Gender Discussion #6

[thegirlscout]

Feel free to continue

Sam Smith has been excluded from the gendered categories at the Brit Awards.

A Brit awards spokesperson later responded, saying: “Sam is an extraordinary British artist and we agree with what they have said today. The Brits are committed to evolving the show and the gendered categories are very much under review. But any changes made to be more inclusive need to be just that - if a change unintentionally leads to less inclusion then it risks being counterproductive to diversity and equality. We need to consult more widely before changes are made to make sure we get it right.”

The 28-year-old took to Instagram on Thursday where they told their followers they look forward to 'a time where awards can be reflective of the society we live in'.

Sam Smith excluded from gendered categories at 2021 Brit awards

Solo male and solo female categories mean no room for chart-topping non-binary singer, who calls for awards to reflect society

www.theguardian.com

What do we all think?

 

[CheshireLove]

(Just posting this in the new thread - partly because I'm proud of the Meryl gif)

I love how Eddie Izzard switches to "boy mode" when it suits him. Desperate to be a woman but not that much that he won't slip back into "boy mode" to film a WWII spy thriller with Judi Dench.

"They talk about penis envy and I believe some women suffer penis envy. I cannot for the life of me get my head around this. But yes, I've always had breasts envy".




Do many women have "penis envy"? I can't say I personally have ever felt that way...but that aisde, how can Izzard say he suffers from "breasts envy" (IT'S A FETISH) and then say he "can't get his head around" women who apparently have "penis envy". What?

 

[IndominusRex]

Oh diddums sam. Women are out here telling all their stories and you’re whining about not being able to enter an award you shouldn’t win anyway unless there’s a crap whiny wanker category.

 

[CheshireLove]

Feel free to continue

Sam Smith has been excluded from the gendered categories at the Brit Awards.

A Brit awards spokesperson later responded, saying: “Sam is an extraordinary British artist and we agree with what they have said today. The Brits are committed to evolving the show and the gendered categories are very much under review. But any changes made to be more inclusive need to be just that - if a change unintentionally leads to less inclusion then it risks being counterproductive to diversity and equality. We need to consult more widely before changes are made to make sure we get it right.”

The 28-year-old took to Instagram on Thursday where they told their followers they look forward to 'a time where awards can be reflective of the society we live in'.

Sam Smith excluded from gendered categories at 2021 Brit awards

Solo male and solo female categories mean no room for chart-topping non-binary singer, who calls for awards to reflect society

www.theguardian.com

What do we all think?

Never have we needed an reaction on Tattle more!

 

[Zenchick101]

(Just posting this in the new thread - partly because I'm proud of the Meryl gif)

I love how Eddie Izzard switches to "boy mode" when it suits him. Desperate to be a woman but not that much that he won't slip back into "boy mode" to film a WWII spy thriller with Judi Dench.

"They talk about penis envy and I believe some women suffer penis envy. I cannot for the life of me get my head around this. But yes, I've always had breasts envy".




Do many women have "penis envy"? I can't say I personally have ever felt that way...but that aisde, how can Izzard say he suffers from "breasts envy" (IT'S A FETISH) and then say he "can't get his head around" women who apparently have "penis envy". What?

OH FOR FUCKS SAKES. Penis envy is one of freud's more controversial theories, and imo this quote is one of the easiest ways to understand it, "Horney reasoned that Freud’s theory of penis envy made more sense when it was taken as a metaphor; penis envy was a symbolic longing for the social prestige and position that men experience. Thus, women felt inferior because of the freedom and social status they lacked because of their gender, not because of their literal lack of the phallus."

Freud and penis envy – a failure of courage? | The Psychologist

thepsychologist.bps.org.uk

Here's a link if you want more details - it's complicated and I'm lazy rn.

This is so dumb, wether you believe horney's interpretation of the theory or freud's metaphorical explination, women don't literally want a penis.

