rainbowtapirs
Chatty Member
Dave’s making live blogs of murder trials sound like a shop assistant suggesting you try a different type of gourmet cheese because your cheese of choice is out of stock.
- Notice
Stiltoncheese
Chatty Member
The jury have been very attentive in this case, with all the questions they have asked. I have good faith in them that they will consider the evidence fairly and without prejudice which is all you can ask for really.
Lizzie Mintdrop
VIP Member
Somebody on the previous thread said they didn't think DV was a reason for neglecting your children, I disagree. My mum had two children to her first husband, she got married at 17, her husband started beating her while she was pregnant with my older brother who was born when she had just turned 18. My mum was neglectful with my older siblings, she couldn't always afford to feed them, clothe them, they didn't always have hot water or heating. She was brutalised by her first husband and didn't really have a lot of emotional capacity left for her children. She wasn't cruel but they were emotionally neglected and physically neglected. However, when she was finally able to leave him, she met my dad and had my brother and me and we were cherished, along with her first two children, she finally had the emotional capacity to fully love, cherish and support her children. My mum is of average intelligence and is not abnormally compliant but because or her abuse she wasn't able to be the mother she had the potential to be. DV affects so much of a family's existence.
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StrawberrySeed
VIP Member
Just following on from what other people would decide if they were on the jury, I would decide:
SB - guilty of murder
FS - guilty of allowing the death
I think I am in the minority on here regarding FS but, as most of you know, I have been posting on these threads since the beginning and I haven’t just jumped into the discussion both feet first after getting riled up on Facebook!
I completely understand the point of view of those that would decide FS is not guilty of either charge. Some of you have worked in related fields and / or experienced abuse from a narcissist so you may see things differently. I expect, like many of you here, that the jury will be conflicted regarding FS and could be deliberating for quite some time. I think the jury will be unanimous regarding SB.
PS Has anyone set up a ‘Pinstripe Suit Fans’ or similar thread ready for ‘afterwards’? I have never started a thread on here and feel a bit nervous doing so! I think we need one.
Also, sorry if this has already been discussed, if 6 jury members say FS is not guilty and the other 5 say she is, then what? Say people won’t budge and change their mind? What if it ends up that just 1 member thinks differently to the rest, does the verdict go with the majority of 10? How low can the majority be for a verdict to be made? I have never done jury service and so I have no idea how things work behind the scenes. The whole process is very interesting and I feel I have learned such a lot about court proceedings through this thread. Thank you to everyone for bringing your vast array of knowledge and experiences to the thread. I am sure we have all learned something new.
SB - guilty of murder
FS - guilty of allowing the death
I think I am in the minority on here regarding FS but, as most of you know, I have been posting on these threads since the beginning and I haven’t just jumped into the discussion both feet first after getting riled up on Facebook!
I completely understand the point of view of those that would decide FS is not guilty of either charge. Some of you have worked in related fields and / or experienced abuse from a narcissist so you may see things differently. I expect, like many of you here, that the jury will be conflicted regarding FS and could be deliberating for quite some time. I think the jury will be unanimous regarding SB.
PS Has anyone set up a ‘Pinstripe Suit Fans’ or similar thread ready for ‘afterwards’? I have never started a thread on here and feel a bit nervous doing so! I think we need one.
Also, sorry if this has already been discussed, if 6 jury members say FS is not guilty and the other 5 say she is, then what? Say people won’t budge and change their mind? What if it ends up that just 1 member thinks differently to the rest, does the verdict go with the majority of 10? How low can the majority be for a verdict to be made? I have never done jury service and so I have no idea how things work behind the scenes. The whole process is very interesting and I feel I have learned such a lot about court proceedings through this thread. Thank you to everyone for bringing your vast array of knowledge and experiences to the thread. I am sure we have all learned something new.
marypoppins21
Well-known member
I’ve not shared this before as it’s not necessary. However Im going to share, just because it is possible SB could well of been left alone to talk to FS . My 8 month old granddaughter passed away in her sleep to sudden infant death syndrome. It’s my husbands daughter. My step daughter whom I’ve known since she was 11 & having a child when 20. So we were a close knit unit. We as grandparents went to the hospital knowing our little one had passed. We were ushered straight Into a family room for all relatives. Nurses & police present. The police kept reassuring us it was normal they were there & apologised if it felt intrusive but they have to ask questions / view the home, see the child’s red book etc. we were never left alone but my stepdaughter & her partner smoked at that time & were left to have a cigarette alone on more than 2 occasions. There are tea & coffee facilities also cold water available in fact the nurses would of got us anything. The hospital did the tests needed & asked mum & dad if they wanted to see baby. They did. We couldn’t let them do it on their own, sadly it’s the most horrific thing ever. And the last time I saw my granddaughter. If SB did put a coffee cup on the trolley I can’t believe it!!!!! You just don’t!!
