Constance Marten and Mark Gordon Case #5

[Tofino]

Anyone have an idea of the sentence they will get?

It could be anything from 1 year up to life for GNM. It looks quite complex with determining culpability

My guess would be probably very high culpability (category A) and almost certainly cat B, so starting point would be 8 or 12 years, then prosecution and defence will put forward aggravating and mitigating factors.

Gross negligence manslaughter – Sentencing

www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk

 

[GM17]

“Constance, Arabella, whoever you are”

She gave a false name then

she sounds drunk! And daddy bear is just gross!!

 

[usefullyuseless]

Daily Mail reporting CM grew up here

Crichel House | Country House & Estate in Dorset

Crichel House is a large Georgian house and estate in the heart of Dorset in the UK, offering property, farming & conservation and a perfect filming location.

www.crichelhouse.co.uk

 

[Tofino]

These are the culpability factors. And of course they would need to be found guilty which is a risk they won’t.

 

[MrsDimSum]

she sounds drunk! And daddy bear is just gross!!

Daddy Bear - that man is no bleeping Daddy. He’s an animal I’m absolutely sickened and him munching down on crisps and questioning what the big deal about the baby was

 

[sebanna]

I think CM is confusing hiding a pregnancy with concealing a birth of a child being a crime. The defence are going to argue that they had six weeks to register the baby so may still have been planning to this and that the baby was well and so that was the reason they didn't seek medical care. Its obvious though that they had no intention of revealing the baby's birth.
---
You would have thought they would have just pleaded guilty to the charge of concealing a birth of a child it probably doesn't have a huge sentence attached to it.

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

Anyone have an idea of the sentence they will get?

I speculated 8 years based on the sentencing guidelines for causing or allowing the death of a child. https://tattle.life/threads/constance-marten-and-mark-gordon-case-4.43818/post-18170287

But… I’m leaning a bit more toward guilty for Gross Negligence Manslaughter now the trial is getting the detail out. I’m still at a similar number of years because I think it’ll be cat B severity and the sentences will all run concurrently. (@Dogmuck what’s your feeling?)

ETA sorry @Tofino just saw you’ve already linked this, I hadn’t finished reading when I posted

 

[casperon]

It could be anything from 1 year up to life for GNM. It looks quite complex with determining culpability

My guess would be probably very high culpability (category A) and almost certainly cat B, so starting point would be 8 or 12 years, then prosecution and defence will put forward aggravating and mitigating factors.

Gross negligence manslaughter – Sentencing

www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk

How does it work if there’s other charges also? I read online that sentences over 10 years for manslaughter are rare

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

The defence are going to argue that they had six weeks to register the baby so may still have been planning to this

They can’t, it was 9 weeks between her alleged Christmas Eve birth, and their arrest.

 

[Tofino]

How does it work if there’s other charges also? I read online that sentences over 10 years for manslaughter are rare

They will have separate sentences but they will serve them concurrently rather than consecutively.
---

I speculated 8 years based on the sentencing guidelines for causing or allowing the death of a child. https://tattle.life/threads/constance-marten-and-mark-gordon-case-4.43818/post-18170287

But… I’m leaning a bit more toward guilty for Gross Negligence Manslaughter now the trial is getting the detail out. I’m still at a similar number of years because I think it’ll be cat B severity and the sentences will all run concurrently. (@Dogmuck what’s your feeling?)

View attachment 2739938View attachment 2739940View attachment 2739941
View attachment 2739942View attachment 2739945

ETA sorry @Tofino just saw you’ve already linked this, I hadn’t finished reading when I posted

That’s ok, it’s interesting we came to a similar place. I wondered if Culpability A might be likely due to the length of time they were on the run for and persistent neglect (extreme factor) and also because there are a combination of B culpabilities that could be relevant.

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

They will have separate sentences but they will serve them concurrently rather than consecutively.
---


That’s ok, it’s interesting we came to a similar place. I wondered if Culpability A might be likely due to the length of time they were on the run for and persistent neglect (extreme factor) and also because there are a combination of B culpabilities that could be relevant.

The difficulty with persistent neglect is their story of the baby being dead when CM woke. If there’s no actual evidence that she was unwell / malnourished it could be hard.

Even if B I think the judge will go to the upper end of sentencing though.

I wonder if there are any previous convictions that aren’t public knowledge - neglect of another child / child cruelty is possible.

 

[Brandshinynew]

I don't know why I keep looking for some humanity in them when it's clear in these videos that they just don't give a tit.

I know, I've tried the same. There really is nothing there is there?

 

[lampielooloo]

They will have separate sentences but they will serve them concurrently rather than consecutively.
---


That’s ok, it’s interesting we came to a similar place. I wondered if Culpability A might be likely due to the length of time they were on the run for and persistent neglect (extreme factor) and also because there are a combination of B culpabilities that could be relevant.

Is it up to the judge to decide if the sentences run concurrently or consecutively do you know?

 

[Eltonjohnsflorist]

I know it’s not funny but I am laughing at her giving her fake name as arabella. Posh twit

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

I know it’s not funny but I am laughing at her giving her fake name as arabella. Posh twit

It’s hardly the first name you think of is it

 

[Tofino]

Is it up to the judge to decide if the sentences run concurrently or consecutively do you know?

Actually I don’t know how it’s decided someone should get consecutive sentencing but I’ve only ever seen concurrent sentences given even if there are multiple victims.

 

[InTheDollsHouse]

Is it up to the judge to decide if the sentences run concurrently or consecutively do you know?

They’ll be concurrent because they all relate to the same incident. I think Lucy Letby was able to be given consecutive because each charge was a different time/day/baby but because they were all whole life orders it didn’t matter anyway.

Totality explained – Sentencing

www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk

.

 

[Tofino]

Is it up to the judge to decide if the sentences run concurrently or consecutively do you know?

Some detail here. I think it would be concurrent in this case if found guilty of multiple charges because it’s the same set of facts?

Totality explained – Sentencing

www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk

 

[Pinkpenguinx]

I don't know why I keep looking for some humanity in them when it's clear in these videos that they just don't give a tit.

Me too.
She just seems incapable of any rational thought process. "you cant arrest someone for hiding a pregnancy", she is apparently well educated, and by this point the baby is dead. Also when the police officee is arresting her for child neglect she answers with " for doing what" - Not the words of an innocent person nor a grieving mother
---

Daily Mail reporting CM grew up here

Crichel House | Country House & Estate in Dorset

Crichel House is a large Georgian house and estate in the heart of Dorset in the UK, offering property, farming & conservation and a perfect filming location.

www.crichelhouse.co.uk

She did, I live in Dorset. I don't think its still in thier family though?

 

[MedeaWho]

She sounds drunk in the video BUT, if they were, this would have been reported in evidence by now? Two drunks camping with a baby mid winter sounds even worse.