Old Hollywood gossip & stories

[FenellaTheWitch]

Has anyone seen the That's Entertainment films? Absolutely brilliant and Gene and Fred host the second one together.

I may need to rewatch them as I haven't seen them in a long time.

 

[shellie]

I read a rumour once that James Dean didn't die in that crash at 24 but was horribly disfigured and went into hiding. I was fascinated by him at the time.

There have been a few stories over the years about him faking his death. One of the more recent claims was he fled to Canada where he was able to live for years without anyone knowing who he was until he died in 2018 at the age of 95 in a...yep, you guessed it car crash.

The Reelz show Autopsy: The Last Hours Of (which is really good) did an episode on him and the Medical Examiner who hosts the show got a hold of the autopsy and police reports. From what he read, he thinks James did survive the initial crash but was knocked unconscious. He said if it had happened today, the first thing the emergency services would have done was put his neck in a brace and he would likely have survived. Obviously, things were different back then so there was no support for his neck and things were made worse when the ambulance got into an accident with another car. The ME thought there was a huge chance the jolt from the accident and the delay from swapping info with the other driver was what actually killed him and not the initial crash.
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Oh how I adored Gene as a child. I'd watch Singin' in the Rain on VHS every single day. Debbie Reynolds and Cyd too Cyd in that green dress. Wowser.

Debbie Reynolds once said in an interview he was horrible to her during filming. As she said, she only had a few months to learn what Gene and Donald had been doing for years but he never gave her any allowances. He seemingly went to rehearsals and criticized everything she did, no matter how small and never once encouraged her. The dance for Good Morning took over fifteen hours to get right and by the end, she had to be helped back to her dressing room as her feet were bleeding and raw and needed a few days off to recuperate. What made it worse for her was he picked the very first take to put in the film so she felt she went through all that pain for nothing.

One time she had enough and escaped into a rehearsal room on the MGM set where they were filming and broke down. Fred Astaire who happened to be passing found her and after she told him what was wrong, he comforted her and said from what she told him, she was doing fine and offered to help her practice the routines.

Later in life, she seemed to relent and say that what he did made her a better performer. He himself also admitted he wasn't nice to her at the time and was surprised she still spoke to him.

 

[LaBlonde]

Debbie Reynolds once said in an interview he was horrible to her during filming. As she said, she only had a few months to learn what Gene and Donald had been doing for years but he never gave her any allowances. He seemingly went to rehearsals and criticized everything she did, no matter how small and never once encouraged her. The dance for Good Morning took over fifteen hours to get right and by the end, she had to be helped back to her dressing room as her feet were bleeding and raw and needed a few days off to recuperate. What made it worse for her was he picked the very first take to put in the film so she felt she went through all that pain for nothing.

One time she had enough and escaped into a rehearsal room on the MGM set where they were filming and broke down. Fred Astaire who happened to be passing found her and after she told him what was wrong, he comforted her and said from what she told him, she was doing fine and offered to help her practice the routines.

Later in life, she seemed to relent and say that what he did made her a better performer. He himself also admitted he wasn't nice to her at the time and was surprised she still spoke to him.

gene k wanted to cast cyd (a much more accomplished dancer) in her part but the studio wanted debbie - as one of their young ingenues but not on the same dancing level as him or donald. the whole broadway ballet sequence was apparently a way to appease him on that. he long admitted that he took the frustration he should have directed at the studio out on her.

they did seem to both be able to see the other point of view as they got older though. it ultimately wasn’t her fault that the studio wanted her, but equally i get that he was annoyed by that and so refused to dance down or adapt any of the routines for her.

the story about him french kissing her in the shot at the end of the movie when she didn’t want to is very ick though and, as much as i love him, i side eye him for that.

 

[iLoveMeSomeCanoles]

Not really about Hollywood stars, but thought this was really interesting about the techniques used for visual effects and how they were done using make-up and filters;

 

[Ginnyjo]

OH thats triggered something in my brain, wasn't the original wolf man films effects achieved like this?

