Perhaps she wants to keep her options open. If she never posts a “goodbye” video on youtube then she can just pop back over there if tiktok doesn’t
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Even if that's her background, her actions honestly don't make it seem like that, so you can't fault anyone for thinking otherwise. She has multiple designer bags and uses a lot of expensive skin care and make up for example and that kinda thing seems really important to her. I mean good for her if she can afford it but still. I'm not doubting her background but if she grew up midlde class, she's seemingly grown apart from that upbringing - maybe because of the money she has made from social media or just the social circles at Cambridge? And sure, she has a bunch of scholarships but they don't cover everything afaik, so it's still a privileged position to be able to choose to go abroad when she could've studied in Germany basically for free. Even if the mother doesn't make much, Elena has the privilege of her mother being willing and able to choose to go the more expensive route and spend that money on her. Plus I think she has a step-dad as well? Do we know what he does? Do we know her dad doesn't support her finanically? Even if she grew up with her single mom that doesn't necessarily mean the father doesn't support her financially? She might not be rich but it doesn't seem like she is poor either.
Obviously they're not the exact same, but they're in a similar space on the political spectrum and the types of people who vote for them are similar (meaning similar-ish demographics regarding age, gender, education level, etc.). Their refugee politics may differ but they're comporable in many aspects (even if the exact factual decisions might differ slightly because they're different countries with different issues)
It's (frankly) quite naive to ignore all the red flags regarding the CDU, especially in the recent years.
They're corrupt (most recently the "Maskenaffäre" 'mask scandal').
In 2017 they voted against marriage equality (including the "hardly super conservative" Angela Merkel).
Just last month they voted to keep limiting doctors from putting information about abortion on their websites.
They're doing virtually nothing to combat climate change (especially regarding coal power plants, they were vocally against Fridays For Future school strikes, etc.).
They have the second-smallest percentage of female MPs (at 23.4%, for comparison: the SPD has 41.7%)
There is an ongoing investigation against CDU member Jürgen Pföhler for "fahrlässige Tötung" (negligent homicide) because of his deliberate (lack of) actions in the Ahr valley floods last year. Not to mention Armin Laschet laughing at flood victims and being busy taking PR pictures, making the crisis committee wait for him before they could start their discussions.
They don't really seem to mind that the US air base Ramstein plans and controls(!) drone deployment in Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen and Pakistan from that base aka on German soil (aiding the US in breaking international law), just y'know being okay with aiding in war crimes and killing civilians from German soil, but the CDU aren't that bad, right...
I could go on...
The "the CDU is liberal actually because refugees" argument has been instrumentalized to further a viewpoint that the facts just don't support if you think about it for more than 2 seconds. Looking past just the initial numbers is imperative: accepting refugees into the country is only the first step but a lot of the next steps were not handled well (by the CDU especially), like lack of recognizing foreign qualifications, lack of integration, lack of access to education, etc. And let's not act like there weren't loud voices within the CDU at the time against Merkel's decisions!
It's also not 2015 anymore and since then different members of the CDU have been pushing for stricter laws regarding the right of asylum, e.g. just this year the CDU spoke out *against* giving Ukrainian refugees benefits on par with Hartz IV (German unemployment benefits). Another thing that comes to mind: in 2020 regarding the Sea Watch 3 mission, CDU MP Stephan Mayer called NGOs rescuing refugees at sea a "shuttle service" and claimed rescuing refugees at sea makes them go on that journey in the first place because of the "pull-factor" of potentially being rescued by humanitarien NGOs. But yeah, they're not tories because they're very pro-refugees actually....
To bring this back to the topic of Elena: One of the most publicized Bundestag decisions recently was the introduction of the "Selbstbestimmungsgesetz" (a law basically making legally changing name and gender more accessible for trans folks). The MP she interned with voted against it. I am obviously not claiming that this is Elena's view or that she'd support any of the other decisions I mentioned, but if the CDU is the party she identifies most with, imo she has the duty to be aware of these kinds of things and think about whether she ultimately can support a party like this.
Sorry, didn't mean for this to turn into such a rant and the topics mentioned were obviously some of the more extreme examples and they're a bit all over the place but they're the ones that stuck with me and I could remember rn. Sorry if this isn't easy to follow, this took a bit to write up so can't be bothered to go over it again.
