Do you have any studies you can recommend? I've looked before but have not found any that show that gender exists beyond cultural norms.
Last edited:
- Status
New to Tattle Life? Click "Order Thread by Most Liked Posts" button below to get an idea of what the site is about:
I'm also looking forward to the citations for 13th century English 'singular they' usage, love grammar facts.
Justine Greening being interviewed on Sky News at the moment and she has a suffragette rosette prominently displayed on the side of her bookcase. Four years ago she was the minister introducing self ID, that's quite a turnaround.
Tbh I can’t decide whether @lupanda is some kind of trans evangelist trying a new tact in showing the ignorant the light, or if they really are a parent feeling out of their depth looking for answers.
I kind of hope it’s the latter but, if so, I can’t figure for the life of me why they hang around a thread when the majority of the posters are at odds with lu’s view that males and females all have stereotyped behaviour which trumps their biological reality. Like, there’s nothing to be gained? Don’t reply and move on to a place that offers affirmation of gender ideology if that’s what you’re seeking, because you won’t find it here.
I feel I should really use the ‘ignore’ button but I’m a bit fascinated at how long it’s going to go on for.
Gender is just… nothing though isn’t it. i always thought your sex was the binary bit (I.e you can only have a pen or a tina and only ever be classified as male or female based on that, and, only ever swap to the other if you’re dysphoric) but your gender was how you chose to express your sex - I’ve seen people classify themselves as all sorts of genders, catgender, ‘genderless’ I’ve just seen someone call themselves genderfucked. It seems to come down to some sort of facet of your personality or the way you dress rather than anything objective. But then surely that reaffirms that gender is pointless… sometimes I wear dresses and look very feminine other times I wear trousers and a shirt and use men’s scent, that doesn’t make me non binary or gender fluid or gender ducked or whatever, it makes me a woman wearing trousers and a shirt and men’s scent because what I wear/look/act like doesn’t have to be ’affirming’ my sex. I do that just by existing because I’m, you know, a woman.
I always found it odd that it’s called transgender based on that, because you don’t transition between genders when you transition, you transition between your sex. So transsexual? Although from what I’ve seen amongst the trans communities is that that’s like a dirty word nowadays for some reason…
(sorry about this long rambled post, I’m just sitting here saying everything I can think of
the trans movement is so confusing to me I love reading everyone’s POVs I can’t quite reach the same level of articulation though, and certainly not at 8am )
I always found it odd that it’s called transgender based on that, because you don’t transition between genders when you transition, you transition between your sex. So transsexual? Although from what I’ve seen amongst the trans communities is that that’s like a dirty word nowadays for some reason…
(sorry about this long rambled post, I’m just sitting here saying everything I can think of
the trans movement is so confusing to me I love reading everyone’s POVs I can’t quite reach the same level of articulation though, and certainly not at 8am )
Transgender is an Umbrella term, Transexual is a term for people that have medically transitioned.Gender is just… nothing though isn’t it. i always thought your sex was the binary bit (I.e you can only have a pen or a tina and only ever be classified as male or female based on that, and, only ever swap to the other if you’re dysphoric) but your gender was how you chose to express your sex - I’ve seen people classify themselves as all sorts of genders, catgender, ‘genderless’ I’ve just seen someone call themselves genderfucked. It seems to come down to some sort of facet of your personality or the way you dress rather than anything objective. But then surely that reaffirms that gender is pointless… sometimes I wear dresses and look very feminine other times I wear trousers and a shirt and use men’s scent, that doesn’t make me non binary or gender fluid or gender ducked or whatever, it makes me a woman wearing trousers and a shirt and men’s scent because what I wear/look/act like doesn’t have to be ’affirming’ my sex. I do that just by existing because I’m, you know, a woman.
I always found it odd that it’s called transgender based on that, because you don’t transition between genders when you transition, you transition between your sex. So transsexual? Although from what I’ve seen amongst the trans communities is that that’s like a dirty word nowadays for some reason…
(sorry about this long rambled post, I’m just sitting here saying everything I can think of
Thank you
I didn’t realise that. That’s not the case from what I’ve seen on Twitter, Tumblr et al (that shining beacon of truth and positivity ) it’s funny. and confusing. I don’t really talk much here but mostly because it all fries my head thinking about it too long.It's true, this article explains it. Important distinction to modern usage - they refers to someone unknown in the text from 1375.
A brief history of singular ‘they’ | Oxford English Dictionary
OED ambassador Prof Dennis Baron turns to the OED to provide a brief history of the singular 'they' - from the 14th century to present day:
public.oed.com
Almost too much to hope for!