 

[shellie]

gene k wanted to cast cyd (a much more accomplished dancer) in her part but the studio wanted debbie - as one of their young ingenues but not on the same dancing level as him or donald. the whole broadway ballet sequence was apparently a way to appease him on that. he long admitted that he took the frustration he should have directed at the studio out on her.

they did seem to both be able to see the other point of view as they got older though. it ultimately wasn’t her fault that the studio wanted her, but equally i get that he was annoyed by that and so refused to dance down or adapt any of the routines for her.

the story about him french kissing her in the shot at the end of the movie when she didn’t want to is very ick though and, as much as i love him, i side eye him for that.

I read about that. She said she was this innocent kid who had never been kissed and here was this older man sticking his tongue down her throat and that it felt like an assault at the time.

The Bright Lights documentary she did with Carrie was really good but so sad at the same time. You knew she didn't have long left with how frail she was and you felt so much for Carrie who knew what was coming but could do nothing about it. It was a surprise that Carrie went first but not so much Debbie passed so soon after...there was a huge bond between them and even Todd said what got him through it was he knew they would still be together. It's such a shame what happened with him and Carrie's daughter Billie. I know we don't know the full story but I think it is BS she accused Todd of continually using them to get attention when the only reason she has a career now is because she was Carrie's daughter and she pulled strings for her.

 

[Jelly Bean]

I watched an old Parky interview with David Niven tonight from 1975. As usual a wonderful storyteller but he also said something very interesting about Hjordis - interesting in light of what we now know about her.
Parky asked about strains on the marriage being a Hollywood couple.
DN said Hjordis was an incredibly beautiful woman and always used to being the centre of attention. She found it difficult walking into a room, with a less attractive man (in her eyes), and then nobody looking at her but at him, as he was the Hollywood star. She resented it deeply and left him for four months because of it.
He told this anecdote quite sadly though charmingly. And knowing what a horror she was it almost seems, with hindsight, a bit of a cry for help.

 

[thegirlscout]

I'm going for 6,7 &14.

5, 8 and 14. God knows what sort of film it would turn out like!
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I love Gene. I think he had far more charisma and pizazz than Astaire.

Remember when 58 year Astaire old was cast as 28 year old Audrey Hepburn’s love interest in Funny Face?!
The film was rather terrible (sorry Audrey, you’re still my favourite) and I think the lack of charisma and very obvious age difference added to it. I adored the opening pink song and fashion but the rest was…just no.

 

[Dollylovesshoes]

Hi just thought I’d post this from talking pics.

My Man Godfrey (1936) starring William Powell, Carol Lombard & Alice Brady on Sunday 17th September 3.10pm
Supporters of Film & TV history.

As we enjoy the final weeks of summer, we’re already looking forward to autumn and giving you even more excuses to settle down on the sofa with TPTV! We’ll soon be bringing you brand new episodes of both Maigret starring Bruno Cremer and Crown Court (we’ll have more news on both soon!) and we also have an unmissable schedule for you this week.

If it’s classic TV you’re looking for then 1969’s The Gold Robbers continues on Monday at 9pm, with a tense episode featuring Joss Ackland, Sally Thomsett, Althea Charlton and Peter Madden that finds Detective Cradock (Peter Vaughan) beginning his unenviable task of discovering how the robbery was executed.

We also have another unmissable episode of Thunderbirds on Saturday at 3pm in which Lady Penelope (Sylvia Anderson) heads to Paris and runs into trouble with Dr Godber when she investigates an inventor's disappearance.

The brand new series of Saddle Up! continues on Wednesday from 3pm, as our very own cowboy James Stephens introduces Sam Fuller's 1957 Western Forty Guns at 3.05pm starring Barbara Stanwyck, Barry Sullivan and Dean Jagger, followed by episode two of Western series Johnny Ringo at 4.50pm starring Don Durant.