I mean... it's not a podcast it's just a series of videos where she talks about German rap that she calls podcast
Sorry, I'm really not trying to be a hater and ultimately think she seems sweet but we can still be realistic and critical. That's what this thread is for.
Her step-dad bought her a bunch of books in a huge haul she did. It was on her stories a few months ago.
I'm sorry but I strongly disagree with you. You come across as a person who is quick to judge others and doesn't give them the benefit of the doubt.
She is clearly not rich and she has worked hard for the money she has and can spend it however she wants. It's not like it's being thrown at her, she has worked hard for the scholarships and created a youtube channel (which is time consuming and a proper job). What she has she has achieved on her own and when you have earned money you deserve to spend it however you want without receiving judgment from strangers.
The fact that you accuse her of not studying in Germany simply because it's free is also very judgmental. She has earned a scholarship that covers those fees so she is not paying them and why shouldn't she attend an elite university if she has the chance, it would be stupid to throw this opportunity away.
She has spoken many times about how she gets second-hand clothes and about how she doesn't drink and hardly ever parties so she obviously has more money left for other things, that doesn't make her rich. People are so quick to judge others. Other people her age go to parties every Friday and Saturday, buy several drinks etc. She doesn't do that so she has more money for other stuff.
I don't find it nice when people are so judgmental. I was poor as a student and worked my butt off to get through yet if you had looked at my instagram back then you would probably have thought that I was rich because I travelled to all kind of countries as a student. But I wasn't, I simply looked for all kinds of opportunities to go abroad (volunteering, scholarships, internships). I also hardly ever bought new clothes (I still don't, I have pullovers I bought over 7 years ago and just spend my money differently).
Yes, her step dad bought her lots of books as a special treat (for graduating, I believe, and once for her birthday). That doesn't change the fact that she is middle class? Middle class doesn't mean poor. The books were hardly more expensive than a phone or a laptop (which I have seen middle class kids get for their birthdays). I think some people here don't know what the middle class is? It doesn't mean that you can't afford anything but it is hardly being rich.
I don't even want to get into the political debate further because it isn't the topic of this thread but if you think that the German Green Party, for example, is without fault you should look up what they wanted their politics to be like in regards to children in the 80s (I won't go further into this because it is so disgusting) and they also got involved in wars (Iraq) in the past. I am not a huge fan of the CDU, don't get me wrong, but scandals, corruption etc. happen in all political parties. And no, the CDU is still not comparable to the Tories. But this isn't the right place for this debate.
When I try to remember what typical middle class gifts (birthdays, graduation etc.) would be where I live kids often get a laptop, a phone, several video games (not all of this but one of these three things). My best friend is working class and she often got several video games. Pretty sure the books cost much less.
Of course being middle class is something to be grateful for but I genuinely think some people here think that everyone who is not poor must be rich and that is simply not the case. When you can afford to buy your step-kid books for her graduation or birthday it means that you are financially stable but rich is a completely different thing. It's not like she got a car or a trip to the Maldives or a horse.
In general, people have different priorities and just because they aren't the same as the ones that are important to you doesn't mean they are wrong.
When you earn a middle class salary or grow up in a middle class household on a middle class salary you are middle class even if you decide to spend the money you have earned on second hand designer stuff or make-up. We all have different priorities and things that are important to us.
When I was a student I tried to go abroad as much as I could. I hardly ever bought clothes, pretty much never bought make-up (I had one mascara, one lipstick, one powder - all cheap), my phone was the oldest and second hand (got made fun of a lot, the phone, not me), had an 8 year old second hand laptop. But people don't see these things, they always want to judge you. I got judged for going abroad a lot (even though it was on scholarships, paid internships etc that I worked for) and maybe Elena gets judged on her designer wear or make-up (even though she doesn't spend money on parties, drinks, others stuff).
By the way I am not directing this at anyone in this thread in particular, it's just a general observation on society that when you spend money on certain things people will judge you even if you hardly spend anything on other things and don't spend more in total. But designer clothes, make-up etc seem to have a bad reputation or something.
Sorry for the long rant and please don't be mad at me, I respect everyone's opinions and I am glad we are having a discussion.
This got way too long, sorry!
