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Pra09

Member
Unrelated - but I saw Kate McCann about a year ago. She was shopping in an Oliver Bonas with what must’ve been the younger daughter, one of the twins. I didn’t want to stare because she (the daughter) seemed pretty quiet/shy.

They seemed to be a pretty close, normal mother daughter.
Ever since then I’ve been convinced Kate didn’t do anything to harm Maddie. I work with a lot of criminals and I get an “off vibe” with wronguns. I didn’t get that from Kate. I got vibes of a mother who very very much loved her child.
 
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Bitofthebubbly

VIP Member
The McCann's have released a statement saying there has been no letter sent to them or their people, the press have made it up.
I honestly hate the British press. I’m no fan of the McCanns but reading you were apparently sent a letter about the death of your child would be a mind fuck for anyone. Where/who do they get this stuff from?
 
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RedMagnolia

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If Madeleine was abducted and murdered back in 2007, by this German paedophile, and this is proved beyond all doubt, then there will be a lot of people who owe the McCann parents a massive apology - myself included.
 
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Apple In My Pie

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Same! If there was something that proved it was him, 110%, i would owe them a huge apology and will gladly hold my hands up and say I was wrong.

I think I said this before, and I hope it comes across the way I intend it, on a very simple level, I hope it was them. Not because of hatred for them, or to say "I told you so" but because, I dont even want to consider what happened that little girl if some sick bastard took her. Her fear, pain and suffering is too much to think about.
I hope it was a case of, they just gave her too much sedative, she fell asleep and the little angel simply never woke up.
This is my view. A lot of people seem to paint the McCanns as monsters. I don’t think that at all. They left their kids alone and that‘s wrong, but not monstrous, not like Brueckner. From what i can see, their involvement in her death either comes from sedative or an accident that was covered up. I really don’t think they’d intentionally harm any one of their children. Should it come out that it wasn’t them, my heart would break for that little girl and the pain and terror she would have gone through. I said the same thing as you - I really hope she died from sedatives or accidentally, because then she would at least have passed on knowing she was loved and had been enjoying her holiday with her family.
 
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Apple In My Pie

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I'd have thought it far easier to explain an accidental death than making up some convoluted tale/ involving others about her mysterious and sudden disappearance?
I will warn you that there is an essay ahead 😂

It is convoluted, I will hold my hands up to also thinking that. I don’t think it’s very cut and dry. I don’t for instance believe everyone has been paid off to keep quiet. I think that’s far fetched because (as people have shown above) - where does it stop?
It is far easier to say oh yes she’s been abducted. It seems suddenly very clear cut. Which is why I remain on the fence. However I do think it is equally convoluted to say that she was abducted:

- in a room with very little of her dna inside
- in a room where there was no dna or evidence from the guy himself
- where he most likely waltzed up through the open patio doors

I know a few posters up thread have mentioned that the dna collected was inconclusive. But I still can’t get my head around that? Where are her fingerprints, footprints, saliva, hair?

She was in that apartment for a week. Why was everything obtained, not solidly conclusive? I’m not saying I want proper gory blood spatter - but she was in that apartment, living alongside her family, for a week. There would have been something somewhere, surely? Not even on the bedding she was snatched from? I mean, the police found blood spatter from the little boy that was there just before them, but Gerry had to get a pillow from home that had Maddie’s DNA on it for reference? Her clothes and soft toys all brimming potentially with evidence (remember, Kate said Cuddle Cat was sat ‘on a ledge’ leading her to believe of Madeleine’s abduction - they would have had evidence of someone else in the room with her tossing the toy away at the least) - had been washed. So did the abductor sit and launder the toy too? Not in much of a hurry! (I jest)

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MADELEINES_DNA.htm - DNA from Madeleine McCann came from the reference pillow, reported as also coming from behind the sofa and in the boot of the hire car that the McCanns hired after her disappearance. Hairs and cloth were obtained from the apartment but didn’t come from Madeleine.
If there wasn’t - reports said only Kate’s fingerprints were lifted from the ‘jemmied‘ windows for instance - are we to expect that he sat there, took time to scrub that apartment inch by inch to cover his tracks, before making off with Madeleine? At the risk of sounding like captain obvious surely taking the time to do that would have cut him very fine in terms of being caught!
Having no DNA from the man himself, believable perhaps - probably wearing gloves, perhaps a mask. But no footprints? Shoeprints at the very least? The floor of the kids’ bedroom looks like it’s tiled so fresh shoe prints could have been lifted maybe?
And then the point of entry. Which has been thrown into question by the McCanns themselves. Was it through the jemmied window or the patio doors? Established he just sauntered in through the unlocked patio doors and made off with her. Then, how did she not wake? Start screaming bloody murder? She, compared to her younger siblings, wasn’t a fantastic sleeper. Of course an adult would be able to muffle her cries, but surely not to the point of silence? A statement from Mrs Fenn mentioned she was able to hear a child crying, but no one hears this abduction happening or some sort of scuffle at the very least? She doesn’t cry out, scream, he doesn’t shout at her to shut her up? No one sees him on his way out, presuming he went the way he came, no one sees his van? Wasn’t it so that the nearby area was very narrow - surely someone would have seen him, even if that isn’t necessarily a member of the Tapas 7 or the McCanns.

