Gender Discussion #17

[Ispyabudgetbeanblogger]

It's very 1984 with the changing of historical documents to reflect falsehood.

I've said it before, I say it again. I cannot support an ideology that wants to rewrite history. It's not healthy. I will always respect people's chosen names and I'm a firm believer in anyone having the freedom to live how they wish (within the limits of the law, of course). But I cannot and will not pretend that Elliot Page was a man when he played Juno. I cannot pretend that a transwoman had the same experiences as me as a girl. Yes, everyone is unique, but ALL girls have experiences around getting their period, dealing with being sexualised by the world around them, the physical pain of your body developing. Boys' experiences are different. They are no less valid or important, but they are different.

Did EP deal with wet dreams? Inappropriate erections? Pressure to act masculine? I find it highly unlikely.

 

[Brigitjonesbuttcheek]

It's such a betrayal when women say tit like that, honestly

I don't blame them though. We live in a society that has conditioned women to think like that. They're brainwashed. They think we're just crazy men haters. They ignore the facts and listened to the men in their life and the media.

 

[CookieZippy]

And yet it is TERFs who are the violent ones threats to get booted in the neck for getting pro nouns wrong and telling women to “suck my (redacted)” do people not realise how rapey it is to tell someone to suck their dick

"Stop policing what others do"

The lack of awareness is incredible.

 

[witchofwestbyfleet]

I've seen trans women on twitter refer to themselves as children as 'when I was a little girl'

Now I'm reminded of the awful Alok Vaid-Menon claiming "little girls can be kinky, I know because I was a little girl." No you weren't ... thankfully

 

[jordishaw]

This is a superb blog post by Dr Jessica Taylor about the "but what about men" brigade:

Private Site

This is a fantastic resource, thank you for the link. I think that there's definitely a trend that has established a hierarchy of oppression. I recently bought a (very beautiful, and would highly recommend) collection of knitting patterns which included this on the acknowledgements page:

And please note - I think this is an important and interesting question. But then there's this bit in the introduction:

Now, I think there is a fascinating and complex discussion to be had about the relationship between clothes and gender, and the influence of Japanese design on Western fashion (and the Japanese fashion trends inspired by 'Western' looks) - does cultural appropriation only work one way? Is gender a 'social construct' that is open to playful exploration but 'culture' and 'race' are not? It looks as though the current orthodoxy is that a white man can wear what he likes, as long as it is female identified, women should remain silent at the back of the queue wearing sackcloth produced from locally sourced and sustainable fibres.

 

[Slothgang]

Has anyone seen that Vladmir Putin is calling the West monstrous for making children believe they can change gender. Hes so right wing though that its likely to play into the TRA agenda.

 

[witchofwestbyfleet]

I've mentioned before that I'm part of an LGBT social group where some people are quite sane and others are hugely TRA-aligned. Some of them are fans of a model/actress who initially identified as "genderless" (a trend in her home country) and asexual but has now decided that she is a transman. She evidently has very serious issues that are more to do with not wanting to be seen as a woman; as she has repeatedly said things like "I know I was born a woman but I feel suicidal whenever I think about it, so please don't refer to me as a woman." Her fans in her home country have basically just expressed polite support for her wishes, but her English-speaking fans (mostly TRA types, most of whom seem to like her purely because she was "non-binary" then trans) are cheering her on and it makes me sick. This person has spoken about being suicidal because she can't bear to be seen as a woman, she is evidently not happy or embracing her "true self"

I can't help comparing it with one of my favourite YouTubers (a gamer with a decent sized following) who has repeatedly "joked" about having a substance abuse problem. If he were to say that he felt suicidal over his drug use, would I be applauding him and saying he's just a party animal having fun? No, no I wouldn't, and I hope his other fans wouldn't either

 

[weeweegie]

When I was young and liberal and naive (lol) I didn't think I'd be fussed if I had a child that came out as trans.... Now my mind is changed. It would be horrifying and I would need A LOT of therapy. It is a big trauma for parents I imagine. I recall when Caitlynn Jenner came out as trans, Kris Jenner broke down and said it was like the person she had known for however many years had died, she was grieving for Bruce. I mean, with a trans kid nowadays it must really be like that as they don't want any acknowledgement of the person they were before. How tragic. The difference is, Bruce hasn't been erased...you can still find info and pics about him online.

