COVID-19 vaccine #11 and general vaccine conversation

[Hot_Dogs_Or_Toes]

I don't see what there is to gain by downplaying long covid. It clearly exists.

I get that if a person doesn't know anyone with long covid then they're unlikely to be too concerned about it, but I don't understand why those people would want to act like it's not a thing?

I've found some people often have a hard time accepting conditions exist that you can't physically see. We see it all the time with people that have invisible disabilities who sometimes even get abused in the street for using disabled parking bays etc.

Long Covid most like falls in to your chronic pain/fatigue type conditions e.g. fibromyalgia, ME etc. Those conditions are met with skepticism by lots of people even though they are proven to exist.

 

[Ensay]

I've found some people often have a hard time accepting conditions exist that you can't physically see. We see it all the time with people that have invisible disabilities who sometimes even get abused in the street for using disabled parking bays etc.

Long Covid most like falls in to your chronic pain/fatigue type conditions e.g. fibromyalgia, ME etc. Those conditions are met with skepticism by lots of people even though they are proven to exist.

True! Some people are really scathing about fibromyalgia, especially as some celebs say they have it.

 

[StrawberryCream]

Some people have clearly never heard of the mental illness called hypochondria which millions have suffered from long before covid was around. I know someone who has it and she has herself and her kids in A&E constantly over the most minor things, always getting smears, blood tests, ecg’s done and since lateral flow test have been available she has tested daily for covid until she eventually got that positive test and now she obviously has long covid. Honestly it’s quite sad to see, people need proper treatment for having serious health anxiety it’s no way to live your life.

True! Some people are really scathing about fibromyalgia, especially as some celebs say they have it.

Mabye because it isn’t real.

 

[monga]

Doesn’t Derek Draper suffer from long covid .I don’t think people are in denial of it’s existence just that’s it’s not something that can be proven in mild form but the country could still be paying through the nose for people that choose to play the system for yet
another hard to diagnose illness.

 

[Onetwofour]

Some people have clearly never heard of the mental illness called hypochondria which millions have suffered from long before covid was around. I know someone who has it and she has herself and her kids in A&E constantly over the most minor things, always getting smears, blood tests, ecg’s done and since lateral flow test have been available she has tested daily for covid until she eventually got that positive test and now she obviously has long covid. Honestly it’s quite sad to see, people need proper treatment for having serious health anxiety it’s no way to live your life.


Mabye because it isn’t real.

That's your point of view. But why other people basing their knowledge on scientific studies on long covid and other post viral syndroms should be dismissed? It is a very different thing to go to the A&E constantly than being incapacited and not being able to do simple daily tasks. Even if that was just psychological as you are dismissing it, should we just ignore those people and look somewhere else? Or launch studies on their symptoms and see what could help them?

It doesn't involve you personally so I don't see what's the problem?

 

[StrawberryCream]

That's your point of view. But why other people basing their knowledge on scientific studies on long covid and other post viral syndroms should be dismissed? It is a very different thing to go to the A&E constantly than being incapacited and not being able to do simple daily tasks. Even if that was just psychological as you are dismissing it, should we just ignore those people and look somewhere else? Or launch studies on their symptoms and see what could help them?

It doesn't involve you personally so I don't see what's the problem?

It’s my opinion and guess what? It doesn’t have to be the same as yours

 

[Onetwofour]

It’s my opinion and guess what? It doesn’t have to be the same as yours

Sure thing but why does bother that people you don't know get help with their health problems? I mean I don't believe in homeopathy but I don't mind that people use it for themselves. It's the same.

 

[xyzcba]

For the record, I'm not saying long covid doesn't exist, but I find it very interesting though that serious reactions after vaccines are deemed by some as 'coincidence' but any after affects from Covid are taken deadly seriously.

Make it make sense!

 

[Onetwofour]

For the record, I'm not saying long covid doesn't exist, but I find it very interesting though that serious reactions after vaccines are deemed by some as 'coincidence' but any after affects from Covid are taken deadly seriously.

Make it make sense!

That's not true - it is known that myocarditis is a side effect from vaccines. No one denies it. But it has been studied and the chance of developping a myocarditis in teenagers between 10 and 19 after catching covid is higher than after the vaccine. The number of myocarditis in teenagers increased in 2020 - before they received any vaccine. But then it's a personal choice - I don't think anyone should be forced to be vaccinated.

Since evidences have been gathered about myocarditis after the vaccine, advices have been given on how to recognize the symptoms and check immediately with a doctor. Myocarditis normally don't have lomg term effects.

 

[Freedomofspeech89]

That's not true - it is known that myocarditis is a side effect from vaccines. No one denies it. But it has been studied and the chance of developping a myocarditis in teenagers between 10 and 19 after catching covid is higher than after the vaccine. The number of myocarditis in teenagers increased in 2020 - before they received any vaccine. But then it's a personal choice - I don't think anyone should be forced to be vaccinated.

Since evidences have been gathered about myocarditis after the vaccine, advices have been given on how to recognize the symptoms and check immediately with a doctor. Myocarditis normally don't have lomg term effects.

Have you got any evidence that Covid gives children myocarditis as I've never heard this before?
Also myocarditis does have serious long term health implications. It has a mortality rate of 20% in 6.5 years. There is also no remedy once the heart muscle is damaged and it will never be repaired.

 

[Brigitjonesbuttcheek]

My original post was this - “It isn’t a farce. There are so many individuals who have survived Covid-19 but have not recovered from it.”

I didn’t imply or make a comment about children and vaccines - I tend not to as it is a sensitive subject. No one really knows as there are millions around the world and reseaching on a mass scale is tough. Hence why there is such a thing as on going research - I already linked one for you as an example.

