be an Alice.

I was a pretty, good-looking relatively indulged child. I’ve struggled with adulting and always made rash decisions and expected someone to swoop in and rescue me.

The big difference is when I realised this was not going to happen I did not become angry and vindictive, I put on my girl pants (very late) and whilst I still do not have my tit together I am living a much better life Alice.
PS I should also have added that I am not vicious, cruel or nasty.
 
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Ok, I was sceptical about them being Alice, but she is: the structure, the details, the relentnessless

this one sounds like Ella came home with no intention to call the police or file ROs but that Mommy Greatest convinced her
View attachment 2216120
She sounds scared in these tweets. So she confirms that Ioan does have witnesses. And the claim that she has a lot of proof...why would you even reveal this "fact" if not for the intention to intimidate the other side? Accidental one-off injuries after a teeny freaked out really arent anything that will impress the judge
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I wonder if she found a lawyer for this already. you can tell who of the two acts on lawyer advice tho :ROFLMAO:
Omg. That last screenshot. Ioan was terrified of Alice. She is projecting. She is back on the booze and pills.
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See, Loopy knows exactly that nothing happened
View attachment 2216158
I *really* want to see Ella's RO request against Ioan (I suspect there is no write up yet for either as not even her DM mate had any details). Ioan's "abuse" seemd to all about downsizing after a divorce and trying to get divorced while trying to transition his abusive ex into providing (mostly) for herself. you know, like everyone does.
View attachment 2216162
Ioan is not rich enough to use litigation as abuse.
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See, Loopy knows exactly that nothing happened
View attachment 2216158
I *really* want to see Ella's RO request against Ioan (I suspect there is no write up yet for either as not even her DM mate had any details). Ioan's "abuse" seemd to all about downsizing after a divorce and trying to get divorced while trying to transition his abusive ex into providing (mostly) for herself. you know, like everyone does.
View attachment 2216162
Ioan is not rich enough to use litigation as abuse.
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DAM so wishes she could be there on the 23rd. Well you could’ve been if you didn’t have a DVRO!!! 🤭

So, I wonder who will be escorting Ella into court on the 23rd, to perjure herself because her abusive mother has bullied her into it? What the hell have you set your kid up for mAlice???
I know nothing about it but will she have to be in court as a minor or can she just make a statement?
 
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Ella is angry. All she’s done - taking $400, hacking, this latest stunt - is actually because she WANTS her father. She needs him. But she needs to keep her dangerous ‘mother’ sweet because, for now, she’s stuck with her. She feels completely abandoned.

IG put on his own oxygen mask first. He came back with a live-in girlfriend. Ella’s been dealing with her mother’s’ self-pity and addictions. She knows she’ll never get real love from Alice. She feels IG no longer loves her and has moved on with BW.
I see it a bit different. Ella has my sympathy but her wanting a RO is an escalation on the hacking, attempted blackmail and theft. I think your acting out was more minor than what she has done. It's true she needs her dad but she is in camp Alice and has been from the start. Contact diminished very quickly with her dad after the split. I agree she should never have been coerced into rejecting him, but she seems a lot easier to manipulate than Elsie who is even younger.

She also believes mAlice loves her. Mommy dearest will tell her that constantly. The fact that IG is trying hard to maintain contact (even with a chaperone) should tell her that he cares. For her own sake she needs some boundaries. It may come in the form of a judge rejecting her RO and the police dismissing her case. I hope BH high school offer her help too.
 
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Alice wants Ioan and Bianca to split up; for Bianca to go back to Australia; and for Ioan to apologise to her and come back to her again and be in a relationship with her once again.
I don't think she cares if he comes back. She just wants him to suffer. Her goal is to punish him. She doesn't care who she destroys in the process, including those poor girls. It's all worth it to her.
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I know hindsight is a wonderful thing, but what on earth possessed Ioan to be with Alice in the first place
Young, naive, and bleep struck. She was very beautiful IMO and probably superficially charming like most narcs. She'd lived this exotic It Girl life in France and he would've been dazzled. By the time he woke up to her they would've had at least one child.
 