I just can’t buy into the non binary stuff. I was putting some clothes away in my wardrobe yesterday and noticed that I’d worn a lot of dresses recently, when I usually wear trousers & T-shirt’s, this made me think of the ‘feminine & masculine days’ that these narcissistic, moany ‘non binary’ teenagers like to go on about on their tiktoks. Most teenage girls are miserable, bored and depressed at some point, they hate the way they look and dress, doesn’t this just come with being a teenager and new hormones? They want to feel different but also included in something, so they’ve jumped on the back of the trans bandwagon, and are enforcing their own personal choices on the rest of society. It’s literally like a bunch of goths insisting everyone wears black because colour offends them. I just hope this teenage bandwagon fizzles out and doesn’t lead to women losing their safe spaces.
As for changing the name of the thread title, I don’t think it should be changed. It’s not hard for someone to read through some posts and get a general idea of the discussion. I don’t think we should pander to people who didn’t get what they were expecting.
Also I’m not sorry if my blasé attitude offends anyone, I’m tired of watching my language in case of causing offence.
As for changing the name of the thread title, I don’t think it should be changed. It’s not hard for someone to read through some posts and get a general idea of the discussion. I don’t think we should pander to people who didn’t get what they were expecting.
Also I’m not sorry if my blasé attitude offends anyone, I’m tired of watching my language in case of causing offence.
Thank god non-binary wasn’t a thing in the late 90s, because I would have fallen for it hook, line and sinker. It’s the perfect excuse for a teen with body issues, struggling with identity/sexuality, who can’t keep up with modern beauty standards, drowning in peer pressure to have sex… I mean why wouldn’t you push back against that stuff? The quickest and easiest way is to say you’re not a girl.
I would have done it. Even JK Rowling said she understood it and would have embraced it too.
Love what you said about wanting to feel different but also wanting to belong. That was so me. That’s every teen sub-culture that’s ever existed
It was just less harmful when it was bands, clothes and make up… maybe a facial piercing or two if you were really edgy.What I really don’t get is the older people who are saying they’re non-binary. If you’re over the age of 25 (or worse- over the age of 35) and you’re seduced by this stuff…
just out of curosity, what do you think ‘gender’ is? Surely gender just comes down to our characteristics and personality? That’s my view anyway
Yes, it's really quite sad. I once got sucked into a Tiktok hole of non-binary teens. It was honestly just sad. I don't love it when people mock them - even if they are annoying and make no sense. The ones on Tiktok are clearly just confused, sad and probably lonely. A lot seem to end their videos with saying things like 'so all my fellow genderqueer people, hit me up'. They are looking for a community and belonging. If it wasn't all so damaging to themselves and society as a whole I wouldn't care.Thank god non-binary wasn’t a thing in the late 90s, because I would have fallen for it hook, line and sinker. It’s the perfect excuse for a teen with body issues, struggling with identity/sexuality, who can’t keep up with modern beauty standards, drowning in peer pressure to have sex… I mean why wouldn’t you push back against that stuff? The quickest and easiest way is to say you’re not a girl.
I would have done it. Even JK Rowling said she understood it and would have embraced it too.
Love what you said about wanting to feel different but also wanting to belong. That was so me. That’s every teen sub-culture that’s ever existed
What I really don’t get is the older people who are saying they’re non-binary. If you’re over the age of 25 (or worse- over the age of 35) and you’re seduced by this stuff…
I know nothing about K-pop, it doesn't interest me and it's frankly not made for me, so online teen communities going nuts over it doesn't affect me. No doubt there are preachy and even aggressive Tiktoks made about how everyone should love K-pop and how all other forms of music are trash. Fine. They are teens. Let them be teens and right about everything when it comes to fashion and music. Just stay away from medicine, the law and policing other people's language.
For me it's just so regressive people rushing to pigeonhole themselves or their children. Why not stand up and be proud of who you are or who your child is rather than changing things because its not what you expected.
Boys can play football, wear boys clothes they can also do ballet, childcare and dress in skirts. They are still male and the same thing applies in reverse to girls.
I hardly ever wear makeup or dresses and I wear t-shirts and hoodie from the male section. I am just as valid as women who conform exactly to society's stupid impression of what women should be, and as valid as those women who don't conform at all.
The Prisoner said 'I am not a number, I am a free man'
I am a women,not a cis women nor any other label someone tries to force on me,and I am proud of who I am.
