Lucy Letby Case #39

[Tofino]

This tweet didn’t age well

 

[gigilouxx]

I know it’s a buzz her defence has basically sealed her guilt but I can’t stop thinking about the parents. How must they feel, it’s pretty much just confirmed their beautiful babies have been murdered, and if by chance had they had a different nurse or been at a different hospital, those sweet little babas, the miracle triplets and the IVF babies that had been so desperately wanted, would still be here today.
It’s so so sad, I hope they have so much support

 

[F1Grid]

In fairness, they don’t mean much. Fred West apparently seemed like an affable enough man!

My nan had Shipman as a GP. He had a waiting list to register with him because of how nice he came across She initially thought he was innocent because he was a great source of valium and no murderer would give that out obviously

 

[LittleMy]

People are saying BM has given her a shit defence. I’m sorry but I disagree, I think he tried but she’s undone his work by taking the stand and throwing him and everyone else under the bus. Stupid cow has hung herself.

 

[Deeznutslol]

Who tf is putting innocent on the poll at this point? Like seriously reveal yourself coz I think you’re trolling.

 

[MmmB777]

me too! But my partner has even said ‘what will u read once this is over?!’ He’s right! I’ve never been interested in crime programmes, trials etc but this one has had my life tbh! Like we’ve said many times it’s mostly the utter disbelief that anyone could ever do this and the thought that I have to see it through to the end now and see those parents get justice, but I’ll miss u guys! I’ve really enjoyed reading everyone’s opinions and the different points of view and I’ve learnt so much too. It’s not over yet mind, come on BNE, you got this!

I hear you! Never followed a trial in this way before. I am so sorry that at times I’ve treated it as a personal thought dumping ground and I’m sorry I never learnt to write in paragraphs but I have been so very grateful to have discussed it with others feeling somehow strangely captured by this awful case too. I’ve had some lovely compliments regarding some of my rambles, honestly I read my posts back occasionally and they’re so garbled it’s embarrassing I read other people’s posts in awe at the way they’re seeing things and picking parts out! It’s been so, so insightful. Obviously we are all indebted to @Tofino for the incredible resource that is the wiki. All our experts in various fields too have been wonderful, thank you!
The NICU mums that have shared their stories you’re so brave! You’ve taught me how strong and special these tiny babes are
All the SEN mums giving out advice and supporting each other was beautiful too.
You fellas have all made me laugh so very much. The photoshops, the gifs, the wordplay- you’re a bunch of funny bastards no doubt about it.
We’ve shared an absolute bloody rollercoaster of a journey (who predicted me and @slingo16 being BFFs?) all the mic drop moments following along and now finally the end is in sight! No matter what our opinions were on this thread, or how often we’ve had to find some humour.. all of us have just wanted the right result for those precious babies and their families. I’m another with a soon to be seven year old, the exact date for one of the babies. It’s truly unfathomable to quantify the loss and the horror the families have endured. I can only hope they take some small comfort in knowing Letby has a lifetime of isolation and worse awaiting. She will die alone, hated and a laughing stock. When laws change and preventions are put in place, it’ll show that those little babies brought more good to this world than she ever could. A legacy they should never have had to leave but a legacy of good all the same.
There you go @DellaC found some words. Normal service resumed

 

[avabella]

So chaps and chapesses. I have heard all I needed to hear and I hereby declare that Lucy Letby is guilty in my mind. Avabella rests, no more questions your Tattlers.

 

[WatermelonSugar22]

I know it’s a buzz her defence has basically sealed her guilt but I can’t stop thinking about the parents. How must they feel, it’s pretty much just confirmed their beautiful babies have been murdered, and if by chance had they had a different nurse or been at a different hospital, those sweet little babas, the miracle triplets and the IVF babies that had been so desperately wanted, would still be here today.
It’s so so sad, I hope they have so much support

Absolutely. Those babies should all be schoolkids by now, learning to play football, drawing pictures in their grammar books, refusing to eat their peas, and being cheeky to their grandmas and being rewarded with chocolate biscuits. They should be having play dates with friends, climbing trees, and being told off for being on their iPads too long. It’s so unfair. Those poor wee kids. I hope they haunt Lucy’s dreams for the rest of her miserable days. She is inhuman.

 

[BearOnChair]

I actually think 1 defence witness looks worse than 0.
Looking forward to a powerful closing statement from BNE and a very quick jury deliberation.
Hope the parents of these poor babies get some peace and justice now.

 

[Lucyxxxx]

A personal favourite moment in these threads was the reference to Osama Bin Ladens kind face.

 

[PrincessPeach]

Hi all, I’m a long term lurker and one of those who’s been consistently voting ‘unsure’ in the polls. I wanted to hear her defence in full, see what other experts might say, and if there were other plausible explanations etc. I’m of the view that it’s the prosecution’s case to prove guilt rather than for the defence to prove innocence, at least that’s what I was always taught at uni etc. I have voted guilty for the first time today. In the absence of any evidence from the defence to refute the medical experts, I feel the case is proved. Those poor babies didn’t die of natural or unexplained causes and she is the common denominator with opportunity. Her own evidence sealed it for me, and the excellent job the prosecution did in pointing out the inconsistencies and lies which she couldn’t explain away.