LittleMy
VIP Member
If they’re still deliberating tomorrow afternoon (most likely) I’ll be wrapping up my husband’s Christmas presents to keep myself busy.Now I’m wishing we had live updates on jury deliberation, like starting points, 7 for, 4 againstand watching it get closer over time.
I need to find something else to do.
Stiltoncheese
Chatty Member
As a social worker, I think that opens up a huge can of worms and not one I agree with. You'd be surprised at how many malicious referrals we get in social services with people trying to score points and cause trouble and if people suddenly have rights to remove when legally they have no parental responsibility then it's moving into dodgy territory in my opinion. Whilst there will always be these really high profile cases with absolutely harrowing details and deaths in the news, it is never reported on just how many children are saved and protected each year, as that doesn't generate clicks on the newspapers. Social workers have a hard task with a government who chronically underfunds the services we need. But we do protect and save a lot of children. Social workers are either labelled as lazy/workshy/untrained/unskilled and my grandmother could do a better job, or we are labelled child snatchers who break up families. Lose-lose sadly.
Edited to add - I'm an adults social worker not children's but I have worked in children's services and it's a hard, and often thankless task. Also, only judges and/or police have the legal power to remove children. Not social workers. We just gather the evidence and present to the court and if the evidence isn't there, or the family have taken steps to evade or hide it (which is often the case), it can be impossible to prove to the judge that it is needed.
So i have just this minute found out that i went to primary school and was facebook friends (before i fucked it off) with the lass who was SB witness. Chloe she is called.
She is an interesting person in the sense she is not a traveler at all but tries to act like one, she favours the old 5 finger discount, was one of those people who wouldnt work and then would brag about all the xmas and birthday gifts she got her kids. I wouldnt trust her as far as i could throw her tbh. I remember from her facebook activity she was always concerning herself in other peoples business, airing ALL of her dirty laundry on facebook (i havent talked to her since i was 10 or 11 but i knew every little detail about her relationship and the breakup). I also remember her trying to act all friendly with Tyson Fury's wife Paris, and the Radford Family. It was proper cringe, she thought she was best mates with them all! She probably has done this to try and get some fame and to seem important in Morecambe tbh.
Its a small bloody world.
She is an interesting person in the sense she is not a traveler at all but tries to act like one, she favours the old 5 finger discount, was one of those people who wouldnt work and then would brag about all the xmas and birthday gifts she got her kids. I wouldnt trust her as far as i could throw her tbh. I remember from her facebook activity she was always concerning herself in other peoples business, airing ALL of her dirty laundry on facebook (i havent talked to her since i was 10 or 11 but i knew every little detail about her relationship and the breakup). I also remember her trying to act all friendly with Tyson Fury's wife Paris, and the Radford Family. It was proper cringe, she thought she was best mates with them all! She probably has done this to try and get some fame and to seem important in Morecambe tbh.
Its a small bloody world.
elikayute
Chatty Member
not cliquey, just not wanting it overrun with people who haven’t bothered to read the details and just bang on about baby killers needing to be hanged etc. There’s been over 10,000 posts so far, mostly calm, just hoping it stays that way after the verdict.
Theres a difference between those who are unsure, ask questions, are open to listening, and those who just want to bash the keyboard with their rage.
rainbowtapirs
Chatty Member
Quick question: who on earth thinks of a murdered infant they never met whilst they clean their naked body? Worse still, who publicly announces it via Facebook?
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rainbowtapirs
Chatty Member
I still want to know more about the bloody wall licking incident. It sounds too weird to be made up, but too weird to have happened. Then again, when you’re not the #2 but the #1 psycho, I guess it’s more plausible.
Someone on there has just called SB a predictor I think she meant predator
justheretoread99
VIP Member
I wish I never looked on the facebook groups but I’m in too deep now. Think I know every drag artist and local of the Sun pub and every female that’s been banged up in HMP Styal and their extended familiesOh, thank you. I’m not on Facebook so I can’t see what everyone else is seeing. But it doesn’t seem like I’m missing anything coherent or factual judging from those screenshots
Prissypaws
Chatty Member
“Prosecutor Alistair MacDonald QC - who had to leave after his closing speech due to other commitments - is back with us today, which is a nice surprise!”
I think AM must really want to see justice in this case. God bless ya AM!
I think AM must really want to see justice in this case. God bless ya AM!
Wackie Jeaver
VIP Member
Whatever Paul likes, he was probably mistaken.
Hereforagoodtime85
Chatty Member
I’m going to add Savanna’s dancing to the list of things Paul doesn’t like..
elikayute
Chatty Member
That sounds dangerous if you’ve got toxic parents. Although tbh if you’ve got serious safeguarding concerns I can’t see anyone penalising you for taking a child to be seen. You couldn’t force your way into a house though.