We continue our new series of The Cellar Club on Friday from 9pm, in which our glamorous host Caroline Munro introduces 1987 cult favourite The Stepfather at 9.05pm and the aptly named Cellar Dweller (1988) at 11.05pm!

We have a trio of terrific film premieres on Monday starting with 1940’s Danger Ahead at 3pm, an action-packed adventure featuring Renfrew of The Royal Mounties (James Newill) chasing a gang of gold thieves, before Barbara Stanwyck portrays a wife who’ll do whatever it takes to push her detective husband (Sterling Hayden) to the top in the 1957 noir Crime of Passion at 7pm. Then in the spine-chilling Day of the Nightmare (1965) at 10.05pm, an artist's wife (Beverly Bain) unravels a haunting murder mystery.

Catch 1938’s Bulldog Drummond in Africa on Wednesday 6.35pm, as our hero, played once more by John Howard, embarks on an action-packed quest to rescue a kidnapped colonel. Then there's a gripping tale waiting in 1946’s The Voice Within on Thursday at 8am, where one wrong move leads to unimaginable consequences.

We return to World War Two for 1967’s Beach Red on Saturday at 4.55pm, a hard-edged story of the men - including Rip Torn and Burr DeBenning - involved in a battle for control of an island, then Joseph Cotten and Rhonda Fleming star in 1957 crime drama The Killer is Loose at 9.30pm, in which a vengeful convict breaks free to settle a personal score.

On Sunday 17th September we have one of the most acclaimed films of 1936, Gregory La Cava’s My Man Godfrey at 3.10pm, a heartwarming tale of an eccentric socialite (Carol Lombard) and her peculiar new butler (William Powell).

Fans of our weekly schedule of rarely seen shorts can look forward to TEN brand new to TPTV films this week, including six new Look at Lifes from the 1950s and 1960s that take us from boys clubs to slimming clubs and onto a look at the Customs and Excise service and a day in the life of a bobby on the beat. There are also new Cinebox Memories including Terrie Lomas and The Fortunes.

The scorned lover of a married clergyman is accused of blackmail after threatening to expose their affair in Crown Court on Monday, Thursday and Friday at 2.30pm, then there’s more criminal activity on Tuesday with new episodes of Colonel March of Scotland Yard at 6pm, Scotland Yard at 6.30pm and Dick Barton: Special Agent at 7.40pm. In Maigret at 9.05pm, the Inspector is called to Charenton, Lock No. 1, where Émile Ducrau had been stabbed and thrown into the canal.

Mrs Potts has taken a fall but perhaps it was more a cry for help in Together on Wednesday at 10am, then in For the Love of Ada at 6pm, Ada and Walter decide that they should elope to Yorkshire and get married there.

A seemingly respectable old school couple are arrested for running a brothel in Rumpole of the Bailey on Thursday at 9pm (see our TPTV Encore section below for details of exclusive introductions from creator John Mortimore!), then John Ireland takes us back to America in the blazing 1930s in Time to Remember on Friday at 6pm, a time of prohibition, mobsters and hoodlums, the President versus Al Capone and the Lindbergh kidnapping.

In The Buccaneers on Saturday at 11.30am, the trader's estate is in jeopardy as a lawyer arrives at the colony in search of the last remaining heir. Edward Woodward’s son Peter is one of the stars of In Suspicious Circumstances at 7pm as we bring you another double bill of true crime stories from 1996, An Evil Business and Dearest Pet. This week a suspicious death comes between Queen Elizabeth I and a courtier, and the lover of an heiress is found dead.

Then on Sunday 17th September we go back to 1963 for The Larkins at 2.30pm and find the Major behind on his rent as Alf’s teenage tearaway nephew comes to stay. Then we jump forward to 1976 as Dick Hills hears true stories about working and holidaying overseas from Jimmy Jewel, Jimmy Logan and Barbara Windsor in Tell Me Another at 6pm.

