Lucy Letby Case #18

[DianaBanana]

The nurse said that everything SHOULD be changed after the line tissued. As in that’s the correct procedure/best practice.

But we don’t know if that’s specifically what happened at this time because the documentation/notes/this hospital are so bad. I just hope it’s clearer in court.

 

[Tofino]

So the stock bag was put in place at 10am?

It needed to be left out 4 hours before that to warm up to a comfortable level so was taken out and put aside at 6am?

What time did Letby’s shift end?

she knew what the blood readings were at 8am as she told her colleague so at least that late. Also spotted Dr Gibbs had been so who knows what was discussed about TPN bags then.

 

[raspberryjuice]

I do think there was a stock bag used by the way as even prosecution refer to it.

I just think that even if she couldn’t have known they would use it, it’s not a reach to think she could have tampered with one just incase they did. She would have known baby would continue to have low blood sugar and that doctors may have suggested to change TPN bag.

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Does this clarify that they believe BOTH bags are contaminated?

 

[stardust1]

Am I right in thinking that I’ve read somewhere - that when a bag is being taken out to be used, it is squeezed/checked for damage to the bag? That would show a leak? Or would anything injected be done through a port?

isn’t that how that one at Stepping Hill was caught because it was leaking on the floors? X

 

[IdeletedbutI'mbackagain]

she knew what the blood readings were at 8am as she told her colleague so at least that late. Also spotted Dr Gibbs had been so who knows what was discussed about TPN bags then.


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tit sorry I deleted my post because I wasn't sure I had grasped the content of your post properly and I didn't want to cause any confusion!!

Thanks for the reply though!

I think the stock bag was actually put in place at 1.54am

It needed to be left out 4 hours before that to warm up to a comfortable level so was taken out and put aside at 10pm?

What time did Letby’s shift end?

 

[Tofino]

Does this clarify that they believe BOTH bags are contaminated?

It’s very strongly suggested but it’s not as explicit as
‘Do you think both bags were contaminated’
‘Yes’

I don’t remember myers asking it outright either, need to go back and check.

 

[stardust1]

Totally wild theory but IF both bags were contaminated could you work out which bag in the fridge/cupboard to poison based on process of elimination so that you knew which one they’d pick. For example working out that baby X and Y are going to run out first and get the first 2 bags so poison the 3rd bag ready to get Z.

Because wouldn’t everyone jusy pick out which bag was at the front? You wouldn’t just go for the 6th bag in there.

 

[IdeletedbutI'mbackagain]

My head hurts again!!

 

[abelleza]

isn’t that how that one at Stepping Hill was caught because it was leaking on the floors? X

No it’s because another nurse noted that the contents of the bags in stock on the ward didn’t look right. They wouldn’t leak if something was injected through the self-sealing injection port, only if it was injected through the bag itself, which no-one would do as they’d the leak, revealing that they’d been tampered with.

 

[stardust1]

No it’s because another nurse noted that the contents of the bags in stock on the ward didn’t look right. They wouldn’t leak if something was injected through the self-sealing injection port, only if it was injected through the bag itself, which no-one would do as they’d the leak, revealing that they’d been tampered with.

Thanks, I am sure I read something about a nurse noting there was fluid all over the stock room. I will go back and see if I can find it.

 

[Tofino]

tit sorry I deleted my post because I wasn't sure I had grasped the content of your post properly and I didn't want to cause any confusion!!

Thanks for the reply though!

I think the stock bag was actually put in place at 1.54am

It needed to be left out 4 hours before that to warm up to a comfortable level so was taken out and put aside at 10pm?

What time did Letby’s shift end?

It was sometime between 10am and 2pm as the blood sugars improved when baby was taken off TPN at 10am but worsened again by 2pm. The 2.4 reading was at 12pm but I think prof Hindmarsh said it can take 25mins to have its biggest effect

 

[swoopyloopy]

I think she was trying to move the spotlight off herself. At this point lots of her colleagues were pointing out how she was having a bad run plus there was the thing with one of the doctors. I think people were starting to suspect her and she knew it. My theory is that she contaminated a couple of bags in the hope that they would get used over the next few days and move the spotlight onto someone else.
I’d love to see her rota, I wonder if she was off duty for a few days and therefore planning to have a baby deteriorate while she was nowhere near the place.

