It’s just been balls up after balls up hasnt it, the scary thing is, people vote them in
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to add to that - migration into the U.K. will add more pressure onto existing infrastructure.
im not anti-immigration by any means but the government havent funded public services. Everything, from schools to homes to healthcare has been cut to the bone.
inviting more people into the U.K. when there isn’t existing infrastructure, is a short term solution to a long term problem, and might exacerbate the already tense public feeling towards migration.
by all means, invite in foreign workers but that isn’t enough. They can and should be investing in people in the U.K.
it was a political decision to remove funding though. It was a political decision to cut public spending so drastically, and it was a political decision based on ideaology NOT economics.
and where are the people who made those ideological deceisions? They are multi millionaires who have directly profited and benefitted from their decisions. Keep that in mind next time you read a tabloid coming to their defence and for the love of god, keep it in mind when you next have to vote.
I’m always amaze that high cost areas like London and the south east have any public sector workers at all
Ive done the sums and I just can’t make it add up…
£33k after tax and student loan is £2163 per month…I can easily see how rent and childcare would eat that up straight away, that’s before car finance or railcard, car tax, insurance, food, clothes, phone, council tax…etc etc etc
Ive done the sums and I just can’t make it add up…
£33k after tax and student loan is £2163 per month…I can easily see how rent and childcare would eat that up straight away, that’s before car finance or railcard, car tax, insurance, food, clothes, phone, council tax…etc etc etc
So average nhs nurses start of on 27k and go up to 33k after yearly appraisals and I think it’s 4/5 years before they’re on top of band
London nurses are I believe are on about extra 4K a year compared to rest of country due to high cost area supplements
Can I just ask why people choose to go into nursing these days? Genuine question. It is well known that nurses and all health care professionals are underpaid and underworked. Is there a higher calling? Honestly I would rather work in Aldi for more money and less stress
Sometimes it’s personal reasons . For me I spent 6 months in iccu when I was a teenager so for me it was given something back and now I’m a ward manager of iccu because of Patient insight
wheni have student nurses and I ask them , it ranges from caring for relatives so they know what to do that as a job and go it back ,from Being a patient themselves , interests in specific fields , being that person to speak up for vulnerable people when they havenobody
Which Aldi job is more money than nurses get though unless it’s management?
Aldi pays £11 an hour. 40 hours a week is 21k a year. Managers start on around £50k. Ok 21k is less than a nurse but also working less hours for quite a bit less stress I would imagine (not saying customer service roles are not stressful, I couldn’t deal with customers being holes)
Thank you for your answer, that makes sense. A girl I know was a young caree for her dad and ended up going and working as a care assistant for a while
Tonnes of people drop out of the degree or very early in their careers, so although generally degrees fill up there aren't enough people who want to and go ahead with qualifying and practicing. I trained when things were markedly better, I loved my job, still love nursing and it breaks my heart I am no longer working as a nurse, but the conditions are just tit. I wouldn't advise even the most passionate person to bother nowadays. Generally people want to make a difference, think ah it won't be that bad in reality, or think they can change things. Of course some do love their jobs, but that's ever decreasing. Aesthetics, agency, private sector in insurance or whatever, jobs across other gov agencies or completely different careers that utilise the degree level study and transferable skills are better than the NHS.
It's not limited to nursing, midwifery is facing such an astronomical crisis it's scary. For every 30 who start the degree only one will be working as a midwife in the NHS after a few years. Care is absolutely suffering and most trusts have already shut down certain services like home births, MLUs and even still it's on the verge of collapse. I'd be genuinely scared to give birth now.
For those saying about the barriers to entry for a degree, most trusts are offering apprentiships now, you still (rightly) have to meet the same standards and achieve the degree but you can gain a place alongside working without the need for certain things such as x ucas points. Maths GCSE is usually non negotiable though people can retake for free iirc if they don't have quals over a certain level. There are a lot of calculations required in nursing and no point getting people onto the degree if they'll fail on that crucial element.
NAs are the government's big plan to plug the gaps in nursing, less qualified, lower paid but probably similar responsibilities if they have their way- carrying on the theme of exploiting staff.