 

[gigilouxx]

I can’t believe you can literally study your backside off for years and work like crazy to become a doctor or barrister yet some dole monkey off Facebook can tell you in 12 seconds how shit you are at your job, insanity

 

[MmmB777]

Mya Defencewasaplumber

 

[nosycowmoo]

Yano what, I’ve been glued to the case, I’ve been many times. We’ve been light hearted and almost tried to block out that actual babies died. And right now I think the enormity of it all hit me, I’m feeling so emotional about it all. There should be 8 seven year olds running around, there should be disabled children not disabled. My heart is broken. I’m about to go and watch my 6 year old at his sports day, he was looked after by nicu staff, I can’t help but feel guilty in some way that I get to do that. Those poor families. I just pray that she shows some remorse. She has none, she’s so narky and annoyed at being there, how dare they have realised and taken her to court. I just can’t begin to understand her..

 

[F1Grid]

I do think the point about it being a tactic not to call any other witnesses is a sound point and it is a tactic used.

It all goes to the fact that the huge majority of the evidence is circumstantial. There is no DNA type slam dunk conclusive evidence in this case. It's the prosecutions job to prove guilt not defence to prove innocent. I think there will be reference to this in BM's closing statement. I am even going so far as to say that I believe BM will reference in his closing that perhaps the jury might be wondering why he didn't call medical experts of his own. I may be wrong but that is my guess.

It boils down to this, factually/legally speaking there is no hard evidence. There are some of the charges were the evidence bar is not met. That's not to say she is innocent, but just statement of facts. There are definitely many, many indicators of guilt and general weirdness and deviancy.

I am quite sure he is going down this route to demonstrate that she shouldn't be convicted.

I believe she herself didn't want her parents to be character witnesses due to the effect it would have on them or alternatively she has many character witnesses (who have to give a paper statement) and the prosecution has said they don't want to cross examine any of them. This is also a tactic as it can present a defendant in too good a light. So the jury have the written statements in any event.

I hope we get the best level of reporting possible for the closing statements and directions etc

I am still hoping for a whole life order but when I consider the number of parents that have beaten newborn/very young babies to death and some that have done worse and beaten them to death, and none of them have a whole life order, I am not convinced she will get one. I hope I am wrong and in any event she dies in prison.

There absolutely is hard evidence. The insulin blood tests are some of the hardest evidence possible. Even LL herself accepts those are intentional poisonings, she simply says they weren't done by her.

There is also hard evidence of air lobules in the pathology specimens, air within the great vessels in radiographs, and extreme distension of the intestines with no evidence of NEC in pathology specimens of the bowel. The blood tests showing no evidence of infection are also hard evidence. The blood gases showing consistently low lactates prior to induced collapses are hard evidence. The signatures on the prescription sheets that it's LL who did those feeds prior to collapses are hard evidence. Her ID card swipes proving her location and the location of other nurses at the time of these collapses are hard evidence.

There's more hard evidence than people realise. Just because we don't have CCTV footage of her doing this doesn't mean there's no har evidence.

 

[tay65]

Plot twist, Tay is actually the plumber

If you mean me, no I'm not the plumber. My friend and me got to court for 11.20. the court didn't sit until 11.00 and I note CS started posting around 11.11 so I don't think we missed much. The witness was giving evidence when we arrived. He was an ordinary looking, straightforward man who answered questions about the plumbing problems and you've probably read the report on CS which I haven't yet read the full report. There hadn't been a lot of these problems on NICU as far as I could understand and I didn't feel his evidence changed my view of anything. At 12.00 noon the jury were discharged. At 2.30 they sat again without the jury and we went back. Discussion took place about the judge's summing up. Both BM and BNE talked to the judge about things they believe he should and shouldn't include in the direction he should give to the jury and the judge is now going to prepare this. There were one or two (very polite) disagreements about things but we'll have to see what happens. As I mentioned before I have some hearing problems and whilst I could hear well am, pm I struggled because my device stopped working which was working earlier. I could hear BM quite well as he was louder and clearer but I really struggled hearing BNE as his voice wasn't as loud. My friend tried to fill me in after about the things I hadn't been able to hear. They will resume tomorrow for discussions at 10 without the jury and the jury will come at 12. My friend told me the judge said (although I didn't manage to hear this) he has to leave early so tomorrow doesn't sound like it will be a long court session. It was really weird seeing LL sat up there (it seemed a really lonely place). I was amazed at all the police in the room with laptops as there were a lot. There was a young man next to me who I thought might have been FB James. It was also strange hearing some babies names mentioned this afternoon as I'm used to them being discussed by letters. We would like to be able to go again one day next week but I could do with trying to get the hearing device working. I think I need to pay a visit to Specsavers where I got them from to see if they can help. I arrived home about 7 pm have had some food and now need to water the plants in the garden. I can see there have been a lot of pages posted since I looked earlier today so will catch up on the reading later in bed. I'm glad I went today even though it's probably not been as interesting as last week.

 

[cazesg]

I’ve been following this thread since the beginning, haven’t felt the need to post because you’ve all covered everything so well.

I’ve been sure of her guilt for a good while but was worried a medical expert could be called and cast enough doubt in the jury members minds to not secure a guilty verdict.

Feeling super emotional right now. She’s going to prison isn’t she?

 

[LittleMy]

Don’t these people realise that he couldn’t stop her taking the stand if she wanted to? Also if they didn’t have anymore witnesses (except for Lorenzo) to begin with, taking the stand was probably her only option.

 

[F1Grid]

A personal favourite moment in these threads was the reference to Osama Bin Ladens kind face.

"He's a scapegoat, I can tell from his kind eyes" - Someone on FB, probably

 

[F1Grid]

These people are allowed to vote.