 

[thegirlscout]

Reading a book about Grace Kelly and I hate to say it but…

I don’t blame her, some of her men were might fine! And she got David Niven and I love him. But she had like 3 boyfriends on the go at once! And she had an affair with Bing Crosby when his wife was dying of cancer.
Just to reassure you I think all the men were hoes too. And it was worse as they were married and much older. I just didn’t realise how deep in the hoe depths Grace was.

 

[shellie]

Reading a book about Grace Kelly and I hate to say it but…
View attachment 2439614
I don’t blame her, some of her men were might fine! And she got David Niven and I love him. But she had like 3 boyfriends on the go at once! And she had an affair with Bing Crosby when his wife was dying of cancer.
Just to reassure you I think all the men were hoes too. And it was worse as they were married and much older. I just didn’t realise how deep in the hoe depths Grace was.

I think it's generally thought now that since many of the men were older than her, she was looking for a father figure. Her dad...her whole family were dickheads towards her and even when she became famous and won the Oscar, she still wasn't good enough for them. I think she hoped getting to where she did would have them see her differently but nope and she eventually got sick of Hollywood.

 

[thegirlscout]

I think it's generally thought now that since many of the men were older than her, she was looking for a father figure. Her dad...her whole family were dickheads towards her and even when she became famous and won the Oscar, she still wasn't good enough for them. I think she hoped getting to where she did would have them see her differently but nope and she eventually got sick of Hollywood.

Oh her parents were quite cruel to her. In one respect she had a miserable time with them because they were never pleased with her and encouraged her marrying Rainier because of what it could do for them. It sounds like she went ahead and married Rainier as a way to escape them and have her own independence.
I did have to giggle when in the book it said due to the stress of organising the engagement between her and Rainier she ended up falling back into the arms of a former lover!
Rainier was deeply in love with Gisèle Pascal but tests showed she was unable to have an heir which was important for Monaco. However she did have a child in 1962 with her husband Raymond Pellegrin. I wonder what sort of ‘tests’ these doctors did to check she was fertile and how they got it wrong.

 

[shellie]

Oh her parents were quite cruel to her. In one respect she had a miserable time with them because they were never pleased with her and encouraged her marrying Rainier because of what it could do for them. It sounds like she went ahead and married Rainier as a way to escape them and have her own independence.
I did have to giggle when in the book it said due to the stress of organising the engagement between her and Rainier she ended up falling back into the arms of a former lover!
Rainier was deeply in love with Gisèle Pascal but tests showed she was unable to have an heir which was important for Monaco. However she did have a child in 1962 with her husband Raymond Pellegrin. I wonder what sort of ‘tests’ these doctors did to check she was fertile and how they got it wrong.

They both saw other people but were discreet about it. The story is that even after they were married, she had flings with Sinatra and David Niven among others. I don't think they were ever in love with each but I do think they came to care for each other...his reactions at her funeral and refusal to remarry were proof of that.

I'm guessing the reason Gisèle was passed over was Aristotle Onassis, who owned a lot of Monaco at the time and had a huge say, wanted someone famous to bring back the glamour to the place. A few actresses were seemingly auditioned including Marilyn who supposedly failed by calling him Reindeer. Grace 'met' him at Cannes, everything worked out and they got engaged.

 

[thegirlscout]

They both saw other people but were discreet about it. The story is that even after they were married, she had flings with Sinatra and David Niven among others. I don't think they were ever in love with each but I do think they came to care for each other...his reactions at her funeral and refusal to remarry were proof of that.

I'm guessing the reason Gisèle was passed over was Aristotle Onassis, who owned a lot of Monaco at the time and had a huge say, wanted someone famous to bring back the glamour to the place. A few actresses were seemingly auditioned including Marilyn who supposedly failed by calling him Reindeer. Grace 'met' him at Cannes, everything worked out and they got engaged.

