Ukraine Russia War #7

[ordinaryjelly]

I'm just really struggling with this. And I'm a kid who grew up in Belfast. I know what a bomb was or an indiscriminate shooting was, I'm not some naive white Princess with no idea about the *other* world. I have visited Ukraine and have been to many of those town squares that we now see lit up by gun fire, those city buildings we now see destroyed, hosted many fun nights drinking Horilka with Ukrainians who had never had a good football team but embraced the EUROs with open arms, kind hearts and smiles, not Nazis. Seeing all those so needlessly destroyed weighs heavily on my heart. I cannot imagine the fear and terror of those same people having to hide under ground for endless hours knowing that their home and life was being destroyed above them by an enemy with no real cause.

I moved my family to Asia almost 20 years ago for my husband's job. We visited Bali as soon as the terror threat was lifted after the 2002 bombing because I believe wholly in speaking with our feet. We went into areas of Indonesia that were recently under attack so that we could spend money and help them rebuild. If it weren't for covid we would be living in India now, instead we are back in England.

We came back to a town that in 2018 was the victim of a Russian nerve agent attack. The after effects are still felt here today.

Russia has attacked here and given they saw no fault at all with releasing a nerve agent they developed into a sleepy English town known only for its Cathedral, the Magna Carta and proximity to Stonehenge. No one here knew a 'Russian traitor' was their neighbour, no one here knew that one day the KHB old guard would come knocking.

Do you really, truly know, absolutely that you don't have a former Russian spy living in your neighborhood?

And today. We have all watched the last week unfold. Watched a Ukrainian people unite and defend their homeland. We all know Putin assumed he was going to roll right through the country and take over Kyiv with little battle. Instead the Ukrainians heard a call to arms and have answered, with home made grenades and rifles they have never fired before. As one united people and good golly did they surprise us all. As Zelenskyy said in his recent video "They wanted us to be silent. But the whole world was behind us"

I have a photo of myself sat on these white steps:

But it isn't about me. Those buildings were bars, businesses, homes. And they are gone. Imagine what it would be like for your home to look like this?

And then this video :



And we have to wonder just what is coming next?

I believe our world from February 23rd 2022 is gone forever. This day was likely always coming.

But I'm done. Elon Musk is a prize prick, but I'm good for him to take a chance on sending me to Mars. I'll take my chances on life therec rather than live on the cess pit we have created here.

 

[indigoipswich]

I think that's definitely true, although I think that started in March 2020 and this is just a continuation of that change

True, although maybe not such a geo-political shift but definitely down as life changing.

 

[Dollenganger]

From the reading I’ve been doing, it seems that China is not emerging as being any kind of saviour for Russia’s economy.

Russia is getting frozen out. Putin’s one big problem is that he has underestimated the power of mobile phones, not being of a generation where they were a thing when he was in the KGB. He may be able to mess with internet but All Russians have mobile phones and their contacts in Ukraine have sent material via phones to them to show exactly what is happening in Ukraine.

 

[under the ivy]

I’m in the last year of my 20s and for the past few years I’ve lived through a pandemic and now seemingly a war in Europe. Call me naive, but I never thought I would experience any of those things. I hope I don’t sound self-indulgent but I’m sure many of us reading this thread feel the same way. I’m tired.

 

[monga]

Apparently Putins told Macron the worst is yet to come …He’ll never back down there’s no incentive to.

As it happened: Day eight of the invasion of Ukraine

Coverage of all today's developments in Ukraine where the Russian invasion is in its eighth day.

www.rte.ie

 

[howaboutnot]

From the reading I’ve been doing, it seems that China is not emerging as being any kind of saviour for Russia’s economy.

Russia is getting frozen out. Putin’s one big problem is that he has underestimated the power of mobile phones, not being of a generation where they were a thing when he was in the KGB. He may be able to mess with internet but All Russians have mobile phones and their contacts in Ukraine have sent material via phones to them to show exactly what is happening in Ukraine.

I agree to an extent. I think it depends on Russia's cyber capabilities. Can they take down power grids? What other critical infrastructure can they target? Can they hack international banks? Can they decrypt Ukrainian military conversations and move to intercept attacks/ resistance? If he's not got cyber 'troops' ready to roll he could lose.

 

[indigoipswich]

I’m in the last year of my 20s and for the past few years I’ve lived through a pandemic and now seemingly a war in Europe. Call me naive, but I never thought I would experience any of those things. I hope I don’t sound self-indulgent but I’m sure many of us reading this thread feel the same way. I’m tired.

I’m the same as you, I’m 31 and this feels momentous. I did history at university, specialising in Cold War politics, my IB history at school was two years on Russia starting from the bolsheviks, it feels a bit like a dream, a weird dream where we’re living the Cold War.

 

[Libbub]

I read somewhere and sure it was mentioned on TV as well that intelligence was coming out of Russia for many months before this that this was what he intended to do. Begs the question why weren't our governments more prepared.