I’m not disbelieving you here - I want to believe! - it’s just that I can’t get my head around the abduction story. There are so many unanswered questions to it IMO. Doubtlessly some of it will come from my own personal misunderstanding - some of it may very well come from the beginnings of the investigation wherein people were in and out of the crime scene and elements such as pillows and duvets weren’t obtained by the PJ.
But surely without any fingerprints or footprints from either Madeleine OR a mystery abductor - the only conclusive evidence of an abduction is that she had gone, and perhaps that the McCanns had given him a timeframe if they weren’t actually checking. Perhaps, they’d made it easier still for him, unwittingly so, by sedating Madeleine. But of course it’s all hearsay!
I would be very happy if it were laid out as to how exactly it was done. Maybe it’s just me - too young and naive to think of such things going on in the world.
I suppose the truth of it is that they weren’t checking on the kids as often as they claimed, and that possibly he had been planning it over the course of the week, hence the meticulousness. And the small errors, like allowing for so many to be in and out of the crime scene rather than cordoning it off.

I don’t expect you to read all of this - the long and short of it being I have questions about whether she was abducted and questions as to whether it was a covered up accidental death! Nothing seems to fit perfectly. I suppose now we just wait on Brueckner and what the evidence is should it ever come to light. 🤷🏻‍♀️🙈
 
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Notothefakes

VIP Member
How do they find suspects 13 years after it’s happened. It always amazes me. I just hope they find out what happened.
 
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leon19

Well-known member
I used to think she was abducted. Now after watching the documentary and things I have read I'm almost sure her parents killed her. Probably accidental. I'm split between sedating the children or one of them lashing out and hitting her. I think its so odd she was checking the twins breathing all night. Why an earth if one of your children was supposedly abducted would you even think to be checking the breathing of your other kids if you hadnt given them anything. The dogs hit on the back of the sofa? Alot of sofas are hollow at the bottom. A lot of people say well where could they have hidden her body that was never found in a place they didn't know. I think the most obvious place would be the sea. Body's don't always wash up. And they decompose alot quicker in warmer water. There's way too many coincidences and weird things for it not to be her parents
 
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Bitofthebubbly

VIP Member
I know it’s already been said but how funny is it that those dogs Eddie & Keela were considered incredibly reliable before going to apartment 5a. Then suddenly they weren’t reliable at all 🤔
 
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leoladyxo

VIP Member
Here's what was said about him, I left out the interview with the McCanns and other descriptions of what has been discussed here many times...

The BKA describes him as a psychopath with paedophile tendencies. He grew up in a foster home. In a chat protocol of 2013 he talks about his innermost wishes. Capturing a young girl and abusing her for days.

A family from Saxony-Anhalt wants to know whether the suspect has anything to do with the disappearance of their 5 year old daughter Inga who disappeared in 2015.

The suspect is in prison for child pornography and child abuse.

The two cases he is currently connected to have some parallels. Both girls were tiny, blonde and of a similar age. Both were alone for only a short period of time. Both vanished without a trace.

The criminal analyst says a big part of the motif is power.

The suspect lived in Portugal for years, his house is close to the hotel (2.5km, 5 mins by car) and he raped an old woman nearby.

The suspect earned money as a waiter, handyman and drug dealer.

In his house there’s a beam to which they claim he tied a girl and forced her to perform oral sex.

He was very mobile, broke into holiday apartments, stole petrol.

The criminal analyst says he probably broke into the apartment (close to the street, convenient) to steal sth and the abduction was a crime of opportunity.

A mobile phone that almost certainly belonged to the suspect was used during the time of Maddie’s disappearance. The day after the kidnapping the suspect deregisters his car.

The rape case with the old woman was unsolved till last year. The suspect came past her house on his way to the beach. He used a scimitar and an iron rod It took 14 years to solve this, the police found a hair on a duvet.

The criminal analyst says it’s about power so kids and an elderly woman are both weak and therefore a target. The suspect acted in his comfort zone, near where he lived.

2007 the suspect moves back to Germany. In Augsburg he lives in an RV or sleeps in the attic of a friend’s house. He’s on the road a lot and deals with drugs.

He moves to Hanover and then to Braunschweig where he opens a kiosk. He’s selling meat that he stole in supermarkets in the area. People describe him as captivating and dominant. He has a girlfriend who is 16 years younger than him.