I completely agree. How many in the current government and House of Lords have interests in private health care companies?
There are deliberate ploys to underfund the NHS and turn those who are outside the NHS against it so that more can be privatised. A large number of Tory MPs have interests in nursing agencies which charge huge amounts to the tax payer.
Christ I bleeping hate this corrupt Tory government with all of my being. (Took Christmas Day off from my hatred but it’s after midnight now so back to hating them. Love tattlers though)
Just found this thread and have to say that I have never earned anywhere near take home pay of £2,200 nor needed to pay £1,600 a month rent/mortgage. I live within my means, have never (luckily) gone without or been in debt. This nurse needs to consider her finances.
There have been some very good points made in this thread that I'm still reading through. Having spent 11 years working in the NHS I think the problems need resolving with management. There are far too many Chiefs earning large cat salaries, who can't sort out issues.
Nurses chose their profession as they are caring people who want to help others. But there are far too many "occasional" days taken training, thereby reducing staff on wards. Whilst I agree with keeping up with procedures, etc, whenever I spoke to the nurses they felt there were some who were almost bullied into undertaking more training, yet others had their training cancelled at the last minute due to staff shortages.
Overtime is crazy and contradictory. Perhaps a nurse can clarify if this still happens. Contracted work is one thing, then extra hours are worked when short staffed, up to a maximum of ?? Hours a week. However, many nurses also belong to agencies (called Bank Nurses) and also work additional hours through bank nursing - which costs the NHS even more money.
If the simple fundamentals were dealt with correctly then it would encourage more people to join the profession, retain staffing levels, keep staff happy, not overworked, whilst saving money and using it to pay nurses more.
exactly, and people read the tabloid press about how the NHS is in a mess and take it at face value instead of critically thinking, who is benefitting from peddling this?
the NHS is a huge beast, huge. And inevitably some aspects will be poor or not fit for purpose or mismanaged. But this will be exacerbated by indirect attacks on it - cuts to peripheral services for example, means the NHS picks up the bill, it has a domino effect and it becomes poor value for money.
Example? paying nurses/doctors badly will give them incentives to go locum, which means the NHS ends up paying more for their staff, when a decent contract in the first please would avoid this.
properly funded social care, means that people won’t have to wait forever for a home assessment which means they don’t clog up the expensive hospital beds etc etc.
so the NHS is set up to fail and then demonised in the tabloids all while some unscrupulous characters get ready to exploit the situation through their own agencies and investments.
the tabloid press has a LOT to answer for in how it misleads the masses and there’s an element of personal responsibility to question what you read, and read from a variety of sources.
…and most insulting of all is that they think we are stupid and don’t realise all of this…
I think 1600 a month rent could easily be reached if you worked for a London or South East hospital and maybe had 2 children and not unreasonably wanted them to have a bedroom each
Bank and Agency are different
AfC contract is 37.5 hours a week…some might want to work more for their own hospital…this would be through the Bank (a kind of internal agency)…some might want to work elsewhere for more money..this would be an Agency usually, unless they were in other Trust banks but honestly why would they when Agency pays so much better
I agree they deserve better conditions but striking is NOT the answer as far as I am concerned.
What would you suggest as an alternative?
My mortgage is £950 but houses on my street rent for £1,600. It's a 3 bed house in Norfolk, so not London or SE. Market rents are insane, there are a lot of people paying crazy rents and nurses obviously need to live near to their hospitals.
I don’t really know but putting patients at risk isn’t right. It all needs a huge overhaul but I don’t know what the answer is.
Patients are already at risk every day by nurse understaffing. Which will only get worse if nursing pay and conditions do not improve
Do nurses get London weighting? If not then they definitely should.
£2,200 in London would be eaten by rent and childcare but I'm assuming that not all nurses are single and therefore there is another income knocking about.
£2,200 in London would be eaten by rent and childcare but I'm assuming that not all nurses are single and therefore there is another income knocking about.
I’m pretty sure someone in this thread said they do get it