 

[stardust1]

@abelleza can’t find the original article but it was same as this one except it included about it leaking on the floor and having an odour

 

[candyland_]

I’ve read back over the prosecution’s opening statement about Baby F on The Standard.

Baby F had TPN delivered at 4pm
Letby hung the bag at 12:30am

The next day doctor instructed the nursing staff to stop the TPN via the longline and provide dextrose and move the TPN to a peripheral line while a new long line was put in. All fluids were interrupted at 11am while a new long line was put in.

Notice there was no mention of providing a new bag at this point? However a new bespoke bag was delivered at 4pm. He was then taken off TPN at 6pm and began to improve with no further problems.

I think the first TPN bag was transferred over to the new line, the new line got contaminated and that’s why his problems continued after having a new bag delivered later in the afternoon.

 

[Blockedbyadmin]

The nurse said that everything SHOULD be changed after the line tissued. As in that’s the correct procedure/best practice.

But we don’t know if that’s specifically what happened at this time because the documentation/notes/this hospital are so bad. I just hope it’s clearer in court.

I was thinking about the lines last night. On itu we label the lines as when they went up and sign on it as they should be changed every 24 hours esp if it’s a syringe pump or background fluids etc. things like antibiotics, blood and obvs tpnshould All have new lines each time and be documented as such

 

[IGiveUp22]

I’ve read back over the prosecution’s opening statement about Baby F on The Standard.

Baby F had TPN delivered at 4pm
Letby hung the bag at 12:30am

The next day doctor instructed the nursing staff to stop the TPN via the longline and provide dextrose and move the TPN to a peripheral line while a new long line was put in. All fluids were interrupted at 11am while a new long line was put in.

Notice there was no mention of providing a new bag at this point? However a new bespoke bag was delivered at 4pm. He was then taken off TPN at 6pm and began to improve with no further problems.

I think the first TPN bag was transferred over to the new line, the new line got contaminated and that’s why his problems continued after having a new bag delivered later in the afternoon.

This is what I remember reading - them changing things but using the same bag hence the contamination. I knew I’d seen it somewhere haha I know that the evidence friday seems to confuse that so hopefully on Monday it will be clearer

 

[LittleMy]

I know it’s been said before but the reporting has been dismal. I guess as long as the jury are getting the full picture then it doesn’t really matter that we don’t, it’s just frustrating when you’re trying to follow along.

Hope everyone’s had a nice weekend and the weight of the trial hasn’t been too heavy on peoples’ minds. Praying that justice will be served for the babies and their families.

 

[Lucyxxxx]

At first I was very skeptical of professionals 'thinking things in hindsight' but then I thought. When my baby was born there was a few little things I noticed but just put it down to quirks/him being born early and small. Turns out he has mild cerebal palsy and didn't show any obvious signs until he was 6/7 months old. Now when I look back the signs were there albeit subtley from birth but I wasn't thinking about or looking for CP so it never occurred to me. Am I making sense???

 

[IdeletedbutI'mbackagain]

It was sometime between 10am and 2pm as the blood sugars improved when baby was taken off TPN at 10am but worsened again by 2pm. The 2.4 reading was at 12pm but I think prof Hindmarsh said it can take 25mins to have its biggest effect

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Thank you again for your reply. I think I understand more now but going to leave it again until Monday cause I just feel if I ask any more questions I might just confuse myself again.

Until Monday, when hopefully things are clearer!!

 

[housebythesea]

Well that clears that up then she could have quite easily contaminated all three bags for baby f at once ! Thanks candyland

I don't think it does. The bags would be made up as required, so there wouldn't have been three sitting there waiting to be used.