Boys can play football, wear boys clothes they can also do ballet, childcare and dress in skirts. They are still male and the same thing applies in reverse to girls.
I hardly ever wear makeup or dresses and I wear t-shirts and hoodie from the male section. I am just as valid as women who conform exactly to society's stupid impression of what women should be, and as valid as those women who don't conform at all.
The Prisoner said 'I am not a number, I am a free man'
I am a women,not a cis women nor any other label someone tries to force on me,and I am proud of who I am.
When I was growing up the word ‘gender’ was just another word for ‘sex’ because British people are weird like that. It was put on forms instead of sex but everyone knew what it meant.
Now gender is this mythical thing that just exists within you. Apparently you ‘just know’ if you’re a man or a woman, or ‘somewhere in between’
based on some feeling rather than material reality.
Non binary is just the goth/emo/scene kid of today. That I am sure of. Most nb kids will grow up to realise that gender is nonsense and they can just be themselves without a silly label. There’s that whole thing with teenagers where they want to be ‘different’ but not so ‘different’ that they can’t identify or fit in with their peers. NB fits that bill. It’s noncommittal and easy to say you don’t id as that anymore if you change your mind.
Don’t get me wrong I’m respectful and would never want to intentionally hurt someone but the way I feel is the way I feel. Gender is bull and should be abolished. Maybe then no one would feel the need to chop body parts off, squash their breasts into their rib cages, and take incorrect hormones in order to feel comfortable doing things typically associated with opposite sex gender stereotypes.
Now gender is this mythical thing that just exists within you. Apparently you ‘just know’ if you’re a man or a woman, or ‘somewhere in between’
based on some feeling rather than material reality.Non binary is just the goth/emo/scene kid of today. That I am sure of. Most nb kids will grow up to realise that gender is nonsense and they can just be themselves without a silly label. There’s that whole thing with teenagers where they want to be ‘different’ but not so ‘different’ that they can’t identify or fit in with their peers. NB fits that bill. It’s noncommittal and easy to say you don’t id as that anymore if you change your mind.
Don’t get me wrong I’m respectful and would never want to intentionally hurt someone but the way I feel is the way I feel. Gender is bull and should be abolished. Maybe then no one would feel the need to chop body parts off, squash their breasts into their rib cages, and take incorrect hormones in order to feel comfortable doing things typically associated with opposite sex gender stereotypes.
Last edited:
AMEN to thatWhen I was growing up the word ‘gender’ was just another word for ‘sex’ because British people are weird like that. It was put on forms instead of sex but everyone knew what it meant.
Now gender is this mythical thing that just exists within you. Apparently you ‘just know’ if you’re a man or a woman, or ‘somewhere in between’
Non binary is just the goth/emo/scene kid of today. That I am sure of. Most nb kids will grow up to realise that gender is nonsense and they can just be themselves without a silly label. There’s that whole thing with teenagers where they want to be ‘different’ but not so ‘different’ that they can’t identify or fit in with their peers. NB fits that bill. It’s noncommittal and easy to say you don’t id as that anymore if you change your mind.
Don’t get me wrong I’m respectful and would never want to intentionally hurt someone but the way I feel is the way I feel. Gender is bull and should be abolished. Maybe then no one would feel the need to chop body parts off, squash their breasts into their rib cages, and take incorrect hormones in order to feel comfortable doing things typically associated with opposite sex gender stereotypes.
Now you’ve said that, I can see how people have got confused!Muchas graciasthought it meant darling daughter or son
Have you seen the drama Years and Years on Iplayer? there's a teenage girl in it who appears quite troubled and the parents feel she's about to come out. They are all ready to be supportive but she reveals she identifies as transhuman (part person, part digital entity). The wider trans movement, to me, is taking advantage of children that are yet to form their sense of self and adults that are troubled.
True gender dysphoria is very rare (but I do believe it exists).
True gender dysphoria is very rare (but I do believe it exists).
Interestingly (and perhaps tellingly) the distinction of sex and gender doesn't exist in many other languages - there's only one word. I know this is true for German and Finnish. I think it's also true for Romance language, though I'm not 100% sure. I think the word 'genere' in Italian for example only refers to the grammatical gender (il tavolo, la sedia), not the gender of a person. 'Sesso' is sex/gender in Italian. If anyone here is proficient in Romance languages, I'd love to hear if that's true/the same in similar languages.
To me the whole gender nonsense is very Anglo-centric and driven from the US - and now sadly widespread.
- Status