She is clearly not rich and she has worked hard for the money she has and can spend it however she wants. It's not like it's being thrown at her, she has worked hard for the scholarships and created a youtube channel (which is time consuming and a proper job). What she has she has achieved on her own and when you have earned money you deserve to spend it however you want without receiving judgment from strangers.
The fact that you accuse her of not studying in Germany simply because it's free is also very judgmental. She has earned a scholarship that covers those fees so she is not paying them and why shouldn't she attend an elite university if she has the chance, it would be stupid to throw this opportunity away.
She has spoken many times about how she gets second-hand clothes and about how she doesn't drink and hardly ever parties so she obviously has more money left for other things, that doesn't make her rich. People are so quick to judge others. Other people her age go to parties every Friday and Saturday, buy several drinks etc. She doesn't do that so she has more money for other stuff.
I don't find it nice when people are so judgmental. I was poor as a student and worked my butt off to get through yet if you had looked at my instagram back then you would probably have thought that I was rich because I travelled to all kind of countries as a student. But I wasn't, I simply looked for all kinds of opportunities to go abroad (volunteering, scholarships, internships). I also hardly ever bought new clothes (I still don't, I have pullovers I bought over 7 years ago and just spend my money differently).
Yes, her step dad bought her lots of books as a special treat (for graduating, I believe, and once for her birthday). That doesn't change the fact that she is middle class? Middle class doesn't mean poor. The books were hardly more expensive than a phone or a laptop (which I have seen middle class kids get for their birthdays). I think some people here don't know what the middle class is? It doesn't mean that you can't afford anything but it is hardly being rich.
I don't even want to get into the political debate further because it isn't the topic of this thread but if you think that the German Green Party, for example, is without fault you should look up what they wanted their politics to be like in regards to children in the 80s (I won't go further into this because it is so disgusting) and they also got involved in wars (Iraq) in the past. I am not a huge fan of the CDU, don't get me wrong, but scandals, corruption etc. happen in all political parties. And no, the CDU is still not comparable to the Tories. But this isn't the right place for this debate.
Well, yes. No one is saying that her family is poor, they are middle class. But getting books as a graduation gift hardly means your family is rich.
When I try to remember what typical middle class gifts (birthdays, graduation etc.) would be where I live kids often get a laptop, a phone, several video games (not all of this but one of these three things). My best friend is working class and she often got several video games. Pretty sure the books cost much less.
Of course being middle class is something to be grateful for but I genuinely think some people here think that everyone who is not poor must be rich and that is simply not the case. When you can afford to buy your step-kid books for her graduation or birthday it means that you are financially stable but rich is a completely different thing. It's not like she got a car or a trip to the Maldives or a horse.
In general, people have different priorities and just because they aren't the same as the ones that are important to you doesn't mean they are wrong.
When you earn a middle class salary or grow up in a middle class household on a middle class salary you are middle class even if you decide to spend the money you have earned on second hand designer stuff or make-up. We all have different priorities and things that are important to us.
When I was a student I tried to go abroad as much as I could. I hardly ever bought clothes, pretty much never bought make-up (I had one mascara, one lipstick, one powder - all cheap), my phone was the oldest and second hand (got made fun of a lot, the phone, not me), had an 8 year old second hand laptop. But people don't see these things, they always want to judge you. I got judged for going abroad a lot (even though it was on scholarships, paid internships etc that I worked for) and maybe Elena gets judged on her designer wear or make-up (even though she doesn't spend money on parties, drinks, others stuff).
By the way I am not directing this at anyone in this thread in particular, it's just a general observation on society that when you spend money on certain things people will judge you even if you hardly spend anything on other things and don't spend more in total. But designer clothes, make-up etc seem to have a bad reputation or something.
Sorry for the long rant and please don't be mad at me, I respect everyone's opinions and I am glad we are having a discussion.
This got way too long, sorry!
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As opposed to what you're doing rn?
Sorry, not trying to start a fight, but I think I explained my viewpoints fairly well based on her content and never said any of what she did was bad.
I never claimed she was rich or hasn't worked hard?