He did not treat women well, if they did not do what he wanted, he beat and even strangled them.

While he was in Portugal he had a lot of cash from a break-in. He bought an old factory near Magdeburg from that money. He also potentially drove a dark transporter van, there is no image of this van though.

In 2015 there was a collision with that dark van at a motorway service station in Germany, police was not involved. The next day 70km from there little Inga disappeared from a secluded group of houses (therapy centrum, her family was visiting another family) in a forest. Coincidence? Authorities are looking into this again now.

Witnesses saw a dark blue van that little Inga might have climbed into. The suspect’s dark van has never been seen.

2 months after Inga’s disappearance Braunschweig police sent a dossier to the Stendal police that include the suspect’s name.

Chat protocol talking about wanting to abuse a little one, documenting the abuse but also disposing of the evidence. And he wants deeds not words.

The suspect is in prison for drug dealing.
This gave me chills. Even if they find that he didn’t kidnap Madeleine, he deserves to be in prison for a long, long time.
 
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Here's what was said about him, I left out the interview with the McCanns and other descriptions of what has been discussed here many times...

The BKA describes him as a psychopath with paedophile tendencies. He grew up in a foster home. In a chat protocol of 2013 he talks about his innermost wishes. Capturing a young girl and abusing her for days.

A family from Saxony-Anhalt wants to know whether the suspect has anything to do with the disappearance of their 5 year old daughter Inga who disappeared in 2015.

The suspect is in prison for child pornography and child abuse.

The two cases he is currently connected to have some parallels. Both girls were tiny, blonde and of a similar age. Both were alone for only a short period of time. Both vanished without a trace.

The criminal analyst says a big part of the motif is power.

The suspect lived in Portugal for years, his house is close to the hotel (2.5km, 5 mins by car) and he raped an old woman nearby.

The suspect earned money as a waiter, handyman and drug dealer.

In his house there’s a beam to which they claim he tied a girl and forced her to perform oral sex.

He was very mobile, broke into holiday apartments, stole petrol.

The criminal analyst says he probably broke into the apartment (close to the street, convenient) to steal sth and the abduction was a crime of opportunity.

A mobile phone that almost certainly belonged to the suspect was used during the time of Maddie’s disappearance. The day after the kidnapping the suspect deregisters his car.

The rape case with the old woman was unsolved till last year. The suspect came past her house on his way to the beach. He used a scimitar and an iron rod It took 14 years to solve this, the police found a hair on a duvet.

The criminal analyst says it’s about power so kids and an elderly woman are both weak and therefore a target. The suspect acted in his comfort zone, near where he lived.

2007 the suspect moves back to Germany. In Augsburg he lives in an RV or sleeps in the attic of a friend’s house. He’s on the road a lot and deals with drugs.

He moves to Hanover and then to Braunschweig where he opens a kiosk. He’s selling meat that he stole in supermarkets in the area. People describe him as captivating and dominant. He has a girlfriend who is 16 years younger than him.

He did not treat women well, if they did not do what he wanted, he beat and even strangled them.

While he was in Portugal he had a lot of cash from a break-in. He bought an old factory near Magdeburg from that money. He also potentially drove a dark transporter van, there is no image of this van though.

In 2015 there was a collision with that dark van at a motorway service station in Germany, police was not involved. The next day 70km from there little Inga disappeared from a secluded group of houses (therapy centrum, her family was visiting another family) in a forest. Coincidence? Authorities are looking into this again now.

Witnesses saw a dark blue van that little Inga might have climbed into. The suspect’s dark van has never been seen.

2 months after Inga’s disappearance Braunschweig police sent a dossier to the Stendal police that include the suspect’s name.

Chat protocol talking about wanting to abuse a little one, documenting the abuse but also disposing of the evidence. And he wants deeds not words.

The suspect is in prison for drug dealing.
Thank you so much for doing this! I am very grateful.

From what you have translated for us here I understand more about his MO and my suspicions of him being potentially linked to other crimes against vulnerable women and girls.

It also gives clearer indications of his movements and the time frames.

Again thank you for taking time from your day to do this x
 
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Sara_M

VIP Member
I felt very sad this morning waking up to read that 'German Police have evidence that she is dead' this means something, they cannot say this with no evidence, can they?
I think what German authorities are saying needs broken down a bit and really looked at.

"After all the information we got, the girl is dead"
"We have no information that she is alive"
"All indication we have got that I cant tell you points in the direction that Madeline is dead."

This is all true! And it was true in 2007 so I think the german authorities can say this with confidence. However, look at the wording. They are not saying
"We have information that Christian murdered madeline". Just that "madeline is dead". It also obvious there's no information she is alive.
The cadaver dogs is evidence that "points the the direction that Madeline is dead."

