Savanna Brockhill & Frankie Smith #11

[Gossngiggles]

I hope they take as long as they need to reach the verdict they feel is right. I don’t want them to rush unless they are 100% sure.
We can make our own judgement from what we have read in the transcripts(I certainly have) but there may be things we aren’t privy too and I and also seeing the videos and images and actually witnessing the evidence first hand is a totally different experience to reading it. Seeing the demeanour of them etc.

 

[rainbowtapirs]

I’m still trying to get my head around how ambiguous the instruction to figure out what a “reasonable person ought to have recognised and foreseen, but also factor in FS’s IQ and circumstances” …like, a reasonable person would’ve seen this coming from 500 miles away, but maybe FS genuinely couldn’t because of her IQ, and the fact that she’s not a reasonable person through no fault of her own? I don’t think that’ll ever make sense to me, and if I was on the jury I’d be deeply confused.

 

[Chunkeylaydee]

Do they just go back to the holding cells now and wait to see if the jury come back today. Do you think it will also be a 4:30pm finish and then back to it tomorrow at 10:30am if they haven't decided anything today.

When I was on a jury, we deliberated for over an hour and it was after 6pm before we were released. Both defendants were in the cells downstairs and were sentenced right away. Police were present in the verdict part and were security while we left the building.

 

[AdelesEarring]

I feel a little bit sick wondering what the outcome will be. I really do feel for FS family, especially those who clearly adored Star and also FS at one point.

I agree. They’ve lost FS as well as Star.

 

[Tots]

I think SB guilty of murder, minimum 25 years

I hope FS is found not guilty on both charges. I think the jury will find her not guilty of murder but possibly guilty of allowing though I think the judge would give a very short Sentence and with time already served would be released soon. Is a suspended sentence allowed on a causing or allowing charge?

I really feel for the Jury

 

[Cocoloco818]

I know if I was on the jury I’d be pushing not guilty for FS on both charges and there’d be nothing they could do to change my mind so if they all have conflicting views I reckon we’ll be waiting a very long time

 

[Stiltoncheese]

I also wonder what FS is thinking and feeling right now. If she was genuinely unaware of what SB was doing, and not involved or aware of what happened in the final assault (which is what I believe) and putting aside all the cruelty stuff for a minute, then this whole trial must have been so eye opening and awful. Like she has had to accept and hear and see all the awful things that her supposed loving partner did to her child and now know it led to her daughter's eventual death. Her head must be mashed and she won't have had access to proper support/counselling to process it all whilst on remand.

 

[rosesviolets]

I know if I was on the jury I’d be pushing not guilty for FS on both charges and there’d be nothing they could do to change my mind so if they all have conflicting views I reckon we’ll be waiting a very long time

Likewise. Nothing would convince me FS is not guilty of allowing. So hung jury? Unless they are all of the same view

 

[PinkMariner]

I guess the individual Jurors themselves as individuals play a huge part.
I am a people pleaser, a bit submissive, not terribly argumentative or forthright unless I am 100% confident of my knowledge of a situation.
So if I was the only person in a group of 11 who thought one way, I’m pretty sure I’d go along with them because that’s the kind of person I am.
Id like to think it would be different for something quite so important but anxiety and self confidence sometimes don’t allow it!

 

[Kinney]

For me: definitely murder for SB. No doubt in my mind at all. I hope she gets 25+ years and I hope she gets an awful time from the other inmates. I don’t think she can be rehabilitated,
I think she’s a danger to society.

FS, I‘ve gone back and forth on many times. A big part of me feels that she should be found not guilty on all charges. But I have to be honest and admit that I still have some niggling doubts that make me consider a causing/ allowing verdict.

It’s very complex and like I’ve said, I don’t envy that jury one bit.

 

[Walnutss]

Somebody on the previous thread said they didn't think DV was a reason for neglecting your children, I disagree. My mum had two children to her first husband, she got married at 17, her husband started beating her while she was pregnant with my older brother who was born when she had just turned 18. My mum was neglectful with my older siblings, she couldn't always afford to feed them, clothe them, they didn't always have hot water or heating. She was brutalised by her first husband and didn't really have a lot of emotional capacity left for her children. She wasn't cruel but they were emotionally neglected and physically neglected. However, when she was finally able to leave him, she met my dad and had my brother and me and we were cherished, along with her first two children, she finally had the emotional capacity to fully love, cherish and support her children. My mum is of average intelligence and is not abnormally compliant but because or her abuse she wasn't able to be the mother she had the potential to be. DV affects so much of a family's existence.

But like you said she wasn't cruel frankie was, ur mum and her are completely different. Frankie was a victim of DV but it doesn't make you hit your kids

 

[bringingdownthebs]

I know if I was on the jury I’d be pushing not guilty for FS on both charges and there’d be nothing they could do to change my mind so if they all have conflicting views I reckon we’ll be waiting a very long time

I reckon they will have conflicting views on FS.

 

[Vivski11]

YS, if I remember correctly often replied that she ‘couldn’t remember’ on the stand. There was a lot she couldn’t remember. Some people do have poor memories.

Especially when they are big drinkers!

 

[Hereforagoodtime85]

I’m busy with work today, but have just seen that the jury have been sent out. Eesh. What an oddly intense feeling for people I don’t know!

 

[Cocoloco818]

I guess the individual Jurors themselves as individuals play a huge part.
I am a people pleaser, a bit submissive, not terribly argumentative or forthright unless I am 100% confident of my knowledge of a situation.
So if I was the only person in a group of 11 who thought one way, I’m pretty sure I’d go along with them because that’s the kind of person I am.
Id like to think it would be different for something quite so important but anxiety and self confidence sometimes don’t allow it!

Yeah I totally get that, I can be like that with some things but it’s generally when I don’t particularly care or like you said I’m not 100% sure then I’ll let them have it, but in this instance I wouldn’t budge.

 

[elikayute]

For me: definitely murder for SB. No doubt in my mind at all. I hope she gets 25+ years and I hope she gets an awful time from the other inmates. I don’t think she can be rehabilitated,
I think she’s a danger to society.

FS, I‘ve gone back and forth on many times. A big part of me feels that she should be found not guilty on all charges. But I have to be honest and admit that I still have some niggling doubts that make me consider a causing/ allowing verdict.

It’s very complex and like I’ve said, I don’t envy that jury one bit.

I have doubts about her innocence, certainly, but I can’t get anything close to beyond reasonable doubt on her guilt.

 

[marypoppins21]

Just nipped on to the trusting evil & justice for star group don’t know why I do it to myself?!

 

[rainbowtapirs]

Dave’s making live blogs of murder trials sound like a shop assistant suggesting you try a different type of gourmet cheese because your cheese of choice is out of stock.

 

[Stiltoncheese]

I sometimes think that it's more reasonable and normal and probably indicates more truthful if someone on the stand replies "I don't know" to questions about more generic mundane stuff from 18 months ago.

When people have a specific answer for every little detail then to me it implies they have had to think about it and may not be telling the truth always.

I can't remember stuff my husband said to me about nights out from 18 months ago even when there were some really memorable events that evening. No-ones memory is usually that good.

SB had an answer for everything. FS and YS saying not remembering is more realistic to me

 

[RedRosed]

Just nipped on to the trusting evil & justice for star group don’t know why I do it to myself?!

What did you see? I’m on FB but not a member of those groups.