 

[Dot_Cotton]

Sam Smith is a bell end. Who’s arsed if Sam is nominated for an award of not. Most people are more bothered about Sarah and the women’s movement in general atm. Do one Sam.

 

[Libertine1975]

Feel free to continue

Sam Smith has been excluded from the gendered categories at the Brit Awards.

A Brit awards spokesperson later responded, saying: “Sam is an extraordinary British artist and we agree with what they have said today. The Brits are committed to evolving the show and the gendered categories are very much under review. But any changes made to be more inclusive need to be just that - if a change unintentionally leads to less inclusion then it risks being counterproductive to diversity and equality. We need to consult more widely before changes are made to make sure we get it right.”

The 28-year-old took to Instagram on Thursday where they told their followers they look forward to 'a time where awards can be reflective of the society we live in'.

Sam Smith excluded from gendered categories at 2021 Brit awards

Solo male and solo female categories mean no room for chart-topping non-binary singer, who calls for awards to reflect society

www.theguardian.com

What do we all think?

The whole reason they have categories for male and female artists is because so systemic sexism and women being under represented.

We have gendered sports and athletics because women can't compete against men physically.

I've said before I don't understand non-binary. There isn't a third sex you are male or female. If you are a man and you want to wear a dress and make up, fine.

 

[SILKWORM]

Non-binary/gender-queer/gender-fluid are genuinely the most unnecessary labels and I can't see them as anything other than creating a distinct category for people who are even the teeniest bit gender non-conforming. But even then, that's not a requirement for being non-binary or gender-fluid. Literally any one of us could claim we are non-binary but say we still go by 'she/her' pronouns....yet suddenly that means we're under the trans umbrella and are part of the most oppressed group to have ever walked the planet . It's so weird to me. It has no basis in reality.

Edit: In fact, a gaming YouTuber I occasionally watch did just that. She said something like: 'I've realised I'm gender-fluid but nothing is changing. My pronouns are still she/her.'
And people came out of the woodwork with posts like 'protect her at all costs!' ffs.

 

[jewelkitty]

I recently came into contact with two females irl, one who calls herself a femme-presenting non-binary person, the other is non-binary but presents as a woman because it causes less problems

 

[skvallertant]

On the other thread someone posted a picture of someone wearing an NHS lanyard with lots of pin badges on it. I won't go into the more pressing issue of infection control, but in regards to this thread - today I was at a meeting with some NHS managers regarding some work I'm doing with them as part of my job (not NHS) and I noticed that one of the members in the meeting had a lot of pin badges, but they were all turned around, so I could only see the bits on the back that hold them on. I wonder if this is a signal that that particular trust didn't want to rock the boat or influence people in any way subconsciously? Maybe I'm overthinking and this person just put their name tag on the wrong way, but yeah

Edit. Words.

 

[Icing _on_ the_cake]

This is the same person who was celebrating women's sex based rights getting voted down at the Green Party conference last week.

I'm pretty sure Sarah's murderer didn't care much about how she identified.

 

[Mr Krabs]

I recently came into contact with two females irl, one who calls herself a femme-presenting non-binary person, the other is non-binary but presents as a woman because it causes less problems

Someone I went to school with (a girls school BTW) is now a transmasc non-binary (he/they). Said person has cut their hair, but still dresses like a woman, has a straight husband and gave birth to her kids. Fine, do whatever, just don't complain if you're misgendered by some random person on the street because it's confusing.

 

[skvallertant]

Someone I went to school with (a girls school BTW) is now a transmasc non-binary (he/they). Said person has cut their hair, but still dresses like a woman, has a straight husband and gave birth to her kids. Fine, do whatever, just don't complain if you're misgendered by some random person on the street because it's confusing.