Plenty of people in real life suffering from it including myself.

But this whole thing started in relation to kids, my post was in relation to 0_24 year olds.

Are you under 24? If not what's your long covid got to do with a conversation about covid and kids

 

[StrawberryCream]

But this whole thing started in relation to kids, my post was in relation to 0_24 year olds.

Are you under 24? If not what's your long covid got to do with a conversation about covid and kids

I don’t believe @Prefrontalmedialcortex has ever said her exact age but she has said she is around the same age as me and I’m 27.

 

[Kim Mild]

Doesn’t Derek Draper suffer from long covid .I don’t think people are in denial of it’s existence just that’s it’s not something that can be proven in mild form but the country could still be paying through the nose for people that choose to play the system for yet
another hard to diagnose illness.

Derek Draper sadly needs a lot of care at home. His case is extreme .

 

[monga]

Derek Draper sadly needs a lot of care at home. His case is extreme .

Yes and many more like him

 

[Kim Mild]

Yes and many more like him

Even without long covid, his stay in hospital and being in a coma would mean he would need a lot of rehabilitation. In his case , age isn't as much of a factor, but in the case of the elderly., once they stop using their mobility, they often don't regain it.

 

[monga]

Even without long covid, his stay in hospital and being in a coma would mean he would need a lot of rehabilitation. In his case , age isn't as much of a factor, but in the case of the elderly., once they stop using their mobility, they often don't regain it.

Yes that's where nursing homes / care in the community factor ,there's no getting away from the fact the burden of disability will be great.

 

[Onetwofour]

Have you got any evidence that Covid gives children myocarditis as I've never heard this before?
Also myocarditis does have serious long term health implications. It has a mortality rate of 20% in 6.5 years. There is also no remedy once the heart muscle is damaged and it will never be repaired.

Yes. The current conscensus in the scientific community is that a teenagers have more risk to developp myocarditis from covid than from a Mrna vaccine. In both cases it's rare, but occurs more frequently after covid and can be more dammaging. The key point is that in both cases it happens rarely. I perfectly understand people can choose to not vaccinate their children because it can look frightening and people should do what feel the best for them.



Data:

Myocarditis is more common after covid-19 infection than vaccination

A preliminary study suggests that, among those most likely to develop myocarditis, the heart condition is six times more likely to occur after having covid-19 than after getting vaccinated

www.newscientist.com

"Researchers analysed the records of healthcare organisations that cover a fifth of the US population. They found that, during the first 12 months of the pandemic, males aged 12 to 17 were most likely to develop myocarditis within three months of catching covid-19, at a rate of about 450 cases per million infections.

This compares with 67 cases of myocarditis per million males of the same age following their second dose of a Pfizer/BioNTech or Moderna vaccine, according to figures from the US Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices. Researchers added together cases after first and second doses to reach a total rate of 77 cases per million in this male age group triggered by vaccination, a sixth that seen after infection."



- Covid-19 vaccine and myocarditis : https://www.thecardiologyadvisor.co...mrna-pfizer-moderna-adolescents-young-adults/

- Explanation of the origin of myocarditis from covid.: https://www.chop.edu/news/health-tip/myocarditis-and-covid-19-get-facts

"Myocarditis is an inflammation of the heart muscle. It can occur when a virus, such as the common cold, influenza (flu) or SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19) infects the body."

"Fortunately, current studies show that post-vaccine-related myocarditis is typically much more mild than classic myocarditis, with symptoms lasting for a shorter amount of time and usually resolving with minimal, if any, medical treatment."

"Though children and teens are fortunately less likely to experience significant heart disease as a result of COVID-19, they can absolutely still develop severe illness, including heart failure and more severe forms of myocarditis,” says Dr. Elias, noting that the biggest concern for children with COVID-19 is the development of multi-system inflammatory syndrome in children (MIS-C), a rare but very serious condition in which different parts of the body — including the heart — become inflamed. “Approximately 50% of patients with MIS-C have decreased heart function,” he say."


- Study on male teeenagers that developped a myocarditis after the vaccination: https://newsroom.heart.org/news/you...e-myocarditis-side-effect-of-covid-19-vaccine

 

[Prefrontalmedialcortex]

Have you got any evidence that Covid gives children myocarditis as I've never heard this before?
Also myocarditis does have serious long term health implications. It has a mortality rate of 20% in 6.5 years. There is also no remedy once the heart muscle is damaged and it will never be repaired.

Covid-19 can caused MIS-C in children which can lead to inflammation of parts of the body including the heart.

Multisystem Inflammatory Syndrome in Children Associated with Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome Coronavirus 2: A Systematic Review

To develop a more comprehensive description of multisystem inflammatory syndrome in children (MIS-C), a novel syndrome linked to severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2, by conducting a systematic analysis of studies from different settings that ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[StrawberryCream]

Riddle me this. If myocarditis is caused more by covid than the vaccines then why have there been basically no myocarditis google searches until MAY 2021, after the vaccine rollout !? Why pretty much no increase in 2020? That huge spike in google searches is from May last year.

 

[Prefrontalmedialcortex]

But this whole thing started in relation to kids, my post was in relation to 0_24 year olds.

Are you under 24? If not what's your long covid got to do with a conversation about covid and kids

You mentioned not knowing anyone with it, I simply responded that there are many with it, because I know from my own personal experience of having it and dealing with doctors who are seeing so many patients with it.

I don’t believe @Prefrontalmedialcortex has ever said her exact age but she has said she is around the same age as me and I’m 27.

I haven’t ever disclosed my age but I am not far off from your age.