I see nothing of substance in any of their statements.
 
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Thetruth123

VIP Member
Parents did 100% no changing my mind, they are in cahoots for some unknown reason with the powers that be!! They are both weirdos and come across so cold and clearly on edge in interviews!! The new suspect is a distraction!! 😡😡
 
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birdiefly246

VIP Member
I presume there are legal orders in place.
Some celebrities can ask for a blank out of their children's faces. I would think that given the McCann's aren't 'celebrities' it would have been fairly easy to secure this under a protection of minors order. The same as siblings of other high profile murder cases. Holly and Jessica, Sarah Payne etc.
I'm pretty sure with kids you have to confirm that they're allowed to be pictured by means of selling rights. When a member of one direction had his baby, at the time there was a huge conspiracy theory about the baby not actually being his and that the baby was actually a stunt by the managment. One of the reasons for that was that the press pictures showed the baby's face which meant someone sold the rights to picture being allowed essentially. The same tabloid picture where the baby's face is shown, the member of 1D's younger siblings were in it (about 3yo at the time) and their faces were blurred.

(yes the 1D fans are wild okay... just let us have it :ROFLMAO:)

You really need to take all of what is said in mainstream media with a pinch of salt. Actually, a shovel. Please remember the person feeding them the headlines is a pro political media expert, supported by lawyers with media connections to certain multinational media groups. You will only get the side of the story that has been the go to narrative from day one.

They have supposedly had investigators looking for her, please look into the type of people they have had 'searching' for their daughter whom they are convinced is missing and alive. After less than a week they were setting up a fund for legal fees, now why would you do that if you were convinced your daughter could be found alive and potentially could have been at that point?

The case they used to try and discredit the dogs, the guy ended up confessing the dogs were in fact right and he had murdered his wife 20 odd years prior. So after that didnt work they tried to blame the handler, no wait ut was because kate was in contact with dead bodies before she went on holiday... but wait she took her daughters comforter in her bag when she visited all of these dead bodies 🙄 gerry had to go home to get a sample of maddie's dna because there was not enough trace of her in the flat. There is no accurate account of what happened on the day she went missing. Grown adult professionals can't remember why they did this, when..... but David payne remembers the last time he saw all three kids they looked so well cared for, so happy and mostly in white.... really?

I am not surprised so many believe the abduction narrative, if you only read mainstream media and watch the netflix doc you are bound to. Even the despatches program on ch 4 a couple of years after was so telling but there is much more if you care to look.
That I never understood. How was there no DNA of her in the flat??? What about her bed she'd slept on for days? Her suitcase? a hairbrush? I just don't understand it. Especially when you think that child sexual abuse cases that happen within the family home are hard to prove because there's DNA of the victim and the perpetrator from just living there.

I also don't get the dog thing. Those dogs are specially trained, and people are like yes but they use pigs blood to do that. Well if that was the case then they'd never find any human blood ever would they but they did. No one has ever questioned sniffer dogs before the McCann's came around and decided that it couldn't be right all of a sudden.
 
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Sara_M

VIP Member
If they had evidence, he would be charged. Any of us can say "I know what happened. Shes dead." Doesnt mean we killed her.
People in prison confess to stuff all the time. Some do it because they enjoy messing with people. Some do it for notoriety.
Pick apart what these articles are saying. Theres nothing of any actual substance.
This is probably Clarence Mitchell at work. Keeping the Mccanns in the headlines and the spotlight on someone else.
Remember this man isnt a new suspect. This man has been known for YEARS.
 
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Savewaterdrinkgin

Chatty Member
My theory on the toothbrush is that they didn’t share but maddies was used as part of the clean up so as they couldn’t provide it they lied. Same for the clothes, an almost 4 year old isn’t going to fit into the same sandals and outfits as a 2 year old half her size.
 
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birdiefly246

VIP Member
They're saying it was a crooked employee at the hotel let him know the McCann's apartment would be unlocked .They used to tip him off so he could burgle the apartment's while the guest's ate at the restaurant..
Not to be controversial (again) but I find that hard to believe. We've not heard any stories of people being burgled whilst on holiday there. Surely upon finding out the resort we'd have seen people come forward saying how they were burgled.
Not to mention, burglary of valuables is rather different to kidnapping a child.
 
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paigelemonade

VIP Member
None of my children’s teddies smell like them? My children don’t smell of anything 😂 is that weird?!
They probably do, but since it’s your children’s smell you’ve probably become nose blind to it. Sort of like when you step inside someone else’s house and smell their home if that makes sense? Also it’s not just the smell of cuddle cat but the fact it was Madeleine’s, like it seems pretty emotionally detached to wash one of the closest things to her, especially on holiday...
 
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