I did not "accuse" her of anything. If I had said "she's such a rich kid why doesn't she just study back home in Germany like a normal person" *that would've been accusatory. I just said she could've studied in Germany basically for free, so she was in a privileged position being able to choose to go to Cambridge. I don't see how that's "accusing" her, especially since I never said she shouldn't have gone to Cambridge. I actually think it would've been stupid not to go if she had the means - which clearly she did. Her fees aren't covered entirely afaik, so yes, mom is paying for part of it at least. The fact that she/her family had the means to make her have that choice is the privilege I was talking about. Again, that's not a bad thing, never said it was! Just that realistically, plenty of people wouldn't have had that choice.
And that's great, I was talking about her values moreso than money though. I was saying that when you watch her content and see someone who owns several designer items (i.e. values designer brands over just functionality for example) that makes you think she's a certain type of person, so it's natural to assume she comes from money (even if she doesn't). You immediately jumped at someone saying "Have you even watched her videos" when they assumed she came from money. I was merely explaining where that assumption might come from (*especially* if you have watched some of her content and have seen the designer items she owns). And your upringing is often related to what you value - it doesn't always have to be but it's interesting that someone with a middle class upbringing grows to value brand names and designer items so much (or maybe that was always the case in her household, we don't know).
Not to mention second hand gucci bags are still a couple hundred (at least? idk designer prices lol) and her Chanel make up is hardly second hand. She can do what she wants with her money obviously, but like I said, it's a privilege to be able to prioritize your spending in that way. For most people not-partying doesn't pay for gucci bags though, even if they're second hand. Sooo many people her age don't party (especially in the past 2 years) and a lot of them can hardly afford rent, "other people party so they don't have more money for other stuff (like her)" feels very circumstantial (like you know someone where that is the case, so all people must not be able to afford (second hand) designer bags because they spend hundreds partying).
I never said anything about other parties and never claimed the Green Party didn't have similar issues (or any other party, why bring up specifically the Green Party)? I wasn't trying to give an overview of German politics, I was just pointing out that Merkel's refugee approach isn't a great argument as to why the CDU apparently are different from the Tories because I felt like that comment was a half-baked attempt at presenting them in a certain way that just doesn't reflect the majority of their viewpoints. And yes politicians in other parties are corrupt too, duh? but "other parties also bad" isn't an argument for "CDU not bad". And also even though scandals and corruption happen in all parties, we can't act like the CDU doesn't seem to have noticably many (compared to other parties).
Plus, for a lot of the examples (e.g. marriage equality and Selbstbestimmungsgesetz) the CDU did vote more conservatively, the Green Party (and some others) didn't. Actually for marriage equality the CDU was the *only* party in the Bundestag who voted against it iirc. So if we need to compare the two (you brought them up so I'm sticking with it) those are two examples of where the CDU would moreso align with tory views, the Green Party wouldn't. Just because there are a couple points where they don't align (refugees and EU being the major ones) doesn't mean they aren't in a similar space on the political spectrum and don't still share a lot of their views - especially views that differentiate them from other parties in their respective countries.
To illustrate real quick:
Sure, they're not in the exact same spot but especially compared to the other parties they're in a similar spot. For a one-sentence explanation whereabouts they are compared to UK Parties, I feel like that's close enough.
(not to claim politicalcompass.org as the ultimate best source, just an easy way to compare the two from a 30sec google search)
But feel free to offer a different quick explanation to where you'd put the CDU on the political compass in relation to UK parties/to explain to non-Germans? That's where this whole debate stemmed from after all.
Sorry to have brought this up again, just felt like it needed more context
(And I definitely am super intrigued what Elena's political views might be and to be able to properly talk about that we need to be on the same page about things like this!)
She has said herself that she is middle class. If you have any proof that she is not that would be a different issue but you don't. Therefore you are assuming things whereas I am simply defending her based on the facts we have. That is the difference.
She was in a privileged position due to her own hard work. Her fees are actually completely covered. She stated on instagram that her university owes her money and has to pay her back a certain amount because her scholarship covered a larger amount than the fees she had to pay. I don't know if you watched the video in which she lists all the things she did in high school but she tutored younger kids, was volunteering for years and did lots of other activities (I think about fifteen or so). She spent basically all of her time studying and helping others. She is not an ordinary person. I can't even understand how one could manage so much stuff.
Designer things are more sustainable and the opposite of fast fashion. She can't win with people. If she bought her stuff at Primark or Shein they would criticize her too.