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I’ve emerged again from my pit because I’ve seen a lot of posts talking about Ella’s personality, and how she’s an Alice Mini-Me.
I used to be an Ella.
When I was in my early tweens/teens I went to a private school with a lot of wealthy kids. My father had just discovered alcohol and was rapidly working his way up to 3-4 bottles of wine a night. My mother had become hyper-religious in response to all the abuse. I had no-one at all. Being autistic didn’t help. (I’m not at all implying that Ella is autistic - I’m referring to my situation.)
I lied like mad and said I was rich because I wanted people to like me. I wrote someone a horrible anonymous letter. I even stole something from school. I took pound coins from my father’s coat pockets to buy my mother ;and even him, to get him to like me) presents, to stop her pulling away from me.
I can’t believe that I did such things now, but I’m kind to my younger self and realise why I - she - acted that way.
I wanted my mother to protect me from my father, not in essence leave me. I wanted my narcissist alcoholic father to praise and love me - more than that, I wanted him to recognise I was a valid and valuable person in my own right. I wanted an ally, not a mother who was off completing her interrupted (due to my father) education or a father who was endlessly self-pitying and self-victimising.
I blamed my mother because I felt abandoned. I acted out horribly in front of her because she was safe.
I’m not a carbon copy of my narc father and Ella is not a narc copy of Alice.
I pulled away from them both in the end. I didn’t rekindle a relationship with my mother until I was in my twenties. I can be cordial with/to my father but the damage is done, and it’s ineradicable.
Ella is angry. All she’s done - taking $400, hacking, this latest stunt - is actually because she WANTS her father. She needs him. But she needs to keep her dangerous ‘mother’ sweet because, for now, she’s stuck with her. She feels completely abandoned. IG put on his own oxygen mask first. He came back with a live-in girlfriend. Ella’s been dealing with her mother’s’ self-pity and addictions. She knows she’ll never get real love from Alice. She feels IG no longer loves her and has moved on with BW.
She’s a kid. A kid in horrendous pain. I think that if IG steps away now, she’ll go on to a very dark path. She’ll attack someone who neither knows nor cares about her and face the full force of the law. Her ‘mother’ is enabling and contributing to this behaviour, rather than reinforcing early lessons about moral wrongs.
I turned out just fine. My moral centre is absolute. I break no commandment.
Please can we cut Ella some slack?

Totally this I empathise a lot with Ella thank god my mother abandoned me at 13 instead of trying to do the PA stuff. I behaved awfully to my dad because he was stable and I knew I could take my rage out on him. He had sole custody and I had intensive threapy because I had been subject to emotional and physical abuse. He had a girlfriend but he didn't full on move in with her until a lot later and I had moved out in my late teens. I think he knew I wouldn't cope with another person full time in my space whilst I was processing what happened. I'm fine now many years later successful career and married. Lifes peachy.
 
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We are all the product of many many things: nature, experiences, events, examples, things that shocked or scared us at a young age, things that made us happy. When we become adults, we are also our choices. There isn’t just one thing that makes us who we are. Same with Ella and Elsie. Personally, I believe that the bleep never cared much about the youngest because she was busy grooming the eldest.
Yes, I just meant it wasn’t *inevitable* that being brought up by Alice would lead to certain behaviour because the other daughter is proof enough that it isn’t. I just disagree with the view that ‘she never stood a chance’. She has shown that she can very well go against her mother too at times. She’s still young and her brain in still developing and yes she is in a very stressful situation. But by the time someone is a fully formed adult you can look back at certain things they did when they were young that were totally in character with who they have been all along. I’ll leave it now. She’s too young at this point.
 
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the promised tweets of Alice's sock (you need to open the link to see the long screenshots possibly)

I see it a bit different. Ella has my sympathy but her wanting a RO is an escalation on the hacking, attempted blackmail and theft. I think your acting out was more minor than what she has done. It's true she needs her dad but she is in camp Alice and has been from the start. Contact diminished very quickly with her dad after the split. I agree she should never have been coerced into rejecting him, but she seems a lot easier to manipulate than Elsie who is even younger.