I don't know how people feel about this, but I've always been a tomboy (in my native Swedish pojkflicka which literally means boygirl ). That said, I've never felt not like a girl/woman even though I liked traditionally masculine pursuits and was "one of the lads". I wonder how many people transitioning are doing it because of traditional gender expectations rather than dysphoria. I know it's terrible to say, but, look at what these potentially disphoric teens have to look up to. In the mtf crowd it's almost always long hair, makeup, plastic surgery. The whole thing is a car crash.

 

[CosmicCreepers]

I will always believe people can do whatever they like, as long as it's not hurting or imposing on someone else. With the original LGBT movement, people just wanted equal rights, a safe workplace and ability to marry the person they love. That's it. Nowadays, equality is not merely enough anymore.

My generation (millennials) and Generation Z are quickly becoming generations who feel "special" and entitled to everything whether other people get hurt or are climbed on, no questions asked.

I feel the most likely reason for this is the internet. I found the internet a wonderful place to connect to other people who have had similar experiences/life stories as it made me feel less alone. I've found a lot of people who now identify as non-binary (not all of course) have experienced bullying or trauma when they were young. I think this may be a way of showing their disconnect with societal norms, to show hey society screwed me over I no longer want to identify with what it stands for. So non binary people find a place together, a separate little society that they feel safe in and accepted.

I hope I've worded that right but yeah, I honestly don't have any issue with someone identifying however they want, but not if that means its putting people at risk or erasing my identity.

 

[Dot_Cotton]

I honestly don’t know if I am just ignorant but the whole non binary thing just feels like load of nonsense to me. It makes absolutely no sense and completely pointless. Just a way to appear “woke” ( I hate that phrase) and different with those that live for being offended. We were encouraged to put pronouns on things for work and they can just get to duck I’m not getting into any of that bullshit.

 

[thegirlscout]

In regards to the Sam Smith and Eddie Izzard news I think it’s rather distasteful that on a week that has had to focus on the high rate of women being murdered by men, the victims are essentially having to share the spotlight (for want of a better word) with two people who were born men. It’s like we can’t even have our own tragedy, it somehow has to be shared or ends up being used by the female trans community.

 

[emmer_moans]

Sam Smith is a bell end. Who’s arsed if Sam is nominated for an award of not. Most people are more bothered about Sarah and the women’s movement in general atm. Do one Sam.

Isn’t this the person who cried on social media about lockdown, in his mansion? Cry me a river and read the room Sam.

Also, over the past couple of days, the people i know in real life sharing the stats about women, speaking up for women etc, are....women. Deafening silence from the men I have on facebook and instagram. Absolutely deafening. The only things i have seen from men are re-posts of the butt hurt men / transwomen trying to make this about them...

 

[Ruby’s mum]

Feel free to continue

Sam Smith has been excluded from the gendered categories at the Brit Awards.

A Brit awards spokesperson later responded, saying: “Sam is an extraordinary British artist and we agree with what they have said today. The Brits are committed to evolving the show and the gendered categories are very much under review. But any changes made to be more inclusive need to be just that - if a change unintentionally leads to less inclusion then it risks being counterproductive to diversity and equality. We need to consult more widely before changes are made to make sure we get it right.”

The 28-year-old took to Instagram on Thursday where they told their followers they look forward to 'a time where awards can be reflective of the society we live in'.

Sam Smith excluded from gendered categories at 2021 Brit awards

Solo male and solo female categories mean no room for chart-topping non-binary singer, who calls for awards to reflect society

www.theguardian.com

What do we all think?

I think he's a spoilt, whingey little twit with a dreary nasal voice who has had far more air time than he deserved

 

[Badabing101]

Beautifully put @CosmicCreepers I have similar feelings.

@emmer_moans I had a similar conversation about this (deafening silence from a lot of men) with my friend yesterday

 

[Mardymermaid]

I have been coming across noun pronouns on Twitter and on tiktok at this point I believe it crosses into mental illness or attention seeking. I’m not sure which but I think it’s ridiculous people are being called transphobic for not using cat/catself or whatever noun they decide to use