Yes, as you said, they are not in the same spot exactly. That was my point.
Thanks for the interesting discussion!
I am actually curious where she will go to university in the autumn. I assume it will be in Germany this time.
She was in a privileged position due to her own hard work. Her fees are actually completely covered. She stated on instagram that her university owes her money and has to pay her back a certain amount because her scholarship covered a larger amount than the fees she had to pay. I don't know if you watched the video in which she lists all the things she did in high school but she tutored younger kids, was volunteering for years and did lots of other activities (I think about fifteen or so). She spent basically all of her time studying and helping others. She is not an ordinary person. I can't even understand how one could manage so much stuff.
Designer things are more sustainable and the opposite of fast fashion. She can't win with people. If she bought her stuff at Primark or Shein they would criticize her too.
Yes, as you said, they are not in the same spot exactly. That was my point.
Thanks for the interesting discussion!
I am actually curious where she will go to university in the autumn. I assume it will be in Germany this time.
I/my family would be considered upper middle class in my country yet I can't afford to buy chanel makeup. let alone an expensive bag.
why so defensive? it feels like you just created an account to pick a fight.
why so defensive? it feels like you just created an account to pick a fight.
I never said she wasn't middle class? I'm so confused what you're trying to say here? What am I assuming?
Her graduation ig post with her mom said her scholarships didn't cover everything, so at the beginning of her degree her mom said that she'd manage to pay for it somehow and she kept that promise. That's the info i was going off of.
I also never said she didn't work hard, she absolutely did. The fact of the matter is however, someone being able to devote all of their time to studying and volunteering is a privilege and not everyone who does as much as she does gets the recognition and opportunities she got. Once again though, she absolutely worked hard and deserved everything she got, I never said any differently.
...yes she is? she's not superhuman or anything... what a strange statement. She absolutely worked hard yes, but she also got lucky and has had certain privileges (and that's fine!!! good for her! it just doesn't make any sense for us to deny that she did!)
... Designer is not the opposite of fast fashion. I mean I guess in the sense that it lasts longer because it's (hopefully) higher quality and doesn't follow trend cycles as quickly as fast fashion does? And some brands are obviously better than others but luxury fashion isn't automatically sustainable or ethical just because it's more expensive? If her goal was sustainability, she could be buying actually sustainable brands (before you claim I am criticizing her for not buying sustainable brands: I am not. I am just saying that since you brought up sustainability, if sustainability was her goal there'd be better options).
I am not criticizing her for buying designer bags, I merely said it was interesting that she values brand names so much, and that she can obviously spend her money how she wants but it's still a privilege to be able to prioritize it the way she does. Where are you getting criticism from that? Feel free to let me know and I'll word it differently next time <3 x
No it wasn't, at least that's not what you communicated. Your point was that it was an unfair comparison because of how Merkel (and the CDU) dealt with the refugee crisis. I don't think the comparison was unfair because I think that one aspect does not negate the fact that in a majority of topics, the CDU and Tories have similar views an and because I think Merkel's management of the refugee crisis does not accurately represent the entire party, especially not as off late. CDU and Tories are in a similar spot and therefore comparable, especially in a one-sentence online forum answer where someone is trying to contextualize where on the political spectrum the CDU is (in relation to UK parties).
To me they are just not comparable at all, but I come from a family of refugees so this aspect isn't just one thing to me, it has a lot of meaning.
This is not a fight, it is a discussion, and I think xaannaa and I both found it interesting.
Whenever I talk to my British family about politics I say Tories for CDU and Labour for SPD. Obvi they’re not the same and don’t align 100% but when trying to paint a (political) picture I found this works best. Ain’t no one got the time to first have an in-depth explanation of every political party before coming to the actual story.
Sure, it works to explain something but it's still not really completely accurate as you have already said.
Back to Elena, I think it is pretty much confirmed now that she will study in Germany through her instagram.
Back to Elena, I think it is pretty much confirmed now that she will study in Germany through her instagram.
She has been asking about flats in Tübingen a while ago on her story iirc. So I'm guessing she's enrolled for their LL.M. program.
I just watched her latest video and it re-affirmed why I like her that much and also felt for her over the past couple of years. At the end of the day, she owes no one really an explanation or apology and putting her mental and physical health first should be applauded. She's definitely one of the more mature studytubers/ youtubers.