You can’t erase 65 years on this Earth. I don’t think that’s what Caitlin is trying to do but I have seen people in comments go nuts if Bruce is referred to. Bruce was a real life person, husband, dad, athlete and so much more for 65 years. That can never be wiped out and it’s bananas to even suggest that it should.

 

[ChilliBean]

Does anyone else follow fatpheebs on twitter she’s on yet another rant about women and the recent campaign against spiking in night clubs
So basically white women can’t get involved in campaigning for anything, even something that also effects them? I haven’t heard reports of any trans women being spiked, all reports have been young university age women

 

[Slothgang]

Does anyone else follow fatpheebs on twitter she’s on yet another rant about women and the recent campaign against spiking in night clubs
So basically white women can’t get involved in campaigning for anything, even something that also effects them? I haven’t heard reports of any trans women being spiked, all reports have been young university age women

Honestly how small does your life have to be that THIS is a major issue that is pressing you. Very all lives matter energy.

 

[cookiemunchmunch]

Does anyone else follow fatpheebs on twitter she’s on yet another rant about women and the recent campaign against spiking in night clubs
So basically white women can’t get involved in campaigning for anything, even something that also effects them? I haven’t heard reports of any trans women being spiked, all reports have been young university age women

Does this idiot have absolutely nothing better to do than to spout tit on Twitter all day? If the issue is MAINLY affecting cis (I bleeping hate that word) women, then they need to be at the forefront of this horrible issue. Why does it automatically mean that it's excluding others? It's such idiotic reasoning, it irritates me beyond belief. She (sorry, they) doesn't even seem to be able to have a common stream of thought about it either. Says that it affects so many people yet we can't say that it's affecting cis women. Make it make sense, PLEASE. But again, this is coming from the same person that loves being called she/her by other transwomen, but God forbid cis women or men refer to her that way, and that we have to automatically know that she prefers they/them pronouns because we aren't allowed to use she/her. It's exhausting

 

[Glortard]

Caitlyn also thinks that trans women should not be allowed to play in women's teams or compete in women's teams. Considering she was an Olympian I am sure she knows what she's talking about.

The interesting one is Renee Richards who played tennis both as a man and a woman. They initially sued to be allowed to compete in the US open woman's tournament in their 40's after fully transitioning. They had played tennis in the 50's as a man.

Renee later admitted that if they had transitioned in their early 20's that they would have dominated the woman's circuit. She played in the woman's US open 20 plus years after appearing as a man and got comparable results. This was when she was in the 40s and the field was much stronger

84-year-old Renée Richards reflects on breakthrough

Long before Caitlyn Jenner, Renée Richards raised questions of gender identity, but she'd rather talk about anything else today.

www.si.com

 

[SILKWORM]

Does anyone else follow fatpheebs on twitter she’s on yet another rant about women and the recent campaign against spiking in night clubs
So basically white women can’t get involved in campaigning for anything, even something that also effects them? I haven’t heard reports of any trans women being spiked, all reports have been young university age women

I haaaaate this so much. It's just so unnecessary and comes off as self indulgent. If ~cishet~ white women are at the forefront I'm thinking it was because they were the ones who organised something first? Like that insta account about this on the last thread - if the women running that account are straight ''cis'' women it's because they took the initiative to set up the account. And as a lesbian myself, I wonder why that might be? Could it be that straight women are the demographic are at much higher risk for this? Literally not everything is about non-binary queers and trans women.

Lets be real....where's the non-binary queers and trans women who've been caring about this prior? It's only when they aren't ~included~ they complain. We all know that trans women don't care about issues that impact women.