Yes she dated Sinatra for a bit after Oleg Cassini I believe (?). The book mentions years after Grace and Rainier married Rainier had David Niven for dinner and asked him who was his best conquest in Hollywood. He started to say Grace but saw Rainier’s face so quickly said Gracie Fields.
I didn’t know that about Aristotle - in the book I’m reading it doesn’t mention him apart from saying that he bought out a large percentage of Société des bains de mer de Monaco which he would come to regret but didn’t say anything else apart from that (so far, I’ve got to the part where Grace goes on the SS Constitution).
It’s interesting because the way the author James Spada describes Grace’s other lovers you can sort of understand why she fell for them (handsome, witty, charismatic, much older) but Rainier just seems like such an outlier. I wouldn’t describe him as handsome (he wasn’t ugly but compared to Grace’s other men he wasn’t as handsome), he seemed a bit more awkward. I also have a hard time believing someone like Rainier believed that Grace was a virgin when it was well known she had dalliances as it made big news in Hollywood.
Granted this is just one book so I’m not taking it as gospel! Would like to read more about Rainier pre Grace, I wonder if there is an autobiography for him about that time. He joined the French Free Army and was frustrated by his Grandfather not sacking the Prime Minister who was a nazi sympathiser. He received the Croix de Guerre bronze star and given rank of Legion of Honour. I don’t know any other heirs who witnessed action first hand, though many could have and I’m not giving them credit!

 

[Blurp]

I watched an old Parky interview with David Niven tonight from 1975. As usual a wonderful storyteller but he also said something very interesting about Hjordis - interesting in light of what we now know about her.
Parky asked about strains on the marriage being a Hollywood couple.
DN said Hjordis was an incredibly beautiful woman and always used to being the centre of attention. She found it difficult walking into a room, with a less attractive man (in her eyes), and then nobody looking at her but at him, as he was the Hollywood star. She resented it deeply and left him for four months because of it.
He told this anecdote quite sadly though charmingly. And knowing what a horror she was it almost seems, with hindsight, a bit of a cry for help.

I wonder if she would have turned into Alice Evans should he have left her.
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Would like to read more about Rainier pre Grace, I wonder if there is an autobiography for him about that time. He joined the French Free Army and was frustrated by his Grandfather not sacking the Prime Minister who was a nazi sympathiser. He received the Croix de Guerre bronze star and given rank of Legion of Honour. I don’t know any other heirs who witnessed action first hand, though many could have and I’m not giving them credit!

Grand Duke Jean of Luxembourg, when heir and in exile during WW2, joined the British Army, passed out of Sandhurst and was commissioned into the Irish Guards. He took part in the Normandy landings as well as the liberation of Luxembourg. Until 2000 he was the Colonel of the Irish Guards, like Kate today. I think he and the late QE were the last two rulers to serve in WW2.

 

[thegirlscout]

I wonder if she would have turned into Alice Evans should he have left her.
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Grand Duke Jean of Luxembourg, when heir and in exile during WW2, joined the British Army, passed out of Sandhurst and was commissioned into the Irish Guards. He took part in the Normandy landings as well as the liberation of Luxembourg. Until 2000 he was the Colonel of the Irish Guards, like Kate today. I think he and the late QE were the last two rulers to serve in WW2.

Oh cool, I didn’t know about this! He took part in the Normandy landings as well. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Mark81]

A Gene Kelly musical I've not seen

 

[shellie]