I agree, health is the most important thing and I hope she feels better soon and wish her all the best. I like her a lot and I want her to be happy and healthy.
I understand now why she let Youtube slacken I hope she feels better soon.
I hope she feels better soon.Haven't seen this one. Actually, at first I liked her content, although I am older than her. I thought she is driven by pure interest to academics and law in particular. Later I got disappointed: once she mentioned that she wants to get a Juris doctor degree in the US, but apparently she did not even know that in the US it is a 'basic' professional entry degree, not a 'doctoral' degree in a sense of Ph.D. Like, do you want to practice in the US? Also, although she mentions she is introverted and that is fine, but it looks like she is purely self-centred and detached from the real world. Any friends from Cambridge? There was a roommate, then she disappeared without a trace. Then this 'abroad' year that is not really abroad, while you miss the opportunity to continue with your class and graduate together (but who cares about social connections and human relationships?) It really looks like she expected to be on the top of the class but could not make it, so the 'exchange' and a master's at home (but I am sure, there are lots of brilliant kids at Tubingen as well, and the problem will not go anywhere - one needs to grow up and mature to deal with it). She has monetisized on the Cambridge brand though, yet maybe it could be better to get some friends instead. And I don't see any particular passion to law or academics from her, there was only passion for 'prestige'.
Tübingen is such an odd choice. It’s close to where she lives but other than that… there are much better unis in Germany/Europe. Especially for an LLM it does matter a lot where you do it.
I think her odd choice has something to do with her boyfriend. Imo she changed her plans a lot because of him...
Pretty much everyone who goes abroad doesn't graduate with their class. I know because I didn't and I can't think of anyone from my year who did. That doesn't mean you don't stay connected or that you can't stay friends. A year abroad is also expected by many employers in Germany these days, I don't know for sure what it is like in other places. But a year abroad opens many doors and is also a great experience. I learned a lot during mine and loved it. I would always recommend it as there are lots of scholarships that don't get used every year. I went on a scholarship too.
Obviously I don't know how close Elena still is to her friends from uni but I know that she did meet her roommate again because she shared it on instagram.
Tübingen is a good university and has a special programme for students who earned their undergraduate's degree abroad. She also earned a 2-1 which is good and with her degree being from Cambridge I don't doubt that she will have a great career.
The only thing I agree with is the boyfriend. He definitely seems to have a huge influence over her. Not exactly sure if it is for the better as I feel like he changed a good part of her personality but maybe it was just a part of her personality that she was hiding before? I can't judge this but I wish her happiness and hope everything goes well for them if that is what she wants and what makes her happy.
Also a 2:1 from Cambridge should get you into pretty much all postgraduate programmes in Cambridge and the rest of the UK (most of the rest of the world). Doesn't mean that you can't still get rejected as it also depends on internships, interviews etc. but grade-wise she's 100% fine. I don't think Tübingen was chosen because she had no other choice, I think it was a deliberate decision.
And usually you make friends from all over the world during a year abroad and lots of connections so it is pretty much the opposite of anti-social. It wasn't her fault the pandemic happened and her classes were done online.
Obviously I don't know how close Elena still is to her friends from uni but I know that she did meet her roommate again because she shared it on instagram.
Tübingen is a good university and has a special programme for students who earned their undergraduate's degree abroad. She also earned a 2-1 which is good and with her degree being from Cambridge I don't doubt that she will have a great career.
The only thing I agree with is the boyfriend. He definitely seems to have a huge influence over her. Not exactly sure if it is for the better as I feel like he changed a good part of her personality but maybe it was just a part of her personality that she was hiding before? I can't judge this but I wish her happiness and hope everything goes well for them if that is what she wants and what makes her happy.
Also a 2:1 from Cambridge should get you into pretty much all postgraduate programmes in Cambridge and the rest of the UK (most of the rest of the world). Doesn't mean that you can't still get rejected as it also depends on internships, interviews etc. but grade-wise she's 100% fine. I don't think Tübingen was chosen because she had no other choice, I think it was a deliberate decision.
And usually you make friends from all over the world during a year abroad and lots of connections so it is pretty much the opposite of anti-social. It wasn't her fault the pandemic happened and her classes were done online.
She said she only applied to Tübingen