 

[Mark81]

Honestly, we all knew (or should have known) this and the pandemic was highly likely/coming at some point. Plenty of warning signs over the years. But I think there's a shock that they are both here and have happened.

At the moment I feel like how I did at the start of the pandemic, but that eased so I'm just trying to keep faith that this pass to. The concern obviously is what the world looks like when we do

 

[knickerbocker glory]

Its breaking my heart to think of all the animals that will have been left behind too

 

[Meangirl815]

I believe our world from February 23rd 2022 is gone forever. This day was likely always coming.

I concur 100%
The phrase the new normal has been said way too much but i feel it belongs here.

This might not change the world but it will change Europe forever

 

[Mark81]

I wonder if Anonymous (or similar hackers) could hack Russias state tv and broadcast the real images and story to the public

 

[wafflesnwings]

I’m in the last year of my 20s and for the past few years I’ve lived through a pandemic and now seemingly a war in Europe. Call me naive, but I never thought I would experience any of those things. I hope I don’t sound self-indulgent but I’m sure many of us reading this thread feel the same way. I’m tired.

Hugs I know exactly what you mean. It's a 'once-in-a-lifetime-crisis' happening consecutively and it is a lot to bear (you don't sound self-indulgent or naive at all). I was watching a report just now about Indian students who had just arrived back to New Delhi and they were visibly traumatised and distressed that various Indian ministers didn't tell them to leave Kharkiv sooner - they had left on their own accord hours before the shelling, walked 35km, suffered violence from police, forced to pay bribes etc. I was desperately sad for them - how many innocent lives has this mad man interrupted, disrupted and ended in his quest for power? Makes me feel sick

 

[Mark81]

I concur 100%
The phrase the new normal has been said way too much but i feel it belongs here.

This might not change the world but it will change Europe forever

I think if Russia wins the sanctions will be a new normal and Russia will become a nation like North Korea. I'm not sure he will go as far as nato countries.

On a selfish front I'm thinking I'll never get to go to Moscow or St Petersberg in my lifetime. Both on bucket list but I think they will be cut off from the world for decades unless putin and his regime are overthrown

 

[Princesst]

I’m in the last year of my 20s and for the past few years I’ve lived through a pandemic and now seemingly a war in Europe. Call me naive, but I never thought I would experience any of those things. I hope I don’t sound self-indulgent but I’m sure many of us reading this thread feel the same way. I’m tired.

I couldn’t ageee more. I honestly just feel totally and utterly exhausted. I hate the thought of the unknown, living in fear every day of “what next” for the past 2 years and the total lack of control I have over my life and future. It’s hard to not feel this way.

On top of all that though is just pure, pit of the stomach sadness of what horrors happen in this world. I try to step away from the media a bit to breathe but it’s still happening in my mind even if I don’t see it.

 

[Yel]

Unless he's got a route out of this Putin won't back down.

I expect the only route he'd accept is recognizing Crimea and the two separatist regions (along with their huge oil and gas reserves) as Russian, guaranteeing no more NATO expansion and securing water into Crimea.

Thousands of lives would be saved if this did go through, and maybe Putin would be less likey to invade after this mess but it's beyond unpalatable giving over land to a war criminal.

 

[Penguinfeet]

I’m in the last year of my 20s and for the past few years I’ve lived through a pandemic and now seemingly a war in Europe. Call me naive, but I never thought I would experience any of those things. I hope I don’t sound self-indulgent but I’m sure many of us reading this thread feel the same way. I’m tired.

I'm in my early 40's and so I remember Northern Ireland and the end of the Cold War first time round but I was just a child then so I didn't grasp the gravity of the situation. Fast forward to 2020 and by goodness, I have aged in the last 2 years. I've needed to seek mental health help twice. I never thought I would see a pandemic, it was unthinkable and we were just beginning to see the light at the end of that tunnel and now we are facing this. I've sat and considered many times if I'm just weak and pathetic - after all, I'm not the one being bombed (at the moment anyway) - but I'm so tired. This last 2 years has just been so overwhelming, has shaken my entire existence and ha made me wonder (and not in a good way) what else is in store. I'm tired and just 'done'.

 

[ordinaryjelly]

I read somewhere and sure it was mentioned on TV as well that intelligence was coming out of Russia for many months before this that this was what he intended to do. Begs the question why weren't our governments more prepared.

Or maybe there are prepared and we do have special forces on the ground there?

It is weird that that 40 mile convoy is still 39 miles long and has moved 50cm forward in 3 days, and so few deaths have occurred.

I am certain we are getting shown a cleverly edited version of the truth, as with anything.

 

[howaboutnot]

Its breaking my heart to think of all the animals that will have been left behind too

My puppers can't even cope with fireworks. It's heart breaking to imagine all the animals who're terrified from rocket explosions and gunfire

 

[under the ivy]

An interesting perspective…