Yes she dated Sinatra for a bit after Oleg Cassini I believe (?). The book mentions years after Grace and Rainier married Rainier had David Niven for dinner and asked him who was his best conquest in Hollywood. He started to say Grace but saw Rainier’s face so quickly said Gracie Fields.
I didn’t know that about Aristotle - in the book I’m reading it doesn’t mention him apart from saying that he bought out a large percentage of Société des bains de mer de Monaco which he would come to regret but didn’t say anything else apart from that (so far, I’ve got to the part where Grace goes on the SS Constitution).
It’s interesting because the way the author James Spada describes Grace’s other lovers you can sort of understand why she fell for them (handsome, witty, charismatic, much older) but Rainier just seems like such an outlier. I wouldn’t describe him as handsome (he wasn’t ugly but compared to Grace’s other men he wasn’t as handsome), he seemed a bit more awkward. I also have a hard time believing someone like Rainier believed that Grace was a virgin when it was well known she had dalliances as it made big news in Hollywood.
Granted this is just one book so I’m not taking it as gospel! Would like to read more about Rainier pre Grace, I wonder if there is an autobiography for him about that time. He joined the French Free Army and was frustrated by his Grandfather not sacking the Prime Minister who was a nazi sympathiser. He received the Croix de Guerre bronze star and given rank of Legion of Honour. I don’t know any other heirs who witnessed action first hand, though many could have and I’m not giving them credit!

The story about Onassis was in the Robert Evans book The Fat Lady Sang. Onassis partnered with a consortium who were operating the Monte Carlo Casino and wanted to turn it from a gambling den to a money machine. According to Evans, Onassis told Rainier, “Get off your royal ass and find yourself a bride. The right bride could do for Monaco’s tourism what the coronation of Queen Elizabeth did for Great Britain.”

Aristotle Onassis-Orchestrated Fairytale Wedding of Grace Kelly, Prince Ranier - The Pappas Post

Grace Kelly’s fairytale wedding to Prince Rainier III in 1956 was simply a glitzy business deal masterminded by Aristotle Onassis to transform impoverished

pappaspost.com

 

[thegirlscout]

Reading a book about Grace Kelly and I hate to say it but…
View attachment 2439614
I don’t blame her, some of her men were might fine! And she got David Niven and I love him. But she had like 3 boyfriends on the go at once! And she had an affair with Bing Crosby when his wife was dying of cancer.
Just to reassure you I think all the men were hoes too. And it was worse as they were married and much older. I just didn’t realise how deep in the hoe depths Grace was.

Just finished the book I was reading (it’s Grace Kelly: The Secret Life of a Princess by James Spada) and I have to say I’m happy Grace had some fun in her hoe period because her life was absolutely miserable. Her parents were the worst, she and Rainier should not have married, she was isolated in a country where the locals didn’t think she was good enough, she struggled with French so much that she never became 100% fluent, she had no friends near her, was totally lonely, her husband was having affairs towards the end and she turned to alcohol. She found some relief in her charity work, her flower pressing artwork and her poetry tours but that’s a small consolation for such a dreadful time. And she died when she was only 52! She never got a chance to have happiness. Gosh, it’s actually quite sad. I know she was blessed with beauty and born into wealth but it wasn’t a fairytale like most presumed.
Here’s a photo of Grace in 1978 at an art exhibition showcasing her flower pressing art. I get from the book that this was such a godsend for her and she throughly enjoyed herself when she was creating her pieces so I wanted to finish this post on a happy note.

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The story about Onassis was in the Robert Evans book The Fat Lady Sang. Onassis partnered with a consortium who were operating the Monte Carlo Casino and wanted to turn it from a gambling den to a money machine. According to Evans, Onassis told Rainier, “Get off your royal ass and find yourself a bride. The right bride could do for Monaco’s tourism what the coronation of Queen Elizabeth did for Great Britain.”

Aristotle Onassis-Orchestrated Fairytale Wedding of Grace Kelly, Prince Ranier - The Pappas Post

Grace Kelly’s fairytale wedding to Prince Rainier III in 1956 was simply a glitzy business deal masterminded by Aristotle Onassis to transform impoverished

pappaspost.com

After finishing the book it did mention about the power Onassis had over Monaco and how him and Rainier butted heads. Just looked up the book you mentioned - will add it to my reading list

 

[Mark81]