 

[weeweegie]

Does anyone else follow fatpheebs on twitter she’s on yet another rant about women and the recent campaign against spiking in night clubs
So basically white women can’t get involved in campaigning for anything, even something that also effects them? I haven’t heard reports of any trans women being spiked, all reports have been young university age women

You know what? ‘CIS’ women have been tit on from a great height from the very beginning of time and been through so bleeping much to just be seen as equal that to spout this absolute BILE when we are still getting murdered by men at an astonishing rate is just…typical? No one is denying trans/nb are also targets for abuse. It’s not a competition but why is highlighting the abuse women are a target of automatically excluding every other group in the world?? Why does the world hate women?
*Argh my PMT is raging today as this has actually upset me.

 

[Satisfying Click]

Honestly how small does your life have to be that THIS is a major issue that is pressing you. Very all lives matter energy.

Ironic considering TRAs have appropriated language from BLM and critical race theory e.g. 'Trans lives matter' 'cis-privilege.' It's no surprise that they were happy to co-opt into women as an oppressed group, but are now gaslighting the population that they are the most oppressed group ever, and it's working.

 

[colouredlines]

This is a fantastic resource, thank you for the link. I think that there's definitely a trend that has established a hierarchy of oppression. I recently bought a (very beautiful, and would highly recommend) collection of knitting patterns which included this on the acknowledgements page:
View attachment 822649
And please note - I think this is an important and interesting question. But then there's this bit in the introduction:

View attachment 822652

Now, I think there is a fascinating and complex discussion to be had about the relationship between clothes and gender, and the influence of Japanese design on Western fashion (and the Japanese fashion trends inspired by 'Western' looks) - does cultural appropriation only work one way? Is gender a 'social construct' that is open to playful exploration but 'culture' and 'race' are not? It looks as though the current orthodoxy is that a white man can wear what he likes, as long as it is female identified, women should remain silent at the back of the queue wearing sackcloth produced from locally sourced and sustainable fibres.

This is really interesting to me. I sew and knit, and I stay the hell away from the vast majority of online crafting stuff because it's usually either madly woke, or it's Americans talking an awful lot about God and modest dressing. No middle ground, it seems.

There's a big question here too, and this is quite off-topic for gender but it relates to the wider woke world. I've noticed that the people who complain about cultural appropriation of Japanese garments are...very rarely Japanese. At most, they are American with Japanese ancestry - often not even that. I don't see how someone whose grandparents emigrated 60 years ago can become the spokesperson for an entire nation? In fact, is it not kind of racist to say of someone born and raised in London or Chicago, who speaks only English, "oh, Susie must be an expert on Japan"? I dunno. It's overwhelming sometimes...

 

[Phil Anne Throw Pee]

Does anyone else follow fatpheebs on twitter she’s on yet another rant about women and the recent campaign against spiking in night clubs
So basically white women can’t get involved in campaigning for anything, even something that also effects them? I haven’t heard reports of any trans women being spiked, all reports have been young university age women

duck off Phoebe my favourite fat bleep. Get in the bin and stay there you ogre.

 

[Glortard]

Does anyone else follow fatpheebs on twitter she’s on yet another rant about women and the recent campaign against spiking in night clubs
So basically white women can’t get involved in campaigning for anything, even something that also effects them? I haven’t heard reports of any trans women being spiked, all reports have been young university age women

At the end of the day this creature is basically just howling at the moon as you can look at her tweets and there is very little interaction with them. They describe themselves as fat and happy but sadly I can guarantee that is not the case.

her tweet above that you mention is just yet another attempt to be noticed

 

[ChilliBean]

If she ever started influencing I think she would deserve her own thread on here, there’s so much to unpack with Fatpheebs

 

[Wackie Jeaver]

Has anyone seen that Vladmir Putin is calling the West monstrous for making children believe they can change gender. Hes so right wing though that its likely to play into the TRA agenda.

It's a really bleeping strange world when I find myself in agreement with anything Putin says.