She also believes mAlice loves her. Mommy dearest will tell her that constantly. The fact that IG is trying hard to maintain contact (even with a chaperone) should tell her that he cares. For her own sake she needs some boundaries. It may come in the form of a judge rejecting her RO and the police dismissing her case. I hope BH high school offer her help too.
This all will come back biting Alice hard because if the RO is dismissed and the police investigation Ioan has a perfect case to demand all sorts of actions to help Ella. In fact he probably doesnt even need to demand them, it will be issued anyway. A child that files a RO is either heavily manipulated or the situation that lead to it (it had a tantrum, thats already confirmed by Creepy, and then it probably escalated) needs hard work to resolve this. Obviously for Alice that resolution should be to never see Ioan again (although he didnt even do anything apparently!), but courts will disagree here.

In a way it's a gift for Ioan's lawyers, providing it was an accident, but I have no doubts about this.
 
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Yes, I just meant it wasn’t *inevitable* that being brought up by Alice would lead to certain behaviour because the other daughter is proof enough that it isn’t. I just disagree with the view that ‘she never stood a chance’. She has shown that she can very well go against her mother too at times. She’s still young and her brain in still developing and yes she is in a very stressful situation. But by the time someone is a fully formed adult you can look back at certain things they did when they were young that were totally in character with who they have been all along. I’ll leave it now. She’s too young at this point.
Exactly I got arrested when I was 17. If I was judged now by my teenage actions well that wouldn't be good. I never stole 400 dollars from my dad but I did a lot of bad stuff. The brain doesn't finish developing until aged 25.
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Looking back I'm so grateful to my pa how he handled everything. He was not one tiny bit selfish everything he did was to ensure me and my siblings succeeded in life despite having a horrible start with a severely mentally ill mother.
 
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the promised tweets of Alice's sock (you need to open the link to see the long screenshots possibly)


This all will come back biting Alice hard because if the RO is dismissed and the police investigation Ioan has a perfect case to demand all sorts of actions to help Ella. In fact he probably doesnt even need to demand them, it will be issued anyway. A child that files a RO is either heavily manipulated or the situation that lead to it (it had a tantrum, thats already confirmed by Creepy, and then it probably escalated) needs hard work to resolve this. Obviously for Alice that resolution should be to never see Ioan again (although he didnt even do anything apparently!), but courts will disagree here.

In a way it's a gift for Ioan's lawyers, providing it was an accident, but I have no doubts about this.
Christ alive, all those tweets are absolutely unhinged. She needs help, maybe some Seroquel.
 
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I don't think she cares if he comes back. She just wants him to suffer. Her goal is to punish him. She doesn't care who she destroys in the process, including those poor girls. It's all worth it to her.
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Young, naive, and bleep struck. She was very beautiful IMO and probably superficially charming like most narcs. She'd lived this exotic It Girl life in France and he would've been dazzled. By the time he woke up to her they would've had at least one child.
She was so beautiful
 
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So Fooled Again is ramping up now DAM has gone.

It’s 5.30 am in LA. Imagine if she used this time to hit the gym, take the girls and dog out and about she’d probably look pretty good.
She can't hide ugly when it's inside.
 
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With the way the courts work and the state of CPS here, what options are there? He likely wouldn't be given full custody bc you now have an older child lobbing abuse claims and refusing to even spend a few hours with her chaperoned father. Yo also can't have Ella full time and feel safe and no one is going to chaperone 24/7. Unless a third party (family) steps up, it feels unlikely the girls would be placed in temporary care while therapy and supervision occurs. Alice's actions are abhorrent and criminal, especially because if she goes to jail the girls either HAVE to go to family, their father, or into care. The entire situation is sickening. I'm interested to see what gets filed Monday and Tuesday. Yo